Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Water Cooling › Another radspace question.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Another radspace question. - Page 3

post #21 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpecialEdT View Post

EK-FC Bridge should work still though, and you don't need to get the CSQ ones.
I think the issue you have is that the 1st and 2nd GPU are spaced farther than the 2nd and 3rd GPU? If so they got this for the Z77 which should still work for you: http://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc-bridge-triple-serial-z77-csq.html

The link to the bridge even has CSQ in it...
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post

2. Here's a step by step based upon test results available on Martinsliquidlab site

http://www.overclock.net/t/1457426/radiator-size-estimator

5. Is noise imprtant to you..... if it is, you won't be using anything faster than 200 rpm fans and likely running them at 850 rpm max.

6. Rad thickness does basically squat..... looks cool but really doesn't do the job. Proof is in the pudding:

ST30-360 - 30mm thick - 219 watts @ 1250 rpm
XT45-360 - 45mm thick - 222 watts
UT60- 360 - 60 mm thick - 227 watts
Monsta - 360 - 86mm thick - 239 watts

So doubling ya rad thickness from 30 to 60 gets ya a whopping 3.6% increase in cooling

Each 780 Ti is going to draw about 300 watts overclocked about 25%....a LGA 2011 OC'd CPU about 230....add 40 watts for the MoBo of cooling that, 20-40 for the pump, 3-5 for each RAM stick. For arguments sake:

MoBo Block = 20 watts (VRM only)
780 Ti = 300 watts x 3
LGA 2011 CPU = 230 watts
Swiftech 35X2 = 40 watts

That's 1190 say 1200 watts.

Assuming 60% of that actually gets handled by the rads (rest lost to to inactivity ... everything not peaking at once, tubing, res, shrouds all radiate heat) leaves ya with 720 watts.

Let's assume:

XT45-420 @ 1650 rpm in push / pull = 391 watts in top of case
Monsta-360 @ 1650 rpm in push / pull = 383 watts in bottom of case

That's 774 watts which should leave ya with a theoretical Delta T of 9.3C. Now I should correlate that with my on direct experience on my last build. I have twin 780s and a 4770k, 35x2 and MoBo block. My theoretical Delta T was 11.3C. I wound up with 8.4C with fan filters removed and 12.8 with fan filters in place....so the method did pretty good.

I'd recommend the Phanteks Enthoo case which will easily fit those rads ...on the downside, ya can't use the very excellent Phanteks fans which top out at 1250 rpm for ya rads. If ya drop down to just two 780s (the 3rd really does not give ya much, not only would have save the $700 card, but ya could get away with a 420 + 280 and 1250 rpm fans running at 850 rpm for an extremely quiet rig.

2. That is just awesome, great job!
5. Noise is not that important, as long as my system doesn't blast over my games biggrin.gif
6. That part shocked me. Can't believe it makes so little difference. (Especially since Alphacool claims that their Monsta cools better than the UT60 with one fan more. 360 Monsta > 480 UT60) XT45 would be fine then , this would mean I have much more space in my system. (Finally I can fit my res in it biggrin.gif).

Let's pretend my 4770K will put out 200W, which after some research I saw is extreme. My 2 780 Ti's will put out around 300W. (I have dropped one for not being able to pay for a motherboard that supports three of them and I don't need the third.) I'll leave my motherboard and RAM on air. And let's take a rough estimation of 50W for the D5 I'll be using (The 35x2 is a little too pricey, which other pump could you recommend)

850W of heat combined.

