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A counter point to AMD not being good for mid-high end - Page 14

post #131 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

According to AMD's road-map, AMD sees no reason to keep up with the attempts of facing Intel on the high end. Taking the few very specific situations out, AMD processors can't keep up on the technological aspect. AMD has nothing to take the likes of 4770k head on (excluding the few limited cases again). That's not even the best Intel has to offer, with 4930k being on a whole different level.
Reducing the selling price and hoping for the best doesn't really cut it, AMD knows that so they step out and focus on the department they can compete. There's a reason why their short term feature plans have nothing related to the high end department.


At least the situation is currently fine for the end users. Prices are competitive, many older processors still perform adequately and there's a wide range of choices able to satisfy everyone's needs (but not everyone's "wants" assuming that everyone wants the best there is at ridiculously low price).
Of course Intel already started becoming greedy, by introducing the "new" Devil's Canyon processors for enthusiasts that use the same haswell micro-architecture... one year later than the initial launch.

Don't forget that this used to be a common practice for AMD as well. Remember the FX-57? It came out almost a year after the FX-55, but was based on the exact same architecture as the FX-55, albeit with a small 200 MHz clock speed boost. And of course AMD had no problems bumping the price as well, to $1031 for the FX-57.
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post #132 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by 996gt2 View Post

You're telling him not to make too many assumptions, but your entire argument has the same issues. Basically, what you are saying rests on HSA being 1) widely adopted by developers and 2) actually providing a tangible performance gain it actually provides in the production parts. Both of those things are huge assumptions.

In any case, it could be many years before HSA compatible software is widely available, and that's assuming it becomes widely supported by developers. Your argument reminds me of the arguments people were throwing around before Bulldozer came out; namely, that Bulldozer would kill anything Intel had at the time performance-wise. Obviously we saw how that turned out.
I am being rational and holding off on final assumptions which was the point you bolded of mine. Gotta love all the Intel fan club that does little more than spurn possibility and seed more negativity. Fact HSA is very powerful and not likely going to die. See their website and all the mobile that supports it.
post #133 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by 996gt2 View Post

You're telling him not to make too many assumptions, but your entire argument has the same issues. Basically, what you are saying rests on HSA being 1) widely adopted by developers and 2) actually providing a tangible performance gain it actually provides in the production parts. Both of those things are huge assumptions.

In any case, it could be many years before HSA compatible software is widely available, and that's assuming it becomes widely supported by developers. Your argument reminds me of the arguments people were throwing around before Bulldozer came out; namely, that Bulldozer would kill anything Intel had at the time performance-wise. Obviously we saw how that turned out.
I am being rational and holding off on final assumptions which was the point you bolded of mine. Gotta love all the Intel fan club that does little more than spurn possibility and seed more negativity. Fact HSA is very powerful and not likely going to die. See their website and all the mobile that supports it.

I think your assumption of HSA's success is one of the biggest assumptions in this entire thread. The computing advantage provided by HSA is only a small determinant in whether it will be successful in the end. If developers don't support it, it won't be successful. Simple as that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stay Puft View Post

Unless Intel adopts HSA its not going anywhere
keep telling yourself that. Whatever helps you sleep at night.

I'm going to quote this and revisit this thread in about 2 years once it has been established that HSA adoption hasn't been anywhere near as optimistic as you were expecting thumb.gif
Edited by 996gt2 - 3/24/14 at 5:56am
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post #134 of 355
Road-maps are not "assumptions", it's what whole companies use to decide what to do and when. The whole industry relies on road-maps. The only assumptions you can make about road-maps are the dates, nothing else.

When AMD officially tells you that they don't plan to do something, they won't.

Everything else I wrote is what currently happens. You can't assume about something happening if it already happened.
post #135 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

Road-maps are not "assumptions", it's what whole companies use to decide what to do and when. The whole industry relies on road-maps. The only assumptions you can make about road-maps are the dates, nothing else.

When AMD officially tells you that they don't plan to do something, they won't.

Everything else I wrote is what currently happens. You can't assume about something happening if it already happened.
And roadmaps change, alot. So basing any outcome on those is an assumption that they will not.
post #136 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

And roadmaps change, alot. So basing any outcome on those is an assumption that they will not.

Let me put it this way. When was the last time you saw something written on an official Intel or AMD road-map but in the end didn't happen?
post #137 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by 996gt2 View Post

I think your assumption of HSA's success is one of the biggest assumptions in this entire thread. The computing advantage provided by HSA is only a small determinant in whether it will be successful in the end. If developers don't support it, it won't be successful. Simple as that.
I'm going to quote this and revisit this thread in about 2 years once it has been established that HSA adoption hasn't been anywhere near as optimistic as you were expecting thumb.gif
You act as if this is AMD against Intel, its really Intel against everyone else. HSA isn't like instruction sets so adoption rate will be based on a higher probability, more than just likely. And that mobile market is alot of power behind HSA implementation.
post #138 of 355
Hsa is too early in development to have any impact on cpu choice. No one should buy a cpu based on what developers might do. I need my systems to work for all my needs today.

I just wish amd offered something that wasnt so weak on the single core side. Even if it uses more power than an Intel.

Intel offers cpus that are well rounded without any major weakness even in areas it looses to an amd its not by much.

I studied and debating a long time before moving from fx6300 to 4670k. I was setup with a 990 mobo already. It would have saved me a lot of money. In the end I felt like even though the 8 cores are stronger than 6 that the same weakness would show up.

I have always prefferd amd cpus. After moving to sli and seeing a 5ghz fx6300 have huge fps dips I just could not justify another amd cpu for that rig. Most games dnt even use 4cores much less can use 8.
Edited by Wirerat - 3/24/14 at 6:35am
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post #139 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by damric View Post

Steam reads mine accurately even my overclock. So that must put me over the top 99% already with this Athlon thumb.gif

Intriguing. For me it seems to report something close to stock clock.
Created with GIMP

As far as AMD vs Intel goes then for all practical purposes there is no difference in my experience. Went from AMD 1055T to Intel i7-3820 (because of quad RAM, not bcos of one brand vs another) and while the numbers in benches are better for Intel for all practical purposes the system feel just the same. I just have 64 GB of RAM with Intel and that was the main reason to go for it for me.
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post #140 of 355
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniflex View Post

As far as AMD vs Intel goes then for all practical purposes there is no difference in my experience. Went from AMD 1055T to Intel i7-3820 (because of quad RAM, not bcos of one brand vs another) and while the numbers in benches are better for Intel for all practical purposes the system feel just the same. I just have 64 GB of RAM with Intel and that was the main reason to go for it for me.

To be quite honest I can't tell a difference between the dual-core i5 in my laptop and the heavily overclocked i7 in my desktop in daily use, such as web browsing.

However, as soon as I do something CPU intensive, I can immediately notice the difference that the i7 makes. Even something as simple as printing a long PDF into MS OneNote is much quicker on the i7. Video encoding/conversion and photoshop filters also run noticeably quicker on the i7. Both systems have fast SSDs and lots of RAM , so the CPU is the main difference.
Edited by 996gt2 - 3/24/14 at 8:39am
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