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[MB] Japan Plans to Have a Power Plant in Space in a Decade - Page 5

post #41 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoxile View Post

After the fukushima incident I'm hard pressed to believe Japan could feasibly pull this off without error.

Totally unrelated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvarado View Post

Building it in space that way if anything goes wrong it'll blow up there biggrin.gif

Once it's all in space, there won't be much of anything able to blow up.

Some fuel for station keeping/adjustments would be needed, but launch is where the real potential for dangerous accidents are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mjolnir View Post

No, when it goes down it'll wrap its cable around 24000 miles of the earth's surface (That's about one loop around the earth). That won't buff out easily.

Even if it had such a tether (it does not), it would not survive reentry, or likely even significant displacement of it's position.

It would be little different from any other large artificial satellite reentry. Some large pieces would probably survive, but the chances of them doing significant damage would be minimal. The bulk of it would be things not likely to survive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mjolnir View Post

My question is, why even wire it?

They aren't.

We do not remotely have the technology to transmit power from orbit via a wire. No wire we can make can come any where near the strength to weight ratio needed to support it self for a 24k mile stretch. We do not have the ability for a space tether/elevator yet either.

The wires mentioned attach it to another part of the satellite, only six miles away. This other part is both a counterweight and the microwave transmitter than beams power down to a receiver on Earth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

COAL, GAS, WIND, SOLAR, WATER

Safe alternatives. Way safer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

Didn't realize Fukushima and Chernobyl were safe.

Last time I checked they were HORRIBLE.

Both of these disasters combined have released less than a fraction of a percent of as much radiation as burning coal has, not to mention other pollutants.

Coal contains significant traces of radio active isotopes, including uranium and thorium, and since we burn billions of tons of coal, the total radioactive release dwarfs all nuclear power plant accidents combined.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

Fukushima is safe?

In terms of total damage potential, it's way the hell safer than fossil fuels.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLAWNOOB View Post

According to the article, this thing has "pin point" accuracy, so in theory an attacker could tweak a few settings to increase intensity and concentrate all the microwaves into a tiny spot. Now imagine the attacker shine that at oil refineries and power plants.

You are taking the (sloppily written) article far too literally.

Pinpoint in this sense is the size of the receiving station, and the power density would probably be low enough that I could walk across the entire thickness of the beam and not suffer permanent harm.

Sure, if left pointed at somewhere it's not supposed to for too long, it could cause damage in the long term. However, it's not likely going to be able to aim at oblique angles, and because the collecting station is probably going to be quite a ways away from anything, I doubt it could be used as a weapon, even if there were no fail safes to regain control, or shut it down, in short order.
Edited by Blameless - 5/14/14 at 11:25pm
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post #42 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post

Coal mines are horrible blights on the landscape, if they catch fire it releases toxic smoke. Not to mention the sheer amount of miners and plant workers who die...Take it from someone whose country is massive on mining: Coal is ridiculously unsafe.

I was over your way a few years ago working on Hazelwood power plant near Traralgon, I saw the mess that brown coal sites like Hazelwood, Yallourn and Loy Yang make. On some days from my motel room in Traralgon I could see the plumes from four power plants. I'd happily take a nuke over that.
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post #43 of 107
Good for them. Coal works but isn't great and wind doesn't work and even if it did no one will let them build it next to there house. Giant space station power laser machine works for me.
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post #44 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoxile View Post

After the fukushima incident I'm hard pressed to believe Japan could feasibly pull this off without error.
A reactor outdated not updated and a combination of 2 disasters made a recovery impossible. Japan, China and Russia are actually embracing the fast fusion reactor a reactor that will solve our nuclear waste problems and bring them back to a point where only 300 years of safe storage is need. Görleben is built to last 2000 years without human intervention.

Of course there is also the fusion reactor plans for which a deuterium tritium test is scheduled soon. I recently visited the facility and I have little doubt that they will break the 1:1 barrier. Of course they can only use the facility for real fusion reactions so often due to them not wanting to make the hull too radioactive.

