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post #31 of 74
You want to really know? Download HWiNFO and Riva tuner (comes with MSI Afterburner). With HWiNFO up there is a configure sensors button at the bottom, click it and go to the OSD (RTSS) Tab.

There you can add each part of your PC you wish to monitor in game to determine any issues, and I DO MEAN ANY. I have a FX 8350 and 7770x2. My first line has each CPU core. Second line has CPU temps and voltages and Memory (Ram), third line has GPU speeds and Vram, and the last line having GPU temps and utilizations.

I can tell at any moment if it is CPU or GPU bottlenecking and how memory is being utilized. Great way to tweak skyrim.
post #32 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcEsSalvation View Post

In your screen shots, you GPU is at 99%, meaning it is the bottleneck. When he was done playing, his GPU peaked at 91%, meaning the CPU hit it's limit before the GPU (bottleneck).
I know where you are coming from but I don't think that is absolutely accurate statement . CPU bottleneck is probable but not absolute unless we know exactly the mods OP is running. I used to have hundreds of mods in my previous Skyrim installation until I decided to remove everything and started a fresh Skyrim installation, I was playing a mod called Falskaar where there is a very big dungeon full of draugrs, I got 15 fps in that dungeon (low CPU and GPU usage too), so it was very annoying, very unplayable and very choppy to do anything. I disabled all of quality and texture mods, removed the enb, I also set the game to low 800x600 and that didn't increase my fps, also I overclocked both the CPU and GPU, transferred the game to a faster hard-drive to no avail, the only fix was to get rid of everything and start from the scratch only with the essential mods, after reinstalling the games again with only the important mods I didn't have problems with fps in that area ever since. I think the game engine after a certain number of mods shows its limitations, that any CPU or GPU won't help ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by KJZ87 View Post

HeadlessKnight, I am using the RealVision ENB Atmospheric Performance version right now. I originally tried the full version before and I noticed that the FPS was a bit lower when exploring new areas, etc. I am not sure what is the difference between the Performance and Full versions but you are probably correct that the GPU reached 100% usage. However, after comparing the Performance and Full versions, I cannot tell the difference between them so I decided to use the Performance version for now. If I wanted to use the full version, you could be right that the GPU could use a boost with an OC. However I am not sure it is worth it for the Full version.

The difference between the Full and Performance is that there are certain eye candy stuff that are disabled using the performance version, I didn't try the performance version. I don't constantly get 60 fps with my GTX 780 Ti but 45-58 fps in landscapes full of trees is reasonable to me.
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post #33 of 74
It's actually impossible and/or inadvisable to disable VSync in Skyrim due to the way it was coded. I'm not sure how an ENB might affect this as I do not use mods heavily.

There are two settings that can durastically affect your FPS and should be turned down as needed that I am aware of. Try going into Nvidia Control Panel -> Manage 3D Settings -> Program Settings (Tab) -> Skyrim (Drop Down Menu) to adjust them. I prefer setting my own tweaks over having XPerience handling graphical tweaks.

Ambient Occlusion should probably be set to performance unless you're just taking screenshots. The difference is negligable to most people.

Antialiasing - Transparency should probably be set to 4x. AA should be set to 8x but you will have to set that using the launcher config.

If that's not getting the job done, drop down to 2x transparency and 4x AA.

If you don't see a any improvement with these tweaks whatsoever, I would assume the CPU is bottlenecking. Your video card has enough power to maintain 60 FPS @ 1440p in an unmodded Skyrim easily, although this may be a non-issue. A moderate overclock of 4.5 GHz should squeeze out all the extra FPS you can hope for out of most games.
post #34 of 74
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcEsSalvation View Post

Riverwood may be a demanding area. I'm not a programmer or coder, so I couldn't say for sure. I know there is a lot of AI in that area, and almost all of them have an interactive script (blacksmith works forge, Faendal {I think} chops wood, etc). In cities, the issue is mainly loading everything in the area at once with AI/scripting. There are a lot more factors as well, but to answer your last couple questions:

Different areas are more demanding for different reasons. My GPU spike in Morthal with all the water and the wooden buildings (two things my texture pack has changed). Meanwhile in cities like Whiterun, or more specifically, looking at Whiterun from Dragonsreach, my CPU becomes an obvious bottleneck. At 40-50 FPS while my GPU is about 50% usage, it's easy to determine.
And crashes will only occur if there is a scripting issue between mods, or if the game gets unexpected code. You won't crash due to a frame dip. You can crash during a frame dip however, but only if there is bad code. I've crashed during a frame dip, but that was a mod acting up.

