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building my first rig - Page 2

post #11 of 68
If you are never going to have two video cards you dont need more then 350 to 550 watts no matter which video card
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Seravee
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post #12 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caleb-M View Post

Well after years of just buying off the shelf computers, I've decided i wanted to try my hand at building one. My goals where for a rig that could sit in the living room hooked to my projector and be a mild gaming/ entertainment rig that won't need any upgrades for 2-3 years. So this is what i have planed

CPU- FX8320 3.5ghz 8-CORE plan to clock to 4-4.5ghz

This seems like a reasonably conservative and appropriate overclocking goal for the HSF and motherboard chosen. This should work alright.

Something to ponder: Similar cost to implement Intel Haswell chips (which run quiet on the stock HSF and use about 1/3rd the power compared to an OCed FX-8), will have ~30-40% higher performance than the FX-8320@4.4ghz in CPU bound workloads that are less threaded (photo editing, gaming, web-page rendering, etc). On the other hand, the FX-8320@4.4ghz will have 30-40% higher performance than those Haswell alternatives in highly threaded workloads (like software development with many VMs running, software compiling, video editing). Specifically I'm considering the i5-4570/4670 and E3-1220V3 here, which tend to be ~$180-200. A B85 board with similar features as the 970 chipset is about $80, and you can drop the $35-40 HSF and just run these haswell chips on the stock cooler.

I bring this up because while there is a certain "fun" novelty to owning an 8-threaded performance tunable FX chip, they don't always represent the best value in terms of performance/$ for "normal" personal computers. I know for a fact that many people are swept up by the lure of high core count CPUs, just like consumers were swept up by the lure of high GHZ CPUs a decade ago. There are architectural differences in CPU design that make core count and GHZ very difficult to use as measures of CPU performance unless we're comparing CPUs in the same family.
Quote:
MOBO-ASUS M5A97 R2.0

This is a rational high value 970 chipset board with enough VRM robustness to achieve a conservative overclock on an FX-8 series CPU.
Quote:
GPU- EVGA GTX 750 TI SC
If you're getting this for $99 it's hard to argue. If it were me though, I would want to pair this ultra-efficient GPU with an ultra-efficient CPU.
Quote:
CPU Cooler- COOLER MASTER HYPER 212 EVO
The 212EVO is one of the nicest performing HSFs in its price class and is incredibly popular. I often like to throw out an alternative suggestion here just to get people to branch out from this "boring" go-to choice. The Silverstone AR01 is similarly priced and uses 3x8mm heatpipes instead of 4x6mm heatpipes. Performance is similar, but the blue fan will match the Asus board a little better from an aesthetic perspective, and you can say that you "branched out" and did something different than the norm. wink.gif
Quote:
RAM-Kingston HyperX 8G (2X4) 1600MHz
There are a bunch of "hyperX" models out there. Avoid the 1.65V 1600mhz kits, those are bottom barrel chips. The Kingston HyperX LoVo 1600mhz kits are great quality for the money (~$75 for a 2x4 on amazon, 1.35V 1600-9 kit).

When picking a memory kit, I always look for kits that exceed the minimum standards for DDR3, regardless of whether or not it will actually be used at the higher speed or lower voltage or tighter timings. The fact that it is sold as exceeding the standard means there is more headroom (room for error) to keep the kit out of trouble, but will also mean more headroom for performance tuning if you desire to do that.
Quote:
HD-Western Digital 1TB
Red? Purple? Blue? Black? hehe.... lots to choose from!

