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FX 6300 @ 4,91GHz -vs- X6 1100t @ 4,00GHz - Page 2

post #11 of 39
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Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason387 View Post

The FX 6300 is a clear winner here. Especially in games. I'm not going to argue about it and everyone has different opinions. OP next time don't just show 1 benchmark. But since you did. Go ahead and run this other benchmark. Download HWBot Prime and run it with both cpu's. Here's my score at 4.2Ghz. To equal this score I think your Phenom II x6 will need to be at 7Ghz or more.


Now have a look at the Phenom II x6 at 5.8Ghz-
http://hwbot.org/submission/2433479_ivanov_hwbot_prime_phenom_ii_x6_1100t_be_3625.7_pps

Every CPU works differently in terms of making calculations. If certain software is coded to make use of its way of making calculations then it benefits.


These arent my results, hence the big capitalized words of
"NOTE: THESE ARE NOT MY TESTS OR RESULTS" in first post

jason if u have a facebook account, can you go to the link here
https://www.facebook.com/groups/westcoastmods/852064988143286/?notif_t=group_activity

and review the tests the person posted? its by someone named Anna Jules.

I dont understasnd how its possible.

an x6 at 4.00ghz beating a fx 6300 at 4.9 ghz ??
sounds like bs to me tbh. unless im missing something
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post #12 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by IMKR View Post

an x6 at 4.00ghz beating a fx 6300 at 4.9 ghz ??
sounds like bs to me tbh. unless im missing something
Depends on instructions and conditions. If the benchmark uses newer instructions that were added to Piledriver and a mix of FPU and integer operations, an FX 6300 at 4.9GHz will best a Phenom II at 4GHz by some extent. If the benchmark uses newer instructions and solely integer operations, FX 6300 at 4.9 will mop the floor with a Phenom II at 4GHz. If the benchmark runs solely float-point operations with newer instructions, then the Phenom II at 4GHz will be roughly equal (maybe better, depends) to an FX at 4.9GHz.

If the benchmark doesn't use newer instructions and runs a mix of FPU and integer operations, Phenom II at 4GHz will best an FX 6300 at 4.9GHz to some extent. If the benchmark doesn't use newer instructions and runs solely integer operations, the two will be roughly equal. If the benchmark doesn't use newer instructions and runs float-point operations, then Phenom II at 4GHz will mop the floor with FX 6300 at 4.9GHz.

Core for core, Phenom is faster in certain cases since each of Phenom's cores has one FPU and one integer unit, while FX 6300 has a half FPU and one integer unit. In other cases, FX 6300 is faster through sheer brute force, it can clock much higher than Phenom II and fares better in memory-heavy operations. FX-series are built in modules, each module having two integer cores and sharing one FPU and L2 cache to form two cores, while Phenom II has 6 integer cores and 6 FPUs. Different architecture designed for different workloads, Piledriver is better suited for servers where lots of physical cores with low single-threaded performance can be useful.

And the worst results for the FX 6300 are gained in x87 operations, like what SuperPi runs, since x87 instruction set is disabled on Bulldozer/Piledriver (can be enabled using Bulldozer Conditioner). A Phenom II X6 1090T on stock is only 1% slower than my 8320 at 4.5GHz in SuperPI, and that's an 8-core vs a 6-core, but once I use Bulldozer Conditioner that enables the x87 instruction set that gap becomes much larger. wPrime also uses x87 code just like SuperPI, if I recall correctly, and the current gap between those two hexa-cores would be ~10% instead of ~30% if the 6300 were to have it's x87 block disabled.

As I said, it depends on instructions and conditions, you can compare a 750cc 8,000RPM Kawasaki racing bike to a 125cc 3600RPM KTM dirt bike on the road and call the Kawasaki a lot faster faster, but once you put them on a messed up terrain like in the middle of a forest, things change. Same thing happens with CPUs, one wins in one workload and the other wins in a different workload, a CPU will perform poorly if it ain't designed for that workload just like a Kawasaki in the woods. smile.gif
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post #13 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by IMKR View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)


These arent my results, hence the big capitalized words of
"NOTE: THESE ARE NOT MY TESTS OR RESULTS" in first post

jason if u have a facebook account, can you go to the link here
https://www.facebook.com/groups/westcoastmods/852064988143286/?notif_t=group_activity

and review the tests the person posted? its by someone named Anna Jules.

I dont understasnd how its possible.

an x6 at 4.00ghz beating a fx 6300 at 4.9 ghz ??
sounds like bs to me tbh. unless im missing something

To put it simply Wprime tests something which Vishera doesn't work by. Both these chips use different architectures and thus function differently.
If You have Two long strong legs and we have a race. The outcome is simple, you win. Now if I have two stronger and longer arms, and we are both made to lift something, I win. These software run according to a certain coding. If the cpu has that coding then it will run better. Wprime is older. The Phenom II x6 will probably beat the FX 6300 in much older games and other such benchmarks. But as newer software and games are released they will be based on a new coding and set of instructions which the FX 6300 will have. Does this make any sense ?tongue.gif
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post #14 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by IMKR View Post

so the phenom x6 is the better chip? even though its pretty old?

whats the point of people buying the fx6300 over the phenom x6 then?