Gotcha. I do run TES5Edit to make sure the game will not crash at launch at least. I can live with 40-50 FPS at times but I do not want to occur all the time at certain locations/places.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

You want to really know? Download HWiNFO and Riva tuner (comes with MSI Afterburner). With HWiNFO up there is a configure sensors button at the bottom, click it and go to the OSD (RTSS) Tab.

I will definitely consider it. Can I install and run both HWiNFO/Riva Turner and EVGA Precision X on my computer?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadlessKnight View Post


The difference between the Full and Performance is that there are certain eye candy stuff that are disabled using the performance version, I didn't try the performance version. I don't constantly get 60 fps with my GTX 780 Ti but 45-58 fps in landscapes full of trees is reasonable to me.

I will have the notes again for RealVision ENB but I did not notice the difference. Perhaps with all the other mods I installed there is a very insignificant distance.

If you want I can send an attachment of all the plugins I have installed in another post. I think the list is completed except for a lock-bash type mod (since I am sick of locks in any game).
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post #35 of 74
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingcrabmeat View Post

It's actually impossible and/or inadvisable to disable VSync in Skyrim due to the way it was coded. I'm not sure how an ENB might affect this as I do not use mods heavily.

There are two settings that can durastically affect your FPS and should be turned down as needed that I am aware of. Try going into Nvidia Control Panel -> Manage 3D Settings -> Program Settings (Tab) -> Skyrim (Drop Down Menu) to adjust them. I prefer setting my own tweaks over having XPerience handling graphical tweaks.

Ambient Occlusion should probably be set to performance unless you're just taking screenshots. The difference is negligable to most people.

Antialiasing - Transparency should probably be set to 4x. AA should be set to 8x but you will have to set that using the launcher config.

If that's not getting the job done, drop down to 2x transparency and 4x AA.

If you don't see a any improvement with these tweaks whatsoever, I would assume the CPU is bottlenecking. Your video card has enough power to maintain 60 FPS @ 1440p in an unmodded Skyrim easily, although this may be a non-issue. A moderate overclock of 4.5 GHz should squeeze out all the extra FPS you can hope for out of most games.

Ambient Occlusion and Antialiasing are both disabled for Skyrim in my settings.
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post #36 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadlessKnight View Post

I know where you are coming from but I don't think that is absolutely accurate statement . CPU bottleneck is probable but not absolute unless we know exactly the mods OP is running. I used to have hundreds of mods in my previous Skyrim installation until I decided to remove everything and started a fresh Skyrim installation, I was playing a mod called Falskaar where there is a very big dungeon full of draugrs, I got 15 fps in that dungeon (low CPU and GPU usage too), so it was very annoying, very unplayable and very choppy to do anything. I disabled all of quality and texture mods, removed the enb, I also set the game to low 800x600 and that didn't increase my fps, also I overclocked both the CPU and GPU, transferred the game to a faster hard-drive to no avail, the only fix was to get rid of everything and start from the scratch only with the essential mods, after reinstalling the games again with only the important mods I didn't have problems with fps in that area ever since. I think the game engine after a certain number of mods shows its limitations, that any CPU or GPU won't help ...
You've just proved my point.
Quote:
I was playing a mod called Falskaar where there is a very big dungeon full of draugrs, I got 15 fps in that dungeon (low CPU and GPU usage too)
How many threads do you have? For me, it's 8. 2/8 = 25%. My CPU will only be able to go to 25% usage on Skyrim. That is low usage, however the game is using 100% of the available CPU resources
Quote:
I also set the game to low 800x600 and that didn't increase my fps
Decreasing resolution and not getting any framerate increase is a good sign of script overloading.
Quote:
I think the game engine after a certain number of mods shows its limitations
Would be better if it used more than 2 threads.
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post #37 of 74
Thread Starter 
Here is my plugin list. Let me know if this helps:

ModList.docx 12k .docx file
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post #38 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by KJZ87 View Post

Ambient Occlusion and Antialiasing are both disabled for Skyrim in my settings.

