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[H360] DirectX 12 Requires New Graphics Cards to Utilize All Features - Page 13

post #121 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero4549 View Post

Except in the past a lot of hardware was actually compatible with newer DX versions. DX8 cards can often run DX 9. Some DX9 cards ran DX10. Some DX 10 cards can run DX11 (and the rest can run at least a subset of DX11).

Meanwhile, some "DX10" and "DX11" marketed cards never actually supported the full feature sets of those APIs, and got away with it because they were lower tier cards that no one was going to try running advanced software on anyway.

It's not really as clear as saying the card was made when this API was the standard, so that is what it is capable of. I do get your overall point though.

If you're going to say it that way, there is limited support for DX12 on many DX11 cards (GCN, and all DX11 nVidia cards).

It's basically more of the same, I'm not sure why people are so up in arms about it. I bet these same people were up in arms about DX11 and DX10 as well..
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post #122 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

If you're going to say it that way, there is limited support for DX12 on many DX11 cards (GCN, and all DX11 nVidia cards).

It's basically more of the same, I'm not sure why people are so up in arms about it. I bet these same people were up in arms about DX11 and DX10 as well..

Let me clarify, a lot of past hardware was fully compatible with the following generation of DX, not just partially.

Anyway, you're right, these same people were largely upset about DX11, 10, and 9 as well. Some people like me love new technology as it means new capabilities. Others hate it as it means having to spend more on hardware or becoming outdated.

I obviously favor the forward march of progress, but there is some validity in wanting your hard earned money to last a little longer too.

Another issue is that in the past, DX versions were a lot more meaningful, and they really required new hardware to support them. These days, that isn't quite so clear, and some feel as though microsoft, nvidia, and amd are creating a false need to replace hardware and operating systems prematurely and justifying it with artificial limitations on their older counterparts.
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post #123 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero4549 View Post

Let me clarify, a lot of past hardware was fully compatible with the following generation of DX, not just partially.

Anyway, you're right, these same people were largely upset about DX11, 10, and 9 as well. Some people like me love new technology as it means new capabilities. Others hate it as it means having to spend more on hardware or becoming outdated.

I obviously favor the forward march of progress, but there is some validity in wanting your hard earned money to last a little longer too.

Another issue is that in the past, DX versions were a lot more meaningful, and they really required new hardware to support them. These days, that isn't quite so clear, and some feel as though microsoft, nvidia, and amd are creating a false need to replace hardware and operating systems prematurely and justifying it with artificial limitations on their older counterparts.

Well, we aren't even sure what DX12 includes, the only things we know so far is that it reduces CPU overhead for DX11 cards. We don't know what new features DX12 will include in addition to that that would require new cards.

On a different note, it also means we probably won't see 3xx cards from AMD until next year, well after nVidia releases first generation Haswell. Unless AMD was somehow able to make their 3xx cards DX12 compliant by the end of this year...
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post #124 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moustache View Post

SOURCE

Sorry if this has already been posted or you guys already knew about it.

This sounds like a bad idea if MS is really going to pull this stunt. PC gamers are more mature and budget conscious now and there is no way that a budget minded gamer (which most of us are) with an R9 290 or a GTX 780 ti is going to upgrade their GPU next year for DX 12. I can promise that the high end GPUs that are out now like these I mentioned are more than capable of running anything in DX 12. In the old days of yore, this might have been necessary, but gaming technology does not improve so rapidly that our current cards will not be able to handle an API that is made for the GPUs of tomorrow. The AMD 300s and Nvidia 800s are not going to have fundamentally different hardware next year. They are just going to be small upgrades like they have been for the past 5 years. So why would today's cards not be able to handle something like DX 12? What, are they going to get rid of silicon next year and instead use carbon fiber transistors wrapped in electro-conductive bacteria cells? Are they going to hit the white board, drink coffee all night, and by morning come up with a new GPU architecture that is going to turn the entire electronics industry upside down? No and no. They are going to rebrand everything and sell it for the same price the current gen was at launch. But this time, they are going to put in something that unlocks DX 12. And if someone can find a good example of why it is the case that my card can't run DX 12, then by all means, prove me wrong.

I am passionate about this because I need a new graphics card and I do not feel that it is fair for them to limit DX12 to new cards.

EDIT:

http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/178904-directx-12-detailed-backwards-compatible-with-all-recent-nvidia-gpus-will-deliver-mantle-like-capabilities

But I am leaving my comment up there because I like to complain.
Edited by Thready - 4/25/14 at 11:47am
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post #125 of 152
Meh. How many games are still using DX9? How long did it take a lot of games to start utilizing DX11?

Biding my time and not worried about this at all. I'll probably upgrade again when the GTX 880 comes out and then by the time I am done with that maybe DX12 will catch on and it will be worth upgrading again.
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post #126 of 152
All this is moot. Microsoft has to get the game developers to write software for Direct X 12. Guess what? Most of the developers still are not writing software for Direct X 11, let alone 11.1 or 11.2. If they cant get the developers to write exclusively for Direct X 12 it does not really matter which GPU's support it or not. All the big games are Source, Unity, Creation, Essence and even CryEngine will need major changes and updates to support Direct X 12 and its likely requirement of Windows 8 or newer (you know cause arbitrarily windows 7 wont support it after Microsoft Cough Cough checks things).
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post #127 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Beregond View Post

Meh. How many games are still using DX9? How long did it take a lot of games to start utilizing DX11?

Biding my time and not worried about this at all. I'll probably upgrade again when the GTX 880 comes out and then by the time I am done with that maybe DX12 will catch on and it will be worth upgrading again.

With MS trying to get at least some of DX12 on the Xbox One I am thinking we might see it in games sooner than later. Plus if it actually delivers the stuff they claim it will I think developers would be pushing for it. With DX10/11 there wasn't really a performance gain...just more toys to make eye candy at their disposal and any work done with those new toys would be completely wasted on the 360 and PS3. So I am hoping it won't be too long...but no way to really know at this point, but there is enough to guess off of. I also haven't heard if the PS4 could start using it, but since it is close to the same hardware I think it should be able to. Probably more down to if Sony allows it.

I am still hoping my 580's will hold out until a DX12 GPU is available.
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post #128 of 152
For AMD, they still have not taken down the press release, all 7000 series and higher will be FULLY DX12

http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/amd-demonstrates-2014mar20.aspx
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post #129 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximization View Post

For AMD, they still have not taken down the press release, all 7000 series and higher will be FULLY DX12

http://www.amd.com/en-us/press-releases/Pages/amd-demonstrates-2014mar20.aspx

If the XBone uses GCN cores and they are making DX12 utilize it better than the GCN cores will be widely supported in all the current hardware. GCN will support it natively.
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post #130 of 152
MS will say that the xbone supports "dx 12" to save face and then promptly release dx 12.1 for actual next gen graphics.
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