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[MB] Japan Plans to Have a Power Plant in Space in a Decade - Page 9

post #81 of 107
Just to clear up a few things:

I dont think the tech mentioned in the article is going to feasible with in 10 years. 10-25 is more probable.

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/342/6154/60.full

Is the reason people doubt the veracity of claims that the science is "settled"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geologic_temperature_record

Reading and perusal through the supporting documentation is the reason why "sensible"(that being the keyword, yes I will freely admit we have loons that go 'Murica here) are skeptical. There are indications that the earth's global temperature is trending upwards in some places. However there is not much evidence that can conclusively prove that the warming trend is partly or solely caused by human activity.

Then little gems like this come along: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/05/13/indian_boffins_himalayan_glaciers_are_not_melting_ipcc_alarmist_global_warming/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2629171/Climate-change-scientist-claims-forced-new-job-McCarthy-style-witch-hunt-academics-world.html

You ask why people still doubt the veracity of the Climate Change hypothesis? There are a variety of reasons, ranging from plain lunacy, politics to legitimate scientific questions.

I hold little doubt that the Earth's temperature fluctuates. What I want to know is the extent that can be attributed solely to human causes. The earth has swung from a snowball with a narrowband of liquid water at the equator to 100+ F(37.7ish C) average temp with tropical rain forests in Siberia. All before humans ever existed.

There are long term trends in solar output, earth axis tilt and progression, gravitational interaction between Earth, Jupiter and Venus that are very hard to quantify as well.

Anytime someone raises a question in the scientific community about the veracity of data, methods used, possible unintentional bias(it happens) or conclusions from a certain data sets. They are immediately decried as deniers or lunatics. That is not sound science, that is the opposite of science. That is bias driven research to reach a desired outcome. You don't get to selectively chose and interpret the data you want, to get the conclusion you want.

If you conduct rigorous scientific experimentation, let the results speak for themselves. If others challenge your work, ask them to review and run a counter-study; support or disprove doesn't matter. There is a new stepping stone to push knowledge another step forward. There are still those that debate with Hawking over the nature of black holes, yet he doesn't deride them. Only in the field of climatology is a dissenting opinion ridiculed.

Specifically for the US, there are very serious political issues tied into the debate as well. We can't get into that here publicly. (Standing offer, If anyone outside of the US would like. I can attempt to explain the political aspect here in the States via IM.)

In short, the tech for the orbital solar array is still years away and old GEN 1&2 fission reactors need to be closed. We need to move to LFTRs. We could have them built, running and supplying power in 5 years, if the politicians got out of the way. LFTRs generate no waste, can be used to burn current waste, cant meltdown and are passively controlled. Meaning if they were to have an(unlikely) meltdown, they automatically open the evac tube, drain the salt to the containment vessel and cease all fission activity.
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post #82 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by myst88 View Post

I don't understand what this has to do with global warming? The push for greener cars is not necessarily linked to global warming. The bigger picture is to have cars that run on a sustainable energy source that is renewable and doesn't pollute. Greener cars are however meaningless if the electricity they use is produced by coal power plants or other highly polluting sources.

I agree that Nuclear and Hyrdo are currently our best bets currently and provide the cleanest energy. However Thorium seems to be much more interesting than Nuclear for various reasons. I invite you to google Thorium Ted Talk and watch the presentation by a scientist who works / worked for Nasa.
The increased greenhouse effect is the reason we have conventions and set targets for how much we polute. Greener cars is a need however NL will miss the goals completely and buy co2 bonds.(yes you can just buy it away horrible if you ask me)

Clearly as I stated we need to switch to hydrogen fuel cells they are just a metal hydride which you can bind large quantities of hydrogen to. The burn the H_2 in the engine after releasing it. The thing here is that it is very ineficient to produce hydrogen and you would indeed need to produce it green. Nuclear and hydro electric serves this purpose extremely well.

As for the thorium reactor it is pretty much the best solution in dealing with the waste.
post #83 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

Didn't realize Fukushima and Chernobyl were safe.

Last time I checked they were HORRIBLE.

Yes, and how many other nuclear plants worldwide have been operating 24/7 without incident for the past 40+ years, hmmm? The safety record of nuclear power is actually quite good...
post #84 of 107
TL;DR but what's the cable for? Are they gonna send the generated power down via electrical wires? biggrin.gif

And if 10000T comes down to earth --> should be nice wink.gif

Let's hope it does not hit a nuclear power plant... rolleyes.gif

Or if it falls in the safe ocean, it might create a... tsunami!
   
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post #85 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASUSfreak View Post

TL;DR but what's the cable for? Are they gonna send the generated power down via electrical wires? biggrin.gif

And if 10000T comes down to earth --> should be nice wink.gif

Let's hope it does not hit a nuclear power plant... rolleyes.gif

Or if it falls in the safe ocean, it might create a... tsunami!

The cable is for something called gravity gradient stabilization. The panels would be set into orbit and the tether with weighted bus would be used to stabilize it and keep it pointed in the correct direction without using propellants. NASA has been using that method since the late 60's with the DOD Gravity Experiment. The US Navel Research Lab had the TiPS (Tether Physics and Survivability Experiment) satellite in orbit for 10 years with a 6 km long 3 mm thick cable that worked quite well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_tether_missions

In all likelihood if Japan, or anyone else for that matter, managed to pull it off at a commercial scale (which even by their own estimates wouldn't be until nearly 2040 and would require a massive global effort source) the panels and mirrors would be destroyed on entry if something went wrong. It may be a big structure but the large majority of it would be lightweight materials. It would be a solar array and two floating mirrors and nothing more.
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post #86 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

Fukushima. It's effects are still horrible, killing incredible amounts of marine life and thousands of people have already died from it.

Oh for **** sake. Thousands of people died from the EARTHQUAKE AND TSUNAMI. The amount of confirmed deaths due to the meltdown? ZERO. Not one, not a hundred, ZERO.
post #87 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

the radiation from a thermal meltdown of multiple plants would wipe out an ASS TON of people, way more than a coal or some other plant would.

This is just factually, measurably, incorrect.

There is less dangerously radioactive material in all the nuclear fuel that has been ever been extracted and processed by humanity than what is pumped into the air by burning coal over the same period.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

and thousands of people have already died from it.

Very few people have died as a direct consequence of the meltdowns at Fukushima.

The earthquakes and tsunami killed quite a few, but the power plant didn't cause those.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

Imagine if 5 or 6 nuke plants in the US melted down simultaneously, we'd be totally screwed.

More people would likely die from the loss of electricity than from the radiological effects of five or six meltdowns.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

Nuclear, by its very nature, is contingent on man-power for it's upkeep to be safe. If that man power were to cease, nuclear meltdown would ensue.

This is not often the case for modern nuclear plants.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomagenesis View Post

And one more thing, please don't bring the total crock of crap global warming is into this, it's been thoroughly debunked.

Now I'm thoroughly convinced you work for an oil or coal company.
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post #88 of 107
Do it Japan! One step closer to Gundams!!!
post #89 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvarado View Post

Building it in space that way if anything goes wrong it'll blow up there biggrin.gif


And rain death and destruction all over the world and other countries.

Brilliant idea.
post #90 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by n0ypi View Post

Do it Japan! One step closer to Gundams!!!

Hopefully not UC timeline, as that means colonies falling on continents all over the place tongue.gif
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