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[Anand] Xiaomi Announces the MiPad with Tegra K1 and Denver - Page 3

post #21 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

Yes it matters, you are implying that this tablet will have those performance numbers.

Also we will see what Nvidia Mocha is like when it is released:rolleyes:

Are you claiming that Xiaomi is lying about the performance of their product?

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)






And also at the same time claiming that the previously leaked numbers of the 7.9 inch tablet (mocha) with the exact specs of the mipad aren't actually from the mipad?

Let's compare it to mullins for example.

in a 11.6 inch reference tablet mullins gets around 24K in 3dmark unlimited:



But since it throttles performance by around 10% when not plugged in (actual mobile use) :
Quote:
It’s worth noting that all the benchmarks were ran with the AMD Discovery tablet plugged in to AC power. When the tablet is benchmarked on battery power, I noticed a roughly 10% performance drop as the Mullins APU switches to using a more aggressive boost algorithm in attempt to lengthen battery life.

You can take 10% off that number so around 21.9K

Compare that to K1 in a 7.9 inch tablet getting 29.85K.

Around 35% faster in a smaller tablet...

I know it's hard to go against the anti-hype articles from the likes of Charlie but with these numbers out, guys like Charlie have been proven to be wrong about K1. I remember he was going on about how the K1 was pulling 20-60W or something like that to reach it's jetson tk1 GFLOPS numbers. With the actual measurements available from NV and from 3rd party sources it's safe to say that Charlie was once again wrong.
Edited by Alatar - 5/16/14 at 9:09am
 
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post #22 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by 98uk View Post

I get the impression that Chinese companies still haven't grasped the concept that having a Chinese name such as "Xaiomi" isn't a sign of quality in the Western world, nor particularly reassuring to your mass market.

When they discover that "Interslice electronics" inspires more confidence than "Xioassjauoi Shenzhen Special electric company", I think our electronics market is doomed as we know it.

But it has new nvidia stuffs and dats all i care about :3

But anyway... Tablets are not for me unless i can get QNX on it.

Android is horrid, Never again.
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post #23 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alatar View Post

Are you claiming that Xiaomi is lying about the performance of their product?

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)






And also at the same time claiming that the previously leaked numbers of the 7.9 inch tablet (mocha) with the exact specs of the mipad aren't actually from the mipad?

Let's compare it to mullins for example.

in a 11.6 inch reference tablet mullins gets around 24K in 3dmark unlimited:



But since it throttles performance by around 10% when not plugged in (actual mobile use) :
You can take 10% off that number so around 21.9K

Compare that to K1 in a 7.9 inch tablet getting 29.85K.

Around 35% faster in a smaller tablet...

This is not a mulins thread.

Also I didn't see the benchmarks for the mipad. It wont lod on my Windows tablet.

As for Mocha, that is a joke and will be nowhere near what Nvidia advertises.

Also what does screen size has to do with anything?
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post #24 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

This is not a mulins thread.

Also I didn't see the benchmarks for the mipad. It wont lod on my Windows tablet.

As for Mocha, that is a joke and will be nowhere near what Nvidia advertises.

Mocha is the mipad.... It has the exact same specs...

Even the bench numbers between the early leaked results and Xiaomi's own results are within the margin of error.
 
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post #25 of 80
I don't think we can say it beats mullins overal. Without actuall product reviews om the power consumption it could go both ways.
7 watt is a lot and idle at .7 isn't anythin to write home about either compared to Qualcomm SoC's.

I guess we will see lower clocks or a better board in tablets. I also hope for numbers on mullins to ut with APU14 bringing no news I fear Intel open bribes succeeded again.
post #26 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

I don't think we can say it beats mullins overal. Without actuall product reviews om the power consumption it could go both ways.
7 watt is a lot and idle at .7 isn't anythin to write home about either compared to Qualcomm SoC's.

I guess we will see lower clocks or a better board in tablets. I also hope for numbers on mullins to ut with APU14 bringing no news I fear Intel open bribes succeeded again.