I suspect that NVIDIA Experience overrides manual settings. Do you see jagged edges as you would expect to see with AA disabled? If not, then uninstall the Experience software and tweak every graphical setting yourself.

If an override is obviously not taking place, I concede that the major culprit is probably the ENB or mods or a combination thereof. In that case, whether OC'ing the CPU or GPU will result in any FPS increase is anybody's guess.
post #39 of 74
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingcrabmeat View Post

I suspect that NVIDIA Experience overrides manual settings. Do you see jagged edges as you would expect to see with AA disabled? If not, then uninstall the Experience software and tweak every graphical setting yourself.

If an override is obviously not taking place, I concede that the major culprit is probably the ENB or mods or a combination thereof. In that case, whether OC'ing the CPU or GPU will result in any FPS increase is anybody's guess.

It is turned off on NVIDIA GeForce Experience and it appears the edges are a bit jagged based on my observations.

The author of the ENB mod had a list of compliment graphics/texture mods that he/she recommended so I do not think there is any compatibility issues amongst the mods.
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post #40 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcEsSalvation View Post

You've just proved my point.
How many threads do you have? For me, it's 8. 2/8 = 25%. My CPU will only be able to go to 25% usage on Skyrim. That is low usage, however the game is using 100% of the available CPU resources
Decreasing resolution and not getting any framerate increase is a good sign of script overloading.
Would be better if it used more than 2 threads.

Overall CPU usage was less than 15% and the Cores were not loaded 100% according to MSI AB, so it wasn't a CPU bottleneck but the game wasn't be able to cope very well with the amount of mods installed. Low fps doesn't always indicate a CPU bottleneck that was my point. Also you didn't notice that I said I overclocked the CPU and GPU with 0 fps impact, I also underclocked them and installed my spare HD 7950.
Hasewell has better single threaded performance than both Nehalem and Piledriver combined. Probably 35% faster than Nehalem and over 50% faster than Piledriver on average. Nehalem already when clocked enough with a reasonable amount of mods can give 60 fps in most cities and 99% GPU usage most of the time and that even with a 780 Ti .

http://anandtech.com/bench/product/697?vs=837

FX 8350 @ 4 GHz => 4319
i5 4670K @ 3.8 GHz => 7335 , @ 4.0 GHz => ~7720

At stock around 70% faster, and at same clocks around 79% faster...

Quote:
Originally Posted by KJZ87 View Post

Here is my plugin list. Let me know if this helps:

ModList.docx 12k .docx file

Those are the most primary mods that can affect your framerate.

RevampedExteriorFog.esp=1 (Might have slight performance hit, it is not too demanding overall)
StaticMeshImprovementMod.esp=1
Skyrim Flora Overhaul.esp=1 (Areas full of grass, this might murder your framerate especially with ENB)
Footprints.esp=1
EnhancedLightsandFX.esp=1
CinematicFireFX.esp=1 (When you spam Fire spells this can drop your fps below 60 fps depending on the location)

UFO - Ultimate Follower Overhaul.esp=1 This can have an effect on your framerate too tongue.gif if you have an army of followers following you everywhere.

Also if you have parallax texture mods installed those also can affect your framerate .

BTW if you get low GPU usage and your fps is locked to 60 fps that doesn't mean you are CPU bottlenecked BTW, you just hit the limit of 60 fpd without utilizing all of the GPU power.
Edited by HeadlessKnight - 4/17/14 at 1:13am
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