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Will there be an AM4 socket or new AM3+ chipset soon...or ever? - Page 2

post #11 of 30
AMD CPU / iGPU / dGPU cache coherency protocol: MOESI

Carrizo and 2015 Opteron/FX will have full cache coherency between;
CPU's L2
CPU's L3
GPU's L2
System RAM
Graphics RAM

---
Both Carrizo and 2015 Opteron/FX will have Direct Memory Access Accelerators and Cache Access Accelerators. (Accelerators = Offloaders)

----
Carrizo has a blanket virtual/physical memory across CPU, iGPU, dGPU.

While the 2015 CPU, will have it across; CPUs and dGPUs. hUMA replaces ccNUMA.
---
To match PCIe, there was a massive upgrade to Hypertransport.

2011 - 2014 | FX/Opteron 16-bit HT 3.1 = 10.4 GB/s (5.4 GB/s bi-directional)
2015 | FX/Opteron 16-bit HT 4.0 = 32 GB/s (16 GB/s bi-directional)

~3x increase in bandwidth, and that is only half-speed mode. Hypertransport 4.0 can last up to PCIe 4.0. Unified cHT/PCIe 3.0 to Unified cHT/PCIe 4.0 without much effort other than verifying electric signals.
Edited by Seronx - 4/17/14 at 2:13pm
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post #12 of 30
Seronix how do you know so much? Are you an AMD employee? Shhh... You can tell us. I promise I won't tell!

No seriously though. Does any of this look likely to happen? Is this all theory? I need to know! biggrin.gif
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post #13 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastair View Post

Seronix how do you know so much? Are you an AMD employee? Shhh... You can tell us. I promise I won't tell!

No seriously though. Does any of this look likely to happen? Is this all theory? I need to know! biggrin.gif
I'm not employed by anyone.
----
I'm actually just spouting out what was meant to come after Dublin and Macau; which are the 20-core/10-core Opterons 15h family 20h-2Fh model 28nm processors. The FX/Opterons that are coming are 15h family 40h-4Fh model processors. There is enough information left in Graphic Core Next, "Server Fusion," and etc slides. Which allows me to have accuracy when talking about it.
Edited by Seronx - 4/17/14 at 2:08pm
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post #14 of 30
Won't it be a better design if AMD replaces RAM with a giant super-high speed block of hUMA capable memory, then we can have dGPU's with no memory for AMD systems and dGPUs with memory on "legacy" systems (all Intel and older AMD systems), I always think of this as a better design but that might be a great design challenge for board designers & manufacturers (??). Like having 16/32 GB of high-density high-speed memory chip/s (GDDR5 or something better suited for this design?) that will act as system RAM for CPU, VRAM for GPU and other purposes. Idk whether an asynchronously clocked memory exists which can work over multiple clock frequencies and latency while accessing the same memory (a kind of multi-port memory)
    
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post #15 of 30
I have a serious thought that they are rebooting AMx with the new AM1 socket. Although this prospect seems silly unless they make it so you can have 1-4 sockets on the board and eventually integrate it next year into a new chip processor line with more cores and gpu gcn based with HSA.
Edited by SpeedyVT - 4/17/14 at 8:41pm
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post #16 of 30
The scary thing is what Seronix says makes 100% sense. The FX processors were based off of Opty's. And AMD won't leave themselves so open by not having a server based CPU in the market. So I deduce that AMD is probably working on getting SteamRoller and 28nm working on their Opty's and once that happens we will see it trickle in to FX's and what ever socket this all happens to be on.
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post #17 of 30
Servers ---> Desktop again? We don't want more cores, 8 is more than enough, we just need 8 strong cores with all the new technologies that AMD can think of integrating like PCIe 3.0, HSA+hUMA across the MoBo, etc.
    
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post #18 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastair View Post

The scary thing is what Seronix says makes 100% sense. The FX processors were based off of Opty's. And AMD won't leave themselves so open by not having a server based CPU in the market. So I deduce that AMD is probably working on getting SteamRoller and 28nm working on their Opty's and once that happens we will see it trickle in to FX's and what ever socket this all happens to be on.

