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[NYTimes] F.C.C., in ‘Net Neutrality’ Turnaround, Plans to Allow Fast Lane - Page 10

post #91 of 153
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Originally Posted by orlfman View Post

60vlrcwl.jpg

our future awaits unless this gets stopped.....

Seeing that picture gave me a feeling of white hot rage.....I feel like we are getting screwed over because the greedy 1% controls everything. Voting is an illusion to keep the majority in line. You know why they always say that you are supposed to keep your voting choices private? It's so people don't figure out that their votes aren't actually being counted and what they see on TV is just an arbitrary number depending on who the corporations what to win.
post #92 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by dave12 View Post

When you say Internet connections and ISPs what do you mean?

I can understand backbone infrastructure being a utility, but I would think that individual ISPs dealing with the public in a market would be a better arrangement? Fiber running down the main arteries as a public utility, lines to homes and apartments private?

No, EVERYTHING, the entire plant, from door to web - a utility.
    
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post #93 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by dave12 View Post

When you say Internet connections and ISPs what do you mean?

I can understand backbone infrastructure being a utility, but I would think that individual ISPs dealing with the public in a market would be a better arrangement? Fiber running down the main arteries as a public utility, lines to homes and apartments private?

No, EVERYTHING, the entire plant, from door to web - a utility.

There is a region in Iowa a ways south of me that has a public coop op that offers cable TV and Internet...Charter cable also works in that area. Guess what...the prices for Charter services are about half of what I have to pay
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post #94 of 153
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

No, EVERYTHING, the entire plant, from door to web - a utility.

To put this in another context:

No, EVERYTHING, from faucet to river - a utility.

FCC has the authority to make that designation. They did it for phones long ago. They can do it for internet any day they feel like.
post #95 of 153
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

I really HATE to say this...In fact, you know I hate to say this...But, it's rather undisputed that packet density has rocketed over the past decade.

I'm not playing devil's advocate because I think this is as crappy as everyone else but, the FCC as well as our dying infrastructure, really led to this development.

The Judge TOLD the FCC to re-define their statutes. Which was actually one of the primary reasons Obama got elected in the first place. Therefor, we have to believe that something WILL be done.

In the meantime, the FCC is attempting to regulate what actually happens. You can't exactly cry foul in this situation because they're doing what they can, with the restrictions that they're given atm.

The FCC needs a complete overhaul, no doubt but, most of this problem is caused by our infrastructure.

Remove the FCC from this discussion in it's entirety and you have a failing infrastructure with multiple hubs that can't handle the load from new apps/programs/games/general internet use.

Granted, it's largely the fault of the FCC that this occurs in the first place, packet density and packet density, alone, has already caused 2 major tables to drop within the past 3 months.

In fact, I remember when SWTOR practically caused the entire Austin table to drop...Plus the Cox failure to fix 2-3 primary routing hubs leading up to that table...It was an unmitigated disaster.

Of course, everyone blames Bioware...When it's actually the fault of AT&T + Cox...So rarely people hear about what actually happened.

We're having a similar issue now in D3. Intermittent random lag whenever data is requested from the server. - Quite frankly, the fact that they switched back to that table was very stupid. I still feel it's a server issue on their end but, it could actually be the table, again...Who knows.

Until we actually address the infrastructure issues at an ISP level, we won't be equipped to handle the density/traffic that currently passes through those hubs.

We won't ever be able to resolve this at the ISP level, especially now!

People can try and blame the infrastructure, but that only goes so far. As you said the FCC pretty much destroyed the infrastructure, and with what regulations they do have has prevented it from growing. However! That is small change compared to what has been done, in terms of damage, by the big ISPs and their greed.

The truth of the matter is that the Internet is quickly becoming almost a public service, like power, yet we aren't afforded the same protections and rights as power or other utilities. We aren't given access to the funding, grants and ultra low interest rate loans, as public utilities.

What most people aren't aware of is that power companies and telephone companies often have their own separate fiber infrastructures that only they can use, because it is for "utilities" only. Many of these networks capacity far exceeds the usage of them, but ISPs can't use them, because we aren't a utility.

A phenomenal example of this; 3 miles, over the air, from my home is a mountain top that we broadcast from, the power company also broadcasts from it for communication with their fleet in the area over radio. The drive up to the tower location is almost 45 minutes from my home, due to how winding and long the road itself is. Ground conditions are mostly solid rock, very little dirt sitting on top of it, it is a pretty rough area.

The power company ran FIBER to the top of that mountain and has ONE PHONE attached to it!!! All for in the event their tech is up there and needs to ring back to their office! An estimated $100,000 run of fiber to support A SINGLE PHONE on a mountain top that MIGHT get picked up every two years!!

Instead of using a wireless back-haul back down into the valley we asked them if we could pay for transport service. Guess what? We were told to go fly a kite, the Fiber is for "Utility" use only.

If we are going to fix our infrastructure the government needs to classify ISPs differently, provide funding, and change who can use what on the infrastructure.
    
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post #96 of 153
this is sad... unfortunately, it was bound to happen sooner or later, i guess i didnt think it would be this "soon"
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post #97 of 153
Thread Starter 
So Postal, as an ISP you would rather that the FCC classify ISPs as utilities?
post #98 of 153
I could permit this if there wasn't a cable monopoly with every cable business being owned by one company. If there was competition I'd totally support the various speed charging so that they can keep competitive with the other surrounding companies.
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post #99 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mand12 View Post

So Postal, as an ISP you would rather that the FCC classify ISPs as utilities?

Yes!

While it would make it extremely difficult to turn into a giant over the top monster company, like Comcast, it would be more "even" for everyone. I don't want to be a behemoth like Comcast, or even Charter, to be honest. When you get that big you get too much power, you start to lose focus on your own company, and it is just too much damn work. Not to mention if you end up going public and having to appease the public share holders.

As I said previously, being classified as a utility would still allow ISPs to make good money and be profitable, but it would also hold ISPs to certain standards. It would also open up ways to help them keep those standards; funding being one of the bigger ones. It also forces "competitors" to actually try and work together at least on some level.

Going back to my example of the Fiber to the phone on the mountain. If we were allowed to use that fiber to get data down off that mountain, it would free up enough spectrum (that is currently used by our back-haul) to add several more access points and provide more and better service to customers. Instead we have to use a precious resource, spectrum in the RF, as the back-haul.

Heck, about an hour and a half from where I am sitting a local Power Co-OP was given almost $10,000,000 to run fiber 17 miles to a school. The actual cost to run that fiber was closer to $500,000. With the balance they bought an entire new fleet of vehicles, expanded fiber even further and beyond the school, they went to town. It was all money provided via grants because they were a public utility, also operated as a "non-profit" so that helped them secure additional funding.
Edited by PostalTwinkie - 4/24/14 at 10:50am
    
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post #100 of 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheReciever View Post

Thats incorrect. Also South Korea has one of the best internet infrastructures albeit, you have definite oversight of what you can and cant do easily.
Yeah obviously south Korea has some of the best internet in the world, but I am talking about Japan. I've always heard the reason everyone goes to cafes there is because internet is expensive and not widespread. Also why so few people game on PC there compared to the rest of Asia.
 
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