x .60 = 510 W

So I guess a XT45 360, with a XT45 240 and maybe even a ST30 120 in a compact case I'd have enough to cool the system? Is 1650 RPM in push pull still bearable noise-wise?
The Regulator
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 5930K MSI X99S SLI Plus MSI GeForce GTX 780Ti G.Skill Ripjaws 4 16GB 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Crucial MX100 Corsair Hydro Series H105 Windows 10 Pro 64 bit AOC i2369Vm 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 DK9087 Cherry MX Blue White LED EVGA SuperNOVA 1300 G2 Corsair Graphite 230T Logitech G600 
AudioAudio
Labtec Arena 485 2.1 Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
The Regulator
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 5930K MSI X99S SLI Plus MSI GeForce GTX 780Ti G.Skill Ripjaws 4 16GB 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Crucial MX100 Corsair Hydro Series H105 Windows 10 Pro 64 bit AOC i2369Vm 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 DK9087 Cherry MX Blue White LED EVGA SuperNOVA 1300 G2 Corsair Graphite 230T Logitech G600 
AudioAudio
Labtec Arena 485 2.1 Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #22 of 47
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpecialEdT View Post

Link to where you can buy the same rad as me: http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=25417

Haha, I was asking Ashuiegi but your comment slipped inbetween biggrin.gif
The Regulator
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 5930K MSI X99S SLI Plus MSI GeForce GTX 780Ti G.Skill Ripjaws 4 16GB 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Crucial MX100 Corsair Hydro Series H105 Windows 10 Pro 64 bit AOC i2369Vm 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 DK9087 Cherry MX Blue White LED EVGA SuperNOVA 1300 G2 Corsair Graphite 230T Logitech G600 
AudioAudio
Labtec Arena 485 2.1 Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
The Regulator
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 5930K MSI X99S SLI Plus MSI GeForce GTX 780Ti G.Skill Ripjaws 4 16GB 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Crucial MX100 Corsair Hydro Series H105 Windows 10 Pro 64 bit AOC i2369Vm 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 DK9087 Cherry MX Blue White LED EVGA SuperNOVA 1300 G2 Corsair Graphite 230T Logitech G600 
AudioAudio
Labtec Arena 485 2.1 Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #23 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyro999 View Post

If you're water cooling partially for the sake of CPU overclocking, you'd probably want to use like 1.4v on the Haswell - you can do this on air or clc, it's just very hot especially without delid

that lets power start to approach the 200 watt range for i7

Chart from Sin measuring 4770k power under wprime, which is about where realistic load power numbers for 100% load are - stuff like video encoding, but not stuff like Linpack which can pull much more but have little good reason to be ran ~

At 4.6 Ghz and 1.38, under RoG Bench (Image editing, H.264, Open CL w/ AVX) I'm no where near 200 watts but I hit 1.48 volts when AVX instructions present). If testing is done at 1.4 VID, that puts ya at 1.5+ under adaptive when AVX present so few peeps willing to go there.

http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp (Using CPU calculator NOT PSU Calculator)
4.6 at 1.38 = 135 watts
4.8 at 1.45 = 150 watts
5.0 at 1.50 = 155 watts

More Haswells are limited by voltage than temps .... even a stock Haswell will break 85C under OCCT stress testing on stock cooler.

These are the most commonly listed voltage recommendations I have seen.

Decent air cooler for voltage levels above 1.15V.
1.20V-1.23V requires use of closed loop water coolers or top tier air cooler (H110 / Phanteks PH-TC14-PE, Noctua DH-14)
1.24V-1.275V dual radiator water cooling solutions are advised.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashuiegi View Post

of course 1200 rpm is way too low for 60 and 80 mm rad, with slow fans they don't give you any benefits , but if you push pull with faster fans they can cool way more , nearly scale up , it depend on fpi too.

1. Depends on how much noise ya willing to listen to. No way it's "too low" if you want to sit in the same room with the PC w/o headphones on. Today water cooling is as much driven by noise as it is cooling because temps isn't really the limiting factor very often anymore....voltage is. I don't see many with open WC loops stopping because they worried about temps, they stopping because system us unstable at voltages they are willing to subject the system to. The days of 30 fpi rads and 3300 rpm fans are over because the same overclock can be accomplished in a reasonably sized case with inaudible fan noise. And at 9 - 12 fpi, 60mm presents no impediment to good air flow whatsoever.

