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[pcper] NVIDIA Talks DX12, DX11 Efficiency Improvements - Page 18

post #171 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by omari79 View Post

couldn't care less about DX12 right now..Nvidia's next driver update can't come soon enough tongue.gif

It is going to be hilarious when when people discover that the main deliverance of this upcoming patch are minor DX tweaks and and major optimization for Thief and Star Swarm... I guess time will tell biggrin.gif
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post #172 of 203

Funny how the scale of the graph changes on that last slide to make a few fps look like a massive difference. :p

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post #173 of 203
Might help with 3Dmark 11 an 3Dmark 13 benching i hope.
post #174 of 203
only for high end cards ? i hope not !
post #175 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

Considering that the bench is about CPU bottlenecks, do you really think you are illustrating the benefits of Mantle by running these benches on an overclocked 4770k?

Mantle's (or OpenGL's or DX12's) "CPU" benefits is a simplification for the masses.

It goes THROUGH the CPU benefits but it also helps the overall performance.

It's related to complex things like locking up the whole "chain reaction" of the API by doing inefficient calls on the system side(when doing the wrong thing), rather than simplifying it while at the same time using more the VRAM/GPU (with the new methods).

If you are more interested: *WARNING: VERY NERDY STUFF, see this video with NV, AMD, and Intel discussing those "CPU relaxation" methods on the perspective of OpenGL:
http://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2014/03/20/opengl-gdc2014/


Let me stress this enough: A faster CPU will NOT negate all the benefits of those methods. Part of it is completely unrelated to the power of the CPU after a point, because the GPU may still have higher load without the new methods.

There is some evidence that some load may be transferred to the GPU sometimes, but in any case, the situation is not clear cut, it does not just "lower CPU load".


In addition, it may be related to latency. i.e. even if your GPU gets higher load and even if your CPU is a monster to still get higher performance because simply the latency between GPU and CPUs is insane. That is the same reason we need VRAM on the card (and not on the system).
(the PCI-E bus is multiple times slower than the slowest VRAMs around).
Edited by fateswarm - 3/24/14 at 5:37pm
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post #176 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by fateswarm View Post

Let me stress this enough: A faster CPU will NOT negate all the benefits of those methods. Part of it is completely unrelated to the power of the CPU after a point, because the GPU may still have higher load without it.

A high end GPU + CPU performance yields are 5-10% as observed by the plethora of Mantel benchmarks... Running a benchmark and then suggesting that mantle yields only 8% gains over "optimized" DX11 seems exactly in line with expectations...
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post #177 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

A high end GPU + CPU performance yields are 5-10% as observed by the plethora of Mantel benchmarks... Running a benchmark and then suggesting that mantle yields only 8% gains over "optimized" DX11 seems exactly in line with expectations...

By the way, I would be very cautious of examples of real applications at the moment. Those are VERY novel methods. In the overwhelming majority of cases they are applied suboptimally or partially.

This is very apparent since the very developers of APIs are still trying to optimize their own examples of efficient use on those methods when they are talking to graphics developers.

They run millions of simulations to see if a line of code would be a benefit because the GPUs are interconnected in a way you can not easily predict what one piece of the puzzle will do to the whole picture if moved only slightly.
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post #178 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by fateswarm View Post

By the way, I would be very cautious of examples of real applications at the moment.

You mean like the ones discussed in this thread ad nauseam?
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post #179 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by sasuke256 View Post

only for high end cards ? i hope not !

It is supposed to be more about the CPU than the GPU...

If these are system wide gains we should be able to measure performance gains in games like Arma. I literally have to run arma 3 @ the max "res scale" to get smooth game play. Something about that is just broken in my mind.

some how I feel like we may see optimized profiles for just thief/star swarm, which is silly tbh, as thief doesn't take a super computer to run, & Star Swarm is made to break DX11.
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post #180 of 203
The way I see it this is Nvidia clinging to DX11 as if it doesn't have the major flaws in cpu utility. And the reason I think they do this is because they will be stuck for 2 years unless OpenGL miraculously picks up or they join Mantle.

DX12 is 1 3/4 years from commercial availability
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