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[ExtremeTech] AMD’s next-gen Carrizo APU features leaked, shows greater focus on power efficiency - Page 6

post #51 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by firagabird View Post

You've been mentioning the GPUs becoming a replacement for the floating point unit of the CPU cores for a while now. Where did you get this information from that AMD are doing this with their APUs? I'm asking because I've been looking for such info for a while now, and the only times I've seen mention of FPU being replaced with GPU is from forum members, both here and in others.

The iGPU will be a supplement. There are some code that inherently run faster on a CPU FPU, while other code runs inherently faster on the iGPU. What HSA is supposed to do is divide the workload such that maximum performance is achieved without any special programming necessary from the developer. That's the key point right there, how easy it is for developers to utilize the performance enhancement features. If it takes too much work, few are going to use it. If it takes little to no effort, they'll use it because why wouldn't you want to maximize performance at little to no cost.
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post #52 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsa700 View Post

Doesn't that kind of make my point?

Not really because ARM really wanted this partnership and AMD turned them down the first times around. AMD's APUs have the best onboard graphics which gives more performance to casual gamers and newbie designers versus Intel/Intel & Nvidia variants which are intensely slow or horrendously expensive. AMD does all this whilst being affordable. They are trying to get into the server market with ARM etc. I really do not see any of your reasoning for ARM being a competitor in any major fashion. Intel i understand even if they do lack sometimes. ARM makes no sense. I'm just waiting for AMD to release a very nice and powerful yet cheap notebook/tablet for me to use for creative things and basic gaming such as LoL, etc.
post #53 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redwoodz View Post

What about AMD's investment with Hynix in HBM DDR3? Early testing shows the bandwith of up to 128GB/s. Far greater than DDR4. There is too much we do not know to assume the worst.

The problem is that HBM would need to be embedded on the chip or on the motherboard. HBM is more likely to show up on the next generation of GPUs. I have seen no indication that it is has any relevance to the APU market in the foreseeable future.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLAWNOOB View Post

Well this is really throwing me off. Can't find an A8 Kaveri anywhere in Canada.

Probably because only the A10 Kaveri is currently on the only chips market.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

What happened to the time everyone was making fun of AMD for 'MOAR COREZ!!" Hypocritical enthusiast community rolleyes.gif

AMD needs stronger single cores, or something to mitigate their single core performance weakness, and more cores is not the answer.

The chip is sacrificing performance for power consumption...
Edited by Slomo4shO - 3/24/14 at 12:06pm
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post #54 of 70
AMD needs efficient, strong individual cores. Or develop a way of multithreading existing single-threaded code (near impossible). And we won't know anything about performance until the chip is released (or at least until leaks happen), so there's no way you can say that for sure.

More efficient cores would mean higher overclocking possibility on air and maybe water, but lower exotic overclocking (phase change, LN2, etc).
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post #55 of 70
Well if anyone's ditching AMD's APU, \|/ biggrin.gif
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post #56 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by assaulth3ro911 View Post

Not really because ARM really wanted this partnership and AMD turned them down the first times around. AMD's APUs have the best onboard graphics which gives more performance to casual gamers and newbie designers versus Intel/Intel & Nvidia variants which are intensely slow or horrendously expensive. AMD does all this whilst being affordable. They are trying to get into the server market with ARM etc. I really do not see any of your reasoning for ARM being a competitor in any major fashion. Intel i understand even if they do lack sometimes. ARM makes no sense. I'm just waiting for AMD to release a very nice and powerful yet cheap notebook/tablet for me to use for creative things and basic gaming such as LoL, etc.

AMD's opportunities are getting fewer and fewer. They have all but lost the middle and high end markets. The last good cpu AMD delivered was the PII 1100T. (Opinion I know) What is not opinion though is that AMD will have more and more trouble trying to compete against Intel as they relentlessly march towards smaller and smaller (14nm) process sizes.

At this point, if Intel were to unlock the multiplier on their low end chips.........

AMD chips use more power at a given performance level than Intel, and ARM just smokes them in this regard. The advantage AMD has with their superior GPU tech will soon be gone as Intel is basically doubling their own GPU power every new generation now on the middle and high end, while embedded GPU tech like Adreno will eat the bottom.

HSA, while a great idea, isn't going to solve these market problems any time soon for AMD.
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post #57 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by firagabird View Post

You've been mentioning the GPUs becoming a replacement for the floating point unit of the CPU cores for a while now. Where did you get this information from that AMD are doing this with their APUs? I'm asking because I've been looking for such info for a while now, and the only times I've seen mention of FPU being replaced with GPU is from forum members, both here and in others.
pre-anticipation it is what would make most sense and that is HSA on a hardware level as deep as possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NaroonGTX View Post

It was never confirmed because it's not gonna happen. The integration of the CPU and GPU compute units will become more intimate over time, yes, but the CPU will keep it's own floating point calculator since some floating point ops are better suited for the CPU than a traditional GPU.
It would replace the fpu saving die space for something that already has to have that capability anyways. It sounds like a major win if you ask me. But I can't predict the future that has been proven many times before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsa700 View Post

AMD's opportunities are getting fewer and fewer. They have all but lost the middle and high end markets. The last good cpu AMD delivered was the PII 1100T. (Opinion I know) What is not opinion though is that AMD will have more and more trouble trying to compete against Intel as they relentlessly march towards smaller and smaller (14nm) process sizes.