2. Not supported by the data.....

Here's Martins* data in P/P .... per 120mm of rad:

@ 1400 rpm
A 100% increase in thickness from 30 to 60 gets ya 6.3% more cooling, return on investment in extra thickness = 6.9%
A 91% increase in thickness from 45 to 86 gets ya 9.7% more cooling, return on investment in extra thickness = 10.6%

30mm - 80 watts
45mm - 82
60mm - 85
86mm - 90

@ 1800 rpm
A 100% increase in thickness from 30 to 60 gets ya 10.2% more cooling, return on investment =11.2%
A 91% increase in thickness from 45 to 86 gets ya 8.7% more cooling, return on investment = 9.5%

30mm - 98 watts
45mm - 104
60mm - 108
86mm - 113

@ 2200 rpm
A 100% increase in thickness from 30 to 60 gets ya 5.6% more cooling, return on investment = 4.2%
A 91% increase in thickness from 45 to 86 gets ya 18.5% more cooling, return on investment = 20%

30mm - 113 watts
45mm - 124
60mm - 131
86mm - 147

There's no data after 2200 I imagine as it's just not done anymore.
Edited by JackNaylorPE - 3/26/14 at 6:51pm
911 Carrera
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel w/ EK Supremacy Cooling Block - Clean P... Asus Maximus VI Formula 2 x Asus GTX 780 DCII w/ EK Full Cover Blocks a... Mushkin Red Line Ridgeback 2 x 8GB DDR302400 10... 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
2 x SAMSUNG 840 Pro Series MZ-7PD256BW 2.5" 256GB (2 x Seagate ST2000DX001 2TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cach... Asus BW-12B1ST/BLK/G/AS Blue Ray Writer 1 x Alphacool NexXxoS XT45-420 + 1 x Alphacool ... 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
1 x Swiftech 35x2 w/ Heatsink and NB Fan EK -MultiOption RES X3 250 White Acetal Reservoir 5 x PH-F140SP_BK_BLED + 5 x PH-F140SP_BK E22 Rigid 10/12 Acrylic Tubing and Bitspower Ma... 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
2 x Reeven Six Eyes Fan Controller Windows 7 64 Bit Professional OEM ASUS VG248QE Black 23" 144 Hz Monitor Logitech G19s 920-004985 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
Seasonic X-1250 Phanteks Enthoo Primo Ultimate Chassis Asus RoG GX950 Laser Mouse  Logitech Z5500 
  hide details  
Reply
911 Carrera
(20 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel w/ EK Supremacy Cooling Block - Clean P... Asus Maximus VI Formula 2 x Asus GTX 780 DCII w/ EK Full Cover Blocks a... Mushkin Red Line Ridgeback 2 x 8GB DDR302400 10... 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
2 x SAMSUNG 840 Pro Series MZ-7PD256BW 2.5" 256GB (2 x Seagate ST2000DX001 2TB 7200 RPM 64MB Cach... Asus BW-12B1ST/BLK/G/AS Blue Ray Writer 1 x Alphacool NexXxoS XT45-420 + 1 x Alphacool ... 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
1 x Swiftech 35x2 w/ Heatsink and NB Fan EK -MultiOption RES X3 250 White Acetal Reservoir 5 x PH-F140SP_BK_BLED + 5 x PH-F140SP_BK E22 Rigid 10/12 Acrylic Tubing and Bitspower Ma... 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
2 x Reeven Six Eyes Fan Controller Windows 7 64 Bit Professional OEM ASUS VG248QE Black 23" 144 Hz Monitor Logitech G19s 920-004985 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
Seasonic X-1250 Phanteks Enthoo Primo Ultimate Chassis Asus RoG GX950 Laser Mouse  Logitech Z5500 
  hide details  
Reply
post #24 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by TTheuns View Post

The link to the bridge even has CSQ in it...