If you're not going to put an SSD in this machine, then opt for the Seagate ST1000DX001 instead. (hybrid drive with internal SSD cache)

If you do plan to upgrade or include an SSD. Go with either the budget conscious WD10EZEX, or, if you can spring for a little more, the WD1003FZEX.
Quote:
Power Supply- EVGA SuperNova 750w
The FX-8320 overclocked even below 4.5ghz can still be ~200W depending on how much voltage is required to get it to the desired overclock. This will represent the most power hungry part of the whole machine. Add up the dissipation of the rest of the machine (drives, fans, vrm losses, GPU, chipsets, RAM, NIC, sound, controllers, etc) and anything over ~350-400W is just going to be purely untapped overhead. I'm all for overhead, but a 750W PSU is going to be over DOUBLE the peak theoretical draw of such a machine. Unless there are plans for this overhead (future GPU upgrades would be the primary) then this can be scaled back a bit without a problem.
Quote:
So what do you guys think2

I think that if you pulled back on the PSU, scrapped the HSF, and used an $80 B85 board you could have an E3-1230V3 in the same budget, which would offer up to ~40% higher performance in lightly threaded workloads (gaming, etc), while having no performance penalty in parallel workloads (the $245 E3-1230V3 is a hyperthreaded quad core haswell, like an i7). The downside is that you don't get to poke and performance tune a machine, and you loose the novelty of an "8 core" CPU. (The E3-1230V3 is an 8 threaded CPU with 4 very powerful cores, each capable of working on 2 threads at a time, sort of like a "piledriver module." A single hyper-threaded haswell core @ 3.3ghz will match the performance of an entire piledriver module (2 cores) @ ~4.25GHZ) With the machine switched over to an E3, the entire machine combined under a load will dissipate less power than the overclocked FX-8320 by itself.
Edited by mdocod - 4/19/14 at 8:31am
     
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Manjaro Linux Samsung 21.5" LCD E2009WFP E2009WFP 
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Seasonic G 550W Modular Fractal Design Core 3500 
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FX-6300, 4.7 GHZ@1.43V GA-970A-UD3P GTX 460 768MB Mixed DIMMs. 2x4GB + 2x8GB @ 1600-8-8-8 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Toshiba THNSNH 19nm 256GB 1TB Spinpoint F3 WD RE3 1TB WD RE3 1TB 
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yes CM Seidon 120V SolydK OpenSuse 13.1 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
FX-8350 990X EVO R2.0 Sparkle GTX460 768MB ballistix tactical 2 x 8GB 
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Toshiiba THNSNH 256GB Enterprise RE3 1TB Asus BD combo drive Artic A30 
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Manjaro Linux Samsung 21.5" LCD E2009WFP E2009WFP 
PowerCase
Seasonic G 550W Modular Fractal Design Core 3500 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
FX-6300, 4.7 GHZ@1.43V GA-970A-UD3P GTX 460 768MB Mixed DIMMs. 2x4GB + 2x8GB @ 1600-8-8-8 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Toshiba THNSNH 19nm 256GB 1TB Spinpoint F3 WD RE3 1TB WD RE3 1TB 
Optical DriveCoolingOSOS
yes CM Seidon 120V SolydK OpenSuse 13.1 
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Linux Mint 9-32 bit // Linux Mint 17-64 bit  Manjaro Xfce Samsung 21.5" HannsG 21.5" sideways! 
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Sticky ATNG Rosewill Green 630W NZXT Gamma Basic Microsoft corded 
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Seagate ST1000DM003 Asus BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS Zalman CNPS5X Linux Mint 15 
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post #13 of 68
After using an M5A97 for some time, I would not recommend it for anyone who intends to do anything other than simply turn a PC on and leave it alone. Lack of features, poor chipset performance (compared to a 990) which hindered the south bridge performance, very limited overclocking. Only has 4+1 CPU power. The FX 8320 will be hampered anyway, and thats before you try to overclock it.
After upgrading from the M5A97 to the Sabertooth 990FX r2.0, its so damn clear why it costs more than double. Not entirely sure how prices vary in the US, but in the UK a Gigabyte 990 UD3 is not much more than an Asus M5A97 and contains a far superior chipset.

I would suspect that you will struggle to get over 4.0Ghz from an FX 8320 on an M5A97, even though it is a good budget board. Unless you disable some of those CPU cores, but whats the point in buying an '8' core FX 8320 if you disable 2 or 4 of those cores in order to push an overclock higher?
An i3 would be suitable (and more cost effective) for a limited entertainment system, ideal for a home cinema or media machine though. An i5 is where I would be tempted to go, superior single threaded performance over the 8320, even on the older Ivy Bridge models rather than Haswell.