Look, i don't even game much, so i don't know how game developers prefer to code their games. Maybe it's true that they write more code-friendly for FX now. What i feel is this. I 've used both the 1090T and FX.6300 at stock speeds on the same exact platform. In video encoding, the 1090T was a hair faster. I also got the impression that unzipping big files (over 1GB) was faster in 1090T. In "normal" operation, the FX6300 gives me the impression of being "snappier", probably because the lowest P-state is 1400Mhz vs 800 Mhz. So the FX6300 begins from a "snappier" state. The FX-6300 i bought it because the heat of the 1090T was getting a bit annoying. In that sector, the FX is much, much better. For what little is worth, in WEI Win7SP1, 1090T gave me 7,5 rating, the FX-6300 7,4, with the exact same components.

Personally, since i don't game, i consider them more or less equivalent. Probably as other said, depending on the coding, one can beat the other. The FX has more overclocking room. I don't overclock. But at stock speeds, the 1090T for me, is on par, in general. for the tasks i do. But i do appreciate low heat, so i now have the FX on my main rig. If i could have a 95W Phenom, i would pick the Phenom, because i prefer the "whole cores" vs modules. But, my 1090T is a nasty fellow, with uneven heatspreader and very voltage thirsty, so we never became good friends, even undervolted.

This is the "good" thing with the FX. Video encoding, measured by killawatt, draws 142W only (undervolted). I could even allow myself to lower the CPU fan rpm. Observe the "package" calculation in Watts, while running Prime95-Blend. Of course, it's not dead accurate, but with the 1090T i was never able to make HWMonitor to show me not even 95W.

28mpytd.png
Edited by Undervolter - 4/7/14 at 8:33am
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post #15 of 39
UnderVolter has touched on what has really proven to make FX more practical for me... The Pstates issue...

On my AM3 CPU. I had to force the CPU to stay in the highest Pstate all the time otherwise the machine felt really unresponsive and had bad performance in real-time workloads whenever the load was moved from core to core because there was such a long delay for the higher demand to actually trigger the higher speeds. PileDrivers higher idle speeds, and significantly faster response to changes in load have made it possible to use the machine comfortably with the low power states intact. This means I can have both ballistic overclocked performance and tidy idle power consumption all in the same box. Overclocked AM3 CPUs would have very high idle power consumption when configured to run responsively.



And yes, the FX-6300 can be slower than the 1100T in many workloads because the FX-6300 only "appears" to be a highly parallel processor from the outside looking in ("lots of cores"). The 1090T actually has far more resources to work with (ALUs, schedulers, decoders, etc).
     
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post #16 of 39
Thread Starter 
This person even has cinibench reulsts up.
comparing 5.0ghz fx 6xxx vs 4.0 phennom x6
and
5.0 ghz FX 4xxx vs 4.2ghz phenom x4.

and the phenom is winning / drawing.

I am seriously confused.

and others are syaing the FX will win in more modern benchmark and work load, but isnt cinibench modern?
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post #17 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by IMKR View Post

This person even has cinibench reulsts up.
comparing 5.0ghz fx 6xxx vs 4.0 phennom x6
and
5.0 ghz FX 4xxx vs 4.2ghz phenom x4.

and the phenom is winning / drawing.

I am seriously confused.

and others are syaing the FX will win in more modern benchmark and work load, but isnt cinibench modern?
Have a look at this bench-


Same bench with 4 cores-


I don't see a Phenom II x4 beating that wink.gif
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post #18 of 39
as others have said, at similar clocks the 1090T will be better in many workloads because each core has better access to resources. scaling across cores is also much better on that architecture than the current one. an FX 6300 is a better cpu overall I'm sure.
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post #19 of 39
Thread Starter 
Tbh, I don't accept tomshardware forum post to be an acceptable source.
I can defend my self with explanations and proof, but I don't want to come off like a dick.
But, I stopped going to their forums after 4 days of use
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post #20 of 39
I'm kind of missing the point of the 6300 when the 8320 is usually only $20-30 more... redface.gif
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Not telling AsRock something Pixel Pusher 2 x 8 GB AMD Radeon RAM @ 1600mhz (All the VM's) 
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Crucial M4 128GB (8 second boot) Western Digital RE4 1TB Western Digital RE4 2TB Pioneer Blu-Ray Reader/Writer 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo Windows 8.1 Pro x64 Dell U2713HM IBM Model M (CLICKY!!) 
PowerCaseMouseAudio
Antec HCG-900 NZXT Source 210 (it was cheap) Logitech G502 Schiit Modi 
AudioAudio
Sennheiser HD 598 M-Audio AV40's 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-4200U Microsoft BGA1168 Intel HD 4400 8 GB LPDDR3 Dual Channel @ 1600mhz 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
SK Hynix 256GB SSD Windows 8.1 Professional 1920 x 1080p IPS Display Microsoft Touch Cover 2 
Power
48w PSU 
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