Yes, that's my bad; I was really just trying to show that EKWB does make Triple EK-FC Bridges for two spacing styles, here are a couple non-CSQ links:
post #25 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post

At 4.6 Ghz and 1.38, under RoG Bench (Image editing, H.264, Open CL w/ AVX) I'm no where near 200 watts but I hit 1.48 volts when AVX instructions present). If testing is done at 1.4 VID, that puts ya at 1.5+ under adaptive when AVX present so few peeps willing to go there.

http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp (Using CPU calculator NOT PSU Calculator)
4.6 at 1.38 = 135 watts
4.8 at 1.45 = 150 watts
5.0 at 1.50 = 155 watts

More Haswells are limited by voltage than temps .... even a stock Haswell will break 85C under OCCT stress testing on stock cooler.

These are the most commonly listed voltage recommendations I have seen.

Decent air cooler for voltage levels above 1.15V.
1.20V-1.23V requires use of closed loop water coolers or top tier air cooler (H110 / Phanteks PH-TC14-PE, Noctua DH-14)
1.24V-1.275V dual radiator water cooling solutions are advised.
1. Depends on how much noise ya willing to listen to. No way it's "too low" if you want to sit in the same room with the PC w/o headphones on. Today water cooling is as much driven by noise as it is cooling because temps isn't really the limiting factor very often anymore....voltage is. I don't see many with open WC loops stopping because they worried about temps, they stopping because system us unstable at voltages they are willing to subject the system to. The days of 30 fpi rads and 3300 rpm fans are over because the same overclock can be accomplished in a reasonably sized case with inaudible fan noise. And at 9 - 12 fpi, 60mm presents no impediment to good air flow whatsoever.

2. Not supported by the data.....

Here's Martins* data in P/P .... per 120mm of rad:

@ 1400 rpm
A 100% increase in thickness from 30 to 60 gets ya 6.3% more cooling, return on investment in extra thickness = 6.9%
A 91% increase in thickness from 45 to 86 gets ya 9.7% more cooling, return on investment in extra thickness = 10.6%

30mm - 80 watts
45mm - 82
60mm - 85
86mm - 90

@ 1800 rpm
A 100% increase in thickness from 30 to 60 gets ya 10.2% more cooling, return on investment =11.2%
A 91% increase in thickness from 45 to 86 gets ya 8.7% more cooling, return on investment = 9.5%

30mm - 98 watts
45mm - 104
60mm - 108
86mm - 113

@ 2200 rpm
A 100% increase in thickness from 30 to 60 gets ya 5.6% more cooling, return on investment = 4.2%
A 91% increase in thickness from 45 to 86 gets ya 18.5% more cooling, return on investment = 20%

30mm - 113 watts
45mm - 124
60mm - 131
86mm - 147

There's no data after 2200 I imagine as it's just not done anymore.

All of this data is really pretty in depth and interesting.

In my real world setup I can say that my 12x Noctua 140mm ULN fans mounted in push/pull configuration on my 2x Black Ice GT 420 Extreme radiators + my 240mm Koolance radiator with 2x Noctua 120mm PWM fans for push configuration really do not make much noise. In fact the whole rig is about four feet from where I'm sitting now and I can just barely hear the fans, for comparison - an optical drive that is spinning up produces about ten times louder sound than what I'm hearing now...

The Koolance PMP-400 pump in my Koolance RP-1250 by far produces the most noise, but thats simply because I have it set to run at full speed as my loop is quite long - I do have a second PMP-400 and reservoir that I'm mounting on the rear of my case tonight that should allow me to run them at the same time at a much lower level, I'll see in a few hours I guess smile.gif
post #26 of 47
I recommend the Alphacool rads.
Go as thick as you can, but make sure to keep room for push/pull.
Thicker rads will gain more from push/pull than thinner ones.
Dark Vader
(6 items)
 
  
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
39 X AP-45 2150 rpm Gentle Typhoon fans Lamptron CW611 FrozenQ Dual Bay Reservoir 2x XT45 480. 1x UT60 480 ~ 1x UT60 360 ~ 1x UT... 
OSCase
Linux Ubuntu CaseLabs STH10 
  hide details  
Reply
Dark Vader
(6 items)
 
  
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
39 X AP-45 2150 rpm Gentle Typhoon fans Lamptron CW611 FrozenQ Dual Bay Reservoir 2x XT45 480. 1x UT60 480 ~ 1x UT60 360 ~ 1x UT... 
OSCase
Linux Ubuntu CaseLabs STH10 
  hide details  
Reply
post #27 of 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by PepeLapiu View Post

I recommend the Alphacool rads.
Go as thick as you can, but make sure to keep room for push/pull.
Thicker rads will gain more from push/pull than thinner ones.