PSU wise, i'd consider a hybrid modular around 500w. Something like the Corsair CX500M.
I would drop the 750 Ti in favour of an R9 270.
8Gb of 1600Mhz RAM is ideal, and the norm these days. No problems with Kingston, very solid and reliable products.
The 212 is a cracking CPU cooler, make sure to use a good quality thermal compound like MX-4.
Windows 7 x64 is fine. 1Tb Western Digital HDD is going to be fine as well.
The Case on the other hand, lacks the features which most system builders look for. Simply having alot of 120mm fan locations doesnt make for a good case. If you can, get a Carbide 200R. Best budget case going, includes features normally only found on considerably more expensive cases.
Edited by Ricwin - 4/19/14 at 9:32am
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HyperX Savage 240Gb Antec H1200 + Noctua NF-F12 PPC 3000rpm Windows 10 Pro x64 Acer K222HQL 
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post #14 of 68
Having overhead in the PSU is never bad, especially if he can make that 1 PSU purchase last him 2-3 rigs, rather than buying another one if he ever decides to SLI or Xfire.

Instead of the one you are going for you should go with this one 79 for Gold fully Modular
post #15 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by tupamaro16 View Post

Having overhead in the PSU is never bad, especially if he can make that 1 PSU purchase last him 2-3 rigs, rather than buying another one if he ever decides to SLI or Xfire.

Instead of the one you are going for you should go with this one 79 for Gold fully Modular

That PSU is not very good so no he should not go with that one

http://www.overclock.net/t/1476935/why-you-should-not-buy-an-evga-supernova-nex650g-750g

If you read this you can see how bad it really is
http://www.overclock.net/t/1482157/700-750-watts-comparison-thread#post_22109815

80 plus and modular has nothing to do with quality of any kind
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Seravee
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post #16 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricwin View Post

....Only has 4+1 CPU power. The FX 8320 will be hampered anyway, and thats before you try to overclock it.
....
I would suspect that you will struggle to get over 4.0Ghz from an FX 8320 on an M5A97,.

The M5A97 R2.0 has 6+2 phase heatsunk VRMs. Good for ~180-200W peak power to the CPU with good air-flow. It can overclock FX-6300s to ~4.8-5ghz and FX-8320's to ~4.5ghz depending on the specific chip.
     
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
FX-8350 990X EVO R2.0 Sparkle GTX460 768MB ballistix tactical 2 x 8GB 
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Toshiiba THNSNH 256GB Enterprise RE3 1TB Asus BD combo drive Artic A30 
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Manjaro Linux Samsung 21.5" LCD E2009WFP E2009WFP 
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Seasonic G 550W Modular Fractal Design Core 3500 
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FX-6300, 4.7 GHZ@1.43V GA-970A-UD3P GTX 460 768MB Mixed DIMMs. 2x4GB + 2x8GB @ 1600-8-8-8 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Toshiba THNSNH 19nm 256GB 1TB Spinpoint F3 WD RE3 1TB WD RE3 1TB 
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yes CM Seidon 120V SolydK OpenSuse 13.1 
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Linux Mint 9-32 bit // Linux Mint 17-64 bit  Manjaro Xfce Samsung 21.5" HannsG 21.5" sideways! 
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Seagate ST1000DM003 Asus BC-12B1ST/BLK/B/AS Zalman CNPS5X Linux Mint 15 
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LG IPS224V-PN Logitec K360 FSP 400W Aurum S 80+ gold Prodigy 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
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Toshiiba THNSNH 256GB Enterprise RE3 1TB Asus BD combo drive Artic A30 
OSMonitorMonitorMonitor
Manjaro Linux Samsung 21.5" LCD E2009WFP E2009WFP 
PowerCase
Seasonic G 550W Modular Fractal Design Core 3500 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
FX-6300, 4.7 GHZ@1.43V GA-970A-UD3P GTX 460 768MB Mixed DIMMs. 2x4GB + 2x8GB @ 1600-8-8-8 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Toshiba THNSNH 19nm 256GB 1TB Spinpoint F3 WD RE3 1TB WD RE3 1TB 
Optical DriveCoolingOSOS
yes CM Seidon 120V SolydK OpenSuse 13.1 
OSOSMonitorMonitor
Linux Mint 9-32 bit // Linux Mint 17-64 bit  Manjaro Xfce Samsung 21.5" HannsG 21.5" sideways! 
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Sticky ATNG Rosewill Green 630W NZXT Gamma Basic Microsoft corded 
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A10-6800k 4.8GHZ @ 1.375V, 1.2GHZ iGPU Gigabyte GA-F2A85XN-WIFI HD8670D Ripjaws 
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post #17 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdocod View Post

