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[VC] AMD: No 20nm GPUs this year - Page 7

post #61 of 146
What are you guys talking about? Nvidia not releasing anything recently?

They just announced Titan-Z. GTX 780 Ti came out around the time of 290x too.

I hate to be a downer, but we're not seeing any new dies from AMD or Nvidia in the high end for a long time. At least until 2015.

And I'd also like to remind you folks that when companies talk about "H2 2014" or "q4 2014" that's actually in 2015. Businesses use some goofy thing to push dates around.

The fabs are a mess for everyone. Intel can't fill capacity. AMD CPUs are a disaster and they have no where to release a new FX style CPU. AMD GPU and Nvidia GPU have been stuck on 28nm for years.

We are going to see a redo of the 7970 and GTX 680 again. Don't forget, those were both dies that were traditionally sold in the $300 given their size. But AMD and Nvidia both hiked the prices up because they were the fastest things they could. So yeah, you might run around going "wow, Nvidia was so nice! They didn't raise the price of GTX 680 when it couldn't meet demand!", but they already priced it way above where a die of that size should have cost. If Nvidia was looking out for you, they wouldn't have released a fully enabled die to improve yields.

AMD gouged with 7970 as well, but they at least were selling a partially disabled die to make yields decent and to make it so you could actually buy 7970.

Don't forget, GTX 680 was basically a full GK104 with hardly any availability. Nvidia then released a partially disabled GTX 670 and it replaced the full die.
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post #62 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaC View Post

Techreport suggests that the bigger dies won't have more than 2MB L2 cache. I believe that will be the case for GM206/GM106 or GM204/GM104 but not GM200/GM210.
Quote:
Originally Posted by http://techreport.com/review/26050/nvidia-geforce-gtx-750-ti-maxwell-graphics-processor 
Beyond the SM, the other big architectural change in Maxwell is the growth of the L2 cache. The GM107's L2 cache is 2MB, up from just 256KB in the GK107. This larger cache should provide two related benefits: bandwidth amplification for the GPU's external memory and a reduction in the power consumed by doing expensive off-chip I/O. Caches keep growing in importance (and size) for graphics hardware for exactly these reasons. I'm curious to see whether the upcoming larger chips based on Maxwell follow the GM107's lead by including L2 caches eight times the size of their predecessors. That may not happen. Nvidia GPU architect Jonah Alben tells us the L2 cache size in Maxwell is independent of the number of SMs or flops on tap.

Hmm, thanks for that info, I wasn't aware of that. Although they don't suggest that the bigger dies won't have more than 2 MB of L2 cache, just that it's not necessarily a predictable added amount compared to the recently released Maxwell parts. Say, I thought that (until you mentioned this) the GTX 880 would have 8 MB of L2, with the midrange having 4 MB. What he is saying is that it's not necessarily like I said. The GTX 880 may end up having 6 MB of L2 and the GTX 860 series may have 3 or 4 MB. Or, it could actually be more, he didn't deny that.
Edited by tpi2007 - 4/18/14 at 8:20pm
 
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post #63 of 146
Makes me feel better about getting a 780. Still disappointing.
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post #64 of 146
I heard the transcript and this is probably not the case.
post #65 of 146
Doesn't matter if you heard it or read it, AMD's own stance at the moment is 28nm for all products this year.
 
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post #66 of 146
meh. my wallet is ready for yall thinking about upgrading to 20nm tech. I'll gladly take all your old tech :-P
post #67 of 146
No surprise. Don't expect anything from Nvidia either. Oh well, our new amd and nvidia cards are fine to run supercharged PS4 and xbox one ports
post #68 of 146
Quote:
Worldwide semiconductor capital equipment spending totaled $33.8 billion in 2013, an 11.5% decline year-over-year, says Gartner.

Wafer-level manufacturing equipment demand performed above the market, with strength in lithography and associated processes, while backend manufacturing segments fared significantly worse than average, the firm says.

Applied Materials held onto the No. 1 spot based on its relative strength in deposition and etch. Relative strength in lithography – albeit with limited sales in extreme ultraviolet – helped ASML to retain the No. 2 position. Lam Research moved into the No. 3 spot as a result of its strong performance in etch and deposition. Tokyo Electron, like other companies headquartered in Japan, was impacted by the significant decline in the yen-to-US-dollar exchange rate, as well as unfavorable customer buying patterns, says Gartner.

Notable is the further rise of the sales share of the top 10 vendors, now at 70%, compared with 68% in 2012. The top five vendors command nearly 57% of the total market, up 5 points from the prior year.

Wafer-level manufacturing outperformed the market in 2013, on relative strength in dry etch, lithography, manufacturing automation and deposition. Spending was selective, focused on upgrades and latest-technology buys with little addition of capacity. Logic spending focused on preparing for 20nm/14nm production. Only a few subsegments managed to expand — most notably, steppers in lithography, nontube chemical vapor deposition, conductor etch, rapid thermal processing and furnaces, and select process control segments, according to the research firm.

In the backend segments, all major categories experienced significant declines. The fourth quarter of 2013 was particularly slow, as major semiconductor assembly and test services vendors pushed out orders because of market uncertainty.

Source

Spending less on equipment will delay the transition also.
post #69 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

Doesn't matter if you heard it or read it, AMD's own stance at the moment is 28nm for all products this year.
at the moment...
This transcript isn't that recent. Besides graphics client is something different from what we are looking for. I sincerely doubt that they won't go for 20nm and they more recent GloFo gpu statement is a good reason for me to keep my pov that way.
post #70 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

This transcript isn't that recent.

The transcript is from the Q1 conference call. Happened earlier this week.

>not recent
>this week

Also they said all products. And even if they didn't graphics client = discrete GPU.
 
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