AMD already has several Steamroller and Excavator-based processors planned for the server market, however they won't have any more than two modules.



They will have server CPU's in the market, as it's not like Warsaw will disappear into thin air or anything. AMD's server market-share is almost nonexistent however, and it's only been further diminishing as the years have gone on. I guess they figured the R&D costs weren't worth it to develop a SR/EX-derived successor to Warsaw/Abu Dhabi or anything, and the process nodes may have something to do with this as well.
post #19 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by imran27 View Post

Servers ---> Desktop again?
Nope, the difference this time AMD built a multi-use device. It can satisfy the Enterprise-group and the Enthusiast-group with the same chip.

Enterprise users -> 100W, 65W, 45W
EnteUsers want high performance with a lower TCO. (Replace every 2-3 years, etc)

Enthusiast users -> 150W, 180W, 220W
EnthUsers want high performance with a longer lifespan. (Replace every 4-5 years, etc)
Quote:
Originally Posted by imran27 View Post

We don't want more cores, 8 is more than enough, we just need 8 strong cores with all the new technologies that AMD can think of integrating like PCIe 3.0, HSA+hUMA across the MoBo, etc.
You are going to get more cores whether you like it or not!

One core wasn't enough.
Two cores wasn't enough.
Four cores wasn't enough.
Six cores wasn't enough.
Eight cores are DEFINITELY not enough!

You'll get sixteen strong cores with all the technologies that AMD can throw at you. Remember you have turbo core and I wouldn't be surprised if AMD increased the granularity for the turbo core.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaroonGTX View Post

They will have server CPU's in the market, as it's not like Warsaw will disappear into thin air or anything. AMD's server market-share is almost nonexistent however, and it's only been further diminishing as the years have gone on. I guess they figured the R&D costs weren't worth it to develop a SR/EX-derived successor to Warsaw/Abu Dhabi or anything, and the process nodes may have something to do with this as well.
Warsaw will be the last Piledriver CPU, but it does point to where AMD is going for enterprise.

The Process Nodes;
28nm(lenient) or 20nm(tight)

28nm bulk, active volume production since late 2012, inactive volume production since late 2010.
28nm FDSOI, is in its ramping volume production since late 2013.
20nm LPM, is in its ramping volume production since late 2013.
14nm FDSOI, is in its earliest risk production with ramping volume production in late 2014.

AMD said they are transitioning to 20nm within the first half of 2014. 20nm LPM and 14nm FDSOI are the closest candidates for 20nm.

The exact wording:
"We are fully top to bottom in 28-nanometer now across all of our products, and we are transitioning to both 20-nanometer and to FinFET over the next couple of quarters, in terms of designs."

It is actually quite interesting because this was said in Q3 2013, in which 14nm FDSOI started prototyping. Also notice AMD didn't specify 20nm Bulk or SOI or FinFET or FinFET SOI. AMD said "20nm" in a generalization and "FinFETs" which would only be bulk.

Then you have this;
http://electronics360.globalspec.com/article/4146/common-platform-preps-for-soi-finfets-at-10nm

APUs go bulk FinFETs. (Density is better than performance).
and
CPUs stay SOI. (Performance is better than density).

This would actually technically explain why there was no 28nm enterprise/enthusiast part. Instead we got SOI stopgaps called Centurian and Warsaw.
Edited by Seronx - 4/18/14 at 2:33am
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post #20 of 30
I personally would prefer more cores since most of the tasks that I do rely on MT performance, but for general crowd, gamers, etc this isn't a requirement. But this I guess doesn't matter because these CPUs may nor be targeted towards general crowd, they'll be towards enthusiasts and we want maximum that we can get.

So....20nm/14 nm SOI means more cores offering better performance at lower power consumption and much higher overclocking headroom, looks perfect thumb.gif

So AMD may do what they did with Hawaii, launch it all of a sudden.....
    
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