The M5A97 R2.0 has 6+2 phase heatsunk VRMs. Good for ~180-200W peak power to the CPU with good air-flow. It can overclock FX-6300s to ~4.8-5ghz and FX-8320's to ~4.5ghz depending on the specific chip.


That is certainly a handy upgrade over the M5A97 r1.0 which I had. 4+1 is barely enough to boot up!
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NZXT Grid+ V2  NZXT Hue 
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Intel i7 6700HQ nVidia GTX 965m 4Gb Hynix DDR4 8Gb 2400Mhz  Samsung 128Gb M.2 
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FX 8320 - 5.0GHz Asus Sabertooth 990FX R2.0 MSI RX 480 Gaming X 8Gb 16GB Corsair Vengeance Black LP - 1800MHz 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
HyperX Savage 240Gb Antec H1200 + Noctua NF-F12 PPC 3000rpm Windows 10 Pro x64 Acer K222HQL 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Razer Deathstalker Expert EVGA GQ 750w Gold NZXT S340 Black Edition SteelSeries Rival 700 
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NZXT Grid+ V2  NZXT Hue 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
Intel i7 6700HQ nVidia GTX 965m 4Gb Hynix DDR4 8Gb 2400Mhz  Samsung 128Gb M.2 
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HyperX Fury 480Gb Windows 10 x64 HP 1080p panel Omen by HP 
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post #18 of 68
Budget?which games do you play?what else do you do in your pc?
post #19 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by shilka View Post

That PSU is not very good so no he should not go with that one

http://www.overclock.net/t/1476935/why-you-should-not-buy-an-evga-supernova-nex650g-750g

If you read this you can see how bad it really is
http://www.overclock.net/t/1482157/700-750-watts-comparison-thread#post_22109815

80 plus and modular has nothing to do with quality of any kind

I've read through 50 + reviews of the PSU.. back then it used to be sold for around 100-120.. you are able to get it for $80.. and in February even for $55.

"Again for anyone that are going to misunderstand no the NEX models are not going to blow up nor are they super crappy like some of the stuff from HEC, the word here is mediocre and overpriced nothing more"

Run of the Mill Gold PSU that is no longer overpriced... for $80? Got any other advice beyond things based on no longer current prices?

Neither he nor 99% of people ever bother reading why voltage variations matter.. $ and time enjoying things DO matter.
post #20 of 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by tupamaro16 View Post

I've read through 50 + reviews of the PSU.. back then it used to be sold for around 100-120.. you are able to get it for $80.. and in February even for $55.

"Again for anyone that are going to misunderstand no the NEX models are not going to blow up nor are they super crappy like some of the stuff from HEC, the word here is mediocre and overpriced nothing more"

Run of the Mill Gold PSU that is no longer overpriced... for $80? Got any other advice beyond things based on no longer current prices?

Neither he nor 99% of people ever bother reading why voltage variations matter.. $ and time enjoying things DO matter.
Oh look another person trying to argue with shilka about PSU's. Lets see how this goes.
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