As far as I can see the Alphacool radiators are all based on 120mm fan sizes, since hes mounting the radiators externally he would be far better off with a radiator that is based on 140mm fan sizes such as the two Black Ice GTX 420 that I have to cool the exact same setup as he has (cpu, ram, 3x 780ti) - http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=25417
post #28 of 47
Dark Vader
(6 items)
 
  
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
39 X AP-45 2150 rpm Gentle Typhoon fans Lamptron CW611 FrozenQ Dual Bay Reservoir 2x XT45 480. 1x UT60 480 ~ 1x UT60 360 ~ 1x UT... 
OSCase
Linux Ubuntu CaseLabs STH10 
  hide details  
Reply
Dark Vader
(6 items)
 
  
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
39 X AP-45 2150 rpm Gentle Typhoon fans Lamptron CW611 FrozenQ Dual Bay Reservoir 2x XT45 480. 1x UT60 480 ~ 1x UT60 360 ~ 1x UT... 
OSCase
Linux Ubuntu CaseLabs STH10 
  hide details  
Reply
post #29 of 47
Thread Starter 
I am planning to get as much as possible inside a Corsair 200R. And if I need more I'll mount it to the back. And for inhome use I want a 9x120 rad to hsng from the wall.
The Regulator
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 5930K MSI X99S SLI Plus MSI GeForce GTX 780Ti G.Skill Ripjaws 4 16GB 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Crucial MX100 Corsair Hydro Series H105 Windows 10 Pro 64 bit AOC i2369Vm 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 DK9087 Cherry MX Blue White LED EVGA SuperNOVA 1300 G2 Corsair Graphite 230T Logitech G600 
AudioAudio
Labtec Arena 485 2.1 Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
The Regulator
(14 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 5930K MSI X99S SLI Plus MSI GeForce GTX 780Ti G.Skill Ripjaws 4 16GB 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Crucial MX100 Corsair Hydro Series H105 Windows 10 Pro 64 bit AOC i2369Vm 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Ducky Shine 3 DK9087 Cherry MX Blue White LED EVGA SuperNOVA 1300 G2 Corsair Graphite 230T Logitech G600 
AudioAudio
Labtec Arena 485 2.1 Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro 
  hide details  
Reply
post #30 of 47
if you go external just do it like me , a big fat rad on a stand next to the pc. The phobya nova 1080 60mm rad cost about 130 dollar i think but a single 360 60 mm rad will cost you up to 100 dollar.
with the extra connection between them it will had up restriction and pressure drop , so the best solution is the fat one.




Edited by Ashuiegi - 3/27/14 at 7:31am
HAF X - main rig
(24 items)
 
HAF XB
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E8500 ASUS P5E3 ASUS dcuii TOP GTX 670 OCZ reaper x hpc  
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
samsung 500 gb samsung dvd antec H2O 920 windows vista 64b 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 23 passive 3d logitech g15 CORSAIR GS800 haf xb 
MouseAudio
logitech g500 logitech Z 2300 
  hide details  
Reply
HAF X - main rig
(24 items)
 
HAF XB
(14 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
E8500 ASUS P5E3 ASUS dcuii TOP GTX 670 OCZ reaper x hpc  
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
samsung 500 gb samsung dvd antec H2O 920 windows vista 64b 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 23 passive 3d logitech g15 CORSAIR GS800 haf xb 
MouseAudio
logitech g500 logitech Z 2300 
  hide details  
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Water Cooling
Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Water Cooling › Another radspace question.