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Hide "debug" from /proc/cmdline

post #1 of 8
Thread Starter 
[RFC PATCH] cmdline: Hide "debug" from /proc/cmdline

Linus' response (with asterisk-censored swearing, fair warning):

Re: [RFC PATCH] cmdline: Hide "debug" from /proc/cmdline


I saw this issue pop up on The Register and Phoronix, so at least a handful of people must find this interesting. As usual, Linus is overly abrasive in his approach, but the response does seem warranted nonetheless.

Also, is it a bit ironic that kernel debugging is bugged? biggrin.gif
post #2 of 8
Kay Sievers seems like an oddball, yes. He could've temporarily stopped systemd from parsing debug until the kernel devs fixes the bug.
post #3 of 8
It is my understanding that most of the kernel dev team, including Linus, do NOT consider this a kernel problem. The problem is akin to a hacker creating a a buffer overflow since systemd creates so much useless noise, literally useless, in that it cannot be used by anybody for anything, and in userspace no less, that there are so many timeouts the kernel crashes. The way the kernel is designed and has been in use for 20 years (with no problems in this area) is to allow a great deal of flexibility for flags not even guessed at originally by the devs, so any manner of actually useful debugging is possible.

It would be one thing if Kay Sievers and Leonnart Poettering had a history of listening to bug reports and fixing them instead of being in a constant state of denial. Often, they are so arrogant they don't even bother to respond except to say they "don't care" or are "unconcerned" and putting the problems, all of them, on someone else. Look HERE. This isn't even close to a first time, only offense.

For those who don't bother to follow links for the full story "from the horses mouth" here's a sample
Quote:
Originally Posted by as noted 

Linus Torvalds
It does become a problem when you have a system service developer who
thinks the universe revolves around him, and nobody else matters, and
people sending him bug-reports are annoyances that should be ignored
rather than acknowledged and fixed. At that point, it's a problem.

It looks like Greg has stepped in as a baby-sitter for Kay, and things
are going to be fixed. And I'd really like to avoid adding hacky code
to the kernel because of Kay's continued bad behavior, so I hope this
works. But it's really sad that things like this get elevated to this
kind of situation, and I personally find it annoying that it's always
the same f*cking primadonna involved.

Borislav Petkov (quoting in response to Kay)
> Again, move discussions to the mailing list; this is a bug tracker,
> but there is no bug to track or fix here.

Dude, are you for real? Are you actually actively trying to be a d*ck or
you're this way by default. We're telling you there's a serious issue
and we're even being constructive by giving suggestions and you're
deflecting.

You have got to be f*cking kidding me!

Ideally, rather than simply casting blame, if we look at this constructively, there are only two possible resolutions

1) Limit the kernel debug feature to accommodate systemd and lose actual, open functionality at kernel level

OR
2) Limit systemd's verbosity of useless userspace noise at no loss to systemd or anyone else.

Which is more reasonable?
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post #4 of 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferrari8608 View Post


Also, is it a bit ironic that kernel debugging is bugged? biggrin.gif

It's not a kernel problem any more than it's a websites fault if someone decides to DDoS attack it, because that's effectively what systemd is doing; it's DOSing the kernel.

I think Linus is completely in the right here.
post #5 of 8
If that's the case, then yes I vote for changing systemd.
post #6 of 8
It's too bad there isn't some way to combine similar threads but at least this is the most current so I'll state it here. Earlier I blamed RedHat for trying to "do an end-run" and wipe out competition. I stated this was conjecture based on "following the money" - who has the most to gain. Also, I think I mentioned that corporations can be un-homogenous where one part does one thing and another part is at odds and does the exact opposite. This conjecture was partly because such things are most often hidden to avoid countermeasures and there was very little to go on, other than Leonnart and Kay being paid by RedHat to develop a CoreOS.

Now things are beginning to surface and I have to narrow down and amend my conjecture. There are some good, adept people at RedHat who have finally come out against exactly this sort of nonsense. It is beginning to look like some at Fedora are more to blame and the secrecy and denial kept many at RedHat in the dark as well. The next several months will likely be much more revealing whether there is malice at heart or just incompetence.

It seems it isn't quite time for popcorn yet, but it's getting close. smile.gif
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post #7 of 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by xeekei View Post

If that's the case, then yes I vote for changing systemd.

Well I can't seem to replicate the issue so I can only go on what's been reported; but that seems to be the case
post #8 of 8
Maybe this will bring down the arrogance a little bit. I've noticed how much less arrogant Lennart Poettering appears on talks now from a few years ago, and I think that's because he became a internet celebrity and got a lot of crap, which scared him a little. Kay Sievers has been in the shadows this whole time mostly.
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