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[C|NET] AMD takes exception to Intel's tablet rebates - Page 2

post #11 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

Are we back in Athlon 64 times?

and Intel won that battle hands down in term of sales, AMD's pathetic legal team couldn't even get 1/10th of Intel's profit from Court.
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post #12 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlock View Post

and Intel won that battle hands down in term of sales, AMD's pathetic legal team couldn't even get 1/10th of Intel's profit from Court.
....what? Intel was found guilty.

How are you judging the competence of AMD's legal team unless you were involved?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Durquavian View Post

Actually it is quite close, only difference actually is the lack of agreement to exclude. And really it depends on the size of the rebate. Think more at a business level, how long do you think these rebates can last? It isn't uncommon that certain parts of a company lose money and I gather that is what Intel is doing here. But the remaining fact is why aren't OEMs using them already? Simply put cost and whether they really have a performance lead in that segment apparently is moot. I am sure Intel has enough OEMs in their back pocket that even the rebate will would prove unnecessary.
No, it is different.... they key factor is not the size of the rebate. It is the marketshare.

Intel does not come close to having a majority of the mobile and tablet market. OEMs are not fully embracing x86 in this place due to ARM is already established.
Edited by DuckieHo - 4/18/14 at 6:04am
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post #13 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

....what? Intel was found guilty.


Guilty or not doesn't matter, the point is Intel earned way more from its practice than what they had to pay as a result of the lawsuit(Therefore it is a successful business move). Hence Intel won and AMD lost due to its legal team's failure to extract more from said lawsuit.

John Rockefeller & Standard Oil was found guilty, so what? He kept his fortune and his family still holds control the oil industry after the lawsuit.
Edited by sherlock - 4/18/14 at 6:37am
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post #14 of 135
How exactly is this different from simply lowering the price of your product?

Surely you can't claim that is an anti-competitive, shady, evil thing to do?

Have you ever bought something on sale? If so, you're EVIL
post #15 of 135
Thread Starter 
So if richer company A takes a short-term hit to lower their prices against lesser company b that cannot afford compete with the newly lowered prices. this situation isn't anti-competitive?
post #16 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mand12 View Post

How exactly is this different from simply lowering the price of your product?

Surely you can't claim that is an anti-competitive, shady, evil thing to do?

Have you ever bought something on sale? If so, you're EVIL

Going beyond loss leader is considered anti-competitive. Essentially, IIRC dropping your prices below the ability to cover your fixed costs is considered anti-competitive and also only really possible for a company that has essentially a monopolistic advantage in the market thus able to bear the losses far longer than any other competitor. In the world of business, if you can't even cover your fixed costs then you're going to be gone very fast unless as stated before. Sale prices (at least for consumers; intra-business is a different story) hardly ever drop to the level that they don't cover any variable costs. But, the reasons for why consumers hardly see such pricing directly is because of the risk that they'll demand that unsustainable price and will be unwilling to pay more than it.
     
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post #17 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

Yes and that small difference is the thing that separates an illegal anti-competitive move and a normal business move to compete better against your competitors.

Many companies try the loss leader strategy. Nothing wrong about it and it often leads to some of the best products out there. See xbox 360 vs. PS3 at launch for example.

And OEMs weren't using BayTrail as much as intel wanted because the BOM cost for the entire platform (not just the soc) was high. Or that's at least what I remember being the reason. That cost is going down though, and as Anand said in his latest podcast, intel is bringing out BT parts to compete in the lower end ARM market as well, they're going after stuff like mediatek arm socs with aggressive pricing.

What you're basically saying is that being anti-competitive and pricing products aggressively is quite close. That must mean that AMD is almost always borderline anti-competitive. rolleyes.gif
If AMD's SOCs were actually good they would be used more. Besides, how do you even know that they're good for the profit margins for the OEM? ARM SKUs are extremely cheap and some Baytrail ones are as well, even more so once the lower end possibly sub $10 BT SKUs appear.

AMD's APUs aren't a good competitor for ARM SOCs or intel's SOCs. Once you get into tablet form factors intel has performance and power consumption and arm has power consumption and price. APUs might be efficient if you include GPU in your efficiency calculations and think about some full load scenarios but if you want to build a cheap tablet with good battery life you go arm, and if you want to build a well performing tablet with good battery life you go intel. Fact of the matter is that idle power and power while browsing facebook is what matters most.

Of course intel's aggressive pricing is trying to fix the cost issues so they're not limited to high end designs.
Lol! What? AMD SoC's need to sell more? They already shipped more than 10M considering the consoles alone. I didn't flinch an eyebrow when you stated your regular "Intel is the way to go for performance". AMD demonstrated a 3.5w Temash apu that ran League of Legends at 30 fps. Contrary to that, I haven't seen Intel campaign their game performance, ever.
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post #18 of 135
What Intel is doing is called "dumping".
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post #19 of 135
AMD has cheap prices, everybody loves the under dog. OMG SUCH PRICE / PERFORMANCE.

Intel lowers prices, everybody think they are being anti-competitive. OMG PRICES TOO CHEAP BAD FOR EVERYONE.

It's not like they are paying OEMs to not use ARM or AMD, yet.
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post #20 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLAWNOOB View Post

It's not like they are paying OEMs to not use ARM or AMD, yet.

 No. They're paying them to use an Intel chip. Which is basically the same thing, only with nicer words.

   
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