This plan sounds a bit too ambiguous I mean this is on the Tesla design scale and we all know how those energy plants did. Free energy is a lovely concept but it just doesn't work in a world where especially the government is a capitalist.
post #45 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLAWNOOB View Post

The microwave beam that is transmitted will cover 3km^2 of land. It would suck if you are a bird, or a sky diver.

According to the article, this thing has "pin point" accuracy, so in theory an attacker could tweak a few settings to increase intensity and concentrate all the microwaves into a tiny spot. Now imagine the attacker shine that at oil refineries and power plants.

The pin point accuracy isn't that far from true but no need to worry about anything happening with it. As per the source of the source article:
Quote:
"When laypeople hear these orbital solar farms described, they often ask if it would be safe to send a powerful beam of microwaves down to Earth. Wouldn’t it cook whatever’s in its path, like food in a microwave oven? Some people have a grisly mental image of roasted seagulls dropping from the sky. In fact, the beam wouldn’t even be intense enough to heat your coffee. In the center of the beam in a commercial SPS system, the power density would be 1 kilowatt per square meter, which is about equal to the intensity of sunlight. As the regulatory limit for sustained human exposure to microwaves is typically set at 10 watts per square meter, however, the rectenna site would have to be a restricted area, and maintenance workers who enter that zone would have to take simple precautions, such as donning protective clothing. But the land outside the rectenna site would be perfectly safe. At a distance of 2 km from its center, the beam’s power density will have already dropped below the regulatory threshold."

Source: http://spectrum.ieee.org/green-tech/solar/how-japan-plans-to-build-an-orbital-solar-farm

This article was somewhat poorly written. Another case of journalism watering down and/or warping real science without actually having a clue about it in the first place. Admittedly I have a grudge against mass media and the general portrayal of science research. I've done three magazine articles in the past two months in which one left me saying about my own research.
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post #46 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoxile View Post

After the fukushima incident I'm hard pressed to believe Japan could feasibly pull this off without error.

 

Jesus Christ, so a 9.0 Mw scale earthquake AND a tsunami hits the reactors and YET you still have habitable surrounding areas within a relatively small perimeter, and STILL you think that's a bad outcome? The managing afterwards was a disaster with the leakings and all, but the engineering behind those power plants was presumably the best on the entire freaking planet.

A 9.0 Mw earthquake hits ANY power plant in Spain, and seconds after Spain ceases to exist from the planet. Or France. Or pretty much any other country with nuclear reactors operating.

 

Facepalms aside, I really think this is a very cool idea. Wonder what frequency and power will they use for it...

   
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post #47 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

Yeah, this isn't happening, nice try though Japan. Can't even contain your own Nuke reactor. Why the hell would anyone build a nuke plant right on the ocean?

Don't really understand the desire for nuclear energy anyway, there are cleaner, safer alternatives. Nuclear waste is a huge problem, and meltdown, also a huge problem.

wow, i admire your ignorance
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post #48 of 107
this or fracking?
post #49 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

Jesus Christ, so a 9.0 Mw scale earthquake AND a tsunami hits the reactors and YET you still have habitable surrounding areas within a relatively small perimeter, and STILL you think that's a bad outcome? The managing afterwards was a disaster with the leakings and all, but the engineering behind those power plants was presumably the best on the entire freaking planet.
A 9.0 Mw earthquake hits ANY power plant in Spain, and seconds after Spain ceases to exist from the planet. Or France. Or pretty much any other country with nuclear reactors operating.

Facepalms aside, I really think this is a very cool idea. Wonder what frequency and power will they use for it...

I think people just hate nuclear power because it has more destructive energy if something does go wrong.

Lets face it, Coal and Gas are safer but a hell'uva lot more 'dirty'.

Wind and water are viable 'cleaner' alternatives but can't output anywhere near the power a Nuclear plant can. I believe Hydroelectric dams can but we're very limited where we can put those.

Personally, I've always been a proponant of Fusion. That'll produce more and be safer than Nuclear but in the event something would go wrong with a fusion plant you can bet all those anti-nuclear protesters would be wanting their little nuke plants back rolleyes.gif


It's an intresting Idea but I think it'd just be easier to make a solar plant and hook it upto batteries for the night tongue.gif
post #50 of 107
Will space junk be a factor? That would be my main concern.
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