At this point, if Intel were to unlock the multiplier on their low end chips.........

AMD chips use more power at a given performance level than Intel, and ARM just smokes them in this regard. The advantage AMD has with their superior GPU tech will soon be gone as Intel is basically doubling their own GPU power every new generation now on the middle and high end, while embedded GPU tech like Adreno will eat the bottom.

HSA, while a great idea, isn't going to solve these market problems any time soon for AMD.
HDL will yield a full node shrink and so will 16nm with finfets so nodes Intel isn't that much ahead 2 nodes as they have been since they bribed AMD out of the market.

Actually Kaveri scales down extremely well so that it more than halves power consumption going from 4 to 3GHz also Kaveri completely stomps Intel's offerings in performance per watt overal. Granted that is Iris Pro based haswell chips against Kaveri.
47W loses in graphics from a 35W chip to be fair it loses in cpu tasks almost all the time but anybody actually using a notebook for extended periods of time and I can speak for myself here:
It stinks to be stuck with Intel Integrated and I'd rather have an SDD + weaker cpu and a good gpu than the other way around. On desktop I'd want both but on the go I just want both good enough to manage.

But Intel can't touch AMD now and won't be able to do so in the future Iris Pro's only power is in L4 which fails at high resolutions. Kaveri would be 40% faster if not bottlenecked. (DDR3 vs GDDR5 difference) and even more for the 512SP models. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)



What you have seen about Kaveri is AMD's own fault for sending out boards that consume a lot more than neccesary under load which makes that 30W difference. Gigabyte makes some crappy boards
http://nl.hardware.info/reviews/4842/4/gigabyte-g1sniper-a88x-review-amd-bord-voorbereid-op-kaveri-stroomverbruik
Edited by maarten12100 - 3/24/14 at 6:25pm
post #58 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

pre-anticipation it is what would make most sense and that is HSA on a hardware level as deep as possible.
It would replace the fpu saving die space for something that already has to have that capability anyways. It sounds like a major win if you ask me. But I can't predict the future that has been proven many times before.
HDL will yield a full node shrink and so will 16nm with finfets so nodes Intel isn't that much ahead 2 nodes as they have been since they bribed AMD out of the market.

Actually Kaveri scales down extremely well so that it more than halves power consumption going from 4 to 3GHz also Kaveri completely stomps Intel's offerings in performance per watt overal. Granted that is Iris Pro based haswell chips against Kaveri.
47W loses in graphics from a 35W chip to be fair it loses in cpu tasks almost all the time but anybody actually using a notebook for extended periods of time and I can speak for myself here:
It stinks to be stuck with Intel Integrated and I'd rather have an SDD + weaker cpu and a good gpu than the other way around. On desktop I'd want both but on the go I just want both good enough to manage.

But Intel can't touch AMD now and won't be able to do so in the future Iris Pro's only power is in L4 which fails at high resolutions. Kaveri would be 40% faster if not bottlenecked. (DDR3 vs GDDR5 difference) and even more for the 512SP models. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)



What you have seen about Kaveri is AMD's own fault for sending out boards that consume a lot more than neccesary under load which makes that 30W difference. Gigabyte makes some crappy boards
http://nl.hardware.info/reviews/4842/4/gigabyte-g1sniper-a88x-review-amd-bord-voorbereid-op-kaveri-stroomverbruik
Thank you for that Pic again, I should have saved it before. I can use it nearly 50 times a day on here. biggrin.gif
post #59 of 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

pre-anticipation it is what would make most sense and that is HSA on a hardware level as deep as possible.
It would replace the fpu saving die space for something that already has to have that capability anyways. It sounds like a major win if you ask me. But I can't predict the future that has been proven many times before.
HDL will yield a full node shrink and so will 16nm with finfets so nodes Intel isn't that much ahead 2 nodes as they have been since they bribed AMD out of the market.

Actually Kaveri scales down extremely well so that it more than halves power consumption going from 4 to 3GHz also Kaveri completely stomps Intel's offerings in performance per watt overal. Granted that is Iris Pro based haswell chips against Kaveri.
47W loses in graphics from a 35W chip to be fair it loses in cpu tasks almost all the time but anybody actually using a notebook for extended periods of time and I can speak for myself here:
It stinks to be stuck with Intel Integrated and I'd rather have an SDD + weaker cpu and a good gpu than the other way around. On desktop I'd want both but on the go I just want both good enough to manage.

But Intel can't touch AMD now and won't be able to do so in the future Iris Pro's only power is in L4 which fails at high resolutions. Kaveri would be 40% faster if not bottlenecked. (DDR3 vs GDDR5 difference) and even more for the 512SP models. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)



What you have seen about Kaveri is AMD's own fault for sending out boards that consume a lot more than neccesary under load which makes that 30W difference. Gigabyte makes some crappy boards
http://nl.hardware.info/reviews/4842/4/gigabyte-g1sniper-a88x-review-amd-bord-voorbereid-op-kaveri-stroomverbruik

You've been touting Kaveri's impressive power scaling for a while, and yet we haven't had news of mobile Kaveri in months
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post #60 of 70
I thought Kaveri mobile was always supposed to come around May/early June just like trinity ('12)and richland ('13).
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