7W is not what you get on a mobile platform. under ~6W is what you get as SOC power on a development platform.

The mobile versions (which we now have benches of) are clocked lower than the jetson tk1, don't use DDR3L, etc. use much less power.

An example comes from the whitepaper:
Quote:
Apple A7 consumed 2560 mW to deliver 13 fps on iPhone 5S. An equivalent Tegra K1 mobile platform consumes
2605 mW to deliver 1.45x higher performance.

Since Jetson uses DDR3L and OS is not tuned for mobile, it
consumes 3658 mW to deliver an equivalent 1.45x performance advantage over Apple A7.

Same consumption as the A7 in the ipad (that's also shown in the benches in this thread) but considerably more performance.


Besides, when it comes to mullins, this is about as close as we're going to get to testing them. Mullins only runs windows and K1 doesn't run windows. With the difference between a 11.6 inch mullins tablet plugged into AC and a 7.6 inch K1 tablet being as big as it is, it's quite safe to say which one is faster in 3d loads...

And it's the mobile one in the 7.6 inch tablet that's outperforming mullins here, not the jetson board. Please don't confuse jetson tk1 power consumption with mobile and mobile performance with jetson tk1 performance.
 
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post #27 of 80
K1 also has a 7w TDP while Mullins has a 4.5w TDP. The A7 has a TDP of 2w.

So, even if we use your optimistic K1 TDP of 7w, it still ends up having a 56% higher TDP than Mullins and a TDP 2.5 times larger than the A7 TDP.

It is standard Nvidia mobile tactic. Go way above the TDP every other chip maker is willing to go past, brag about how you're faster than them, and then wonder why there's one or two devices that ever use Tegra. You'll notice that battery life slides are clearly missing from any slides related to K1, and there's good reason for that.

iPad Mini gets about 12 hours 30 minutes in engadget review. Meaning with K1 TDP you're looking at somewhere between 3 and 5 hours of battery life with the same quality of battery you will find in iPad. And that's implying Xiaomi will strive to use the same quality battery that Apple would.

I really don't understand how some of you make such a fuss over AMD CPU TDP being 125w while Intel is at 74w while Nvidia comes along and releases something with double the TDP and no one cares about TDP all of a sudden?

The difference between Ivy Bridge quad core TDP and FX 9590 TDP is nearly proportional to the difference between A7 TDP and K1 TDP. The odd thing is that people whine about 9590 TDP being so disproportionate in a form fact that's plugged into a wall, yet when a device that's designed to have long battery life and not burn your hands has a TDP that's way too high (at least judging by what other companies are willing to do with their chips), no one cares about TDP and power consumption!

It's not very hard to beat the competition in performance when the competition is trying to walk a fine line between power consumption, battery life, and performance and you just go "yolo performance we have 'ULP' in a marketing slide!"

Every Tegra release is the same. Some company releases a device that rocks benchmarks. Everyone goes "wow Tegra's amazing". The device is released, it gets ridiculously hot and has horrible battery life. No one cares about it anymore. No more Tegra devices are created except for Shield. Then start over again.
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post #28 of 80
I can't fathom why people don't actually read the articles and check out the numbers for themselves....

"K1 has 7W TDP and will have 1/3rd of the battery life of the ipad".

Meanwhile actual numbers show that K1 provides 1.45x 3d performance of the A7 in the ipad mini for 55mW less, outperforms a bigger mullins platform plugged into the wall, is put into a device which has similar battery life as the ipad mini, and has SOC power way below it's TDP when measured by NV or by 3rd party sites (phoronix) and that's while using the chip on a platform that isn't in any way optimized to be a mobile system.

But hey, let's just repeat the Charlie rumor mill even after it has been proved to be incorrect right?
 
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post #29 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdlvx View Post

K1 also has a 7w TDP while Mullins has a 4.5w TDP. The A7 has a TDP of 2w.

So, even if we use your optimistic K1 TDP of 7w, it still ends up having a 56% higher TDP than Mullins and a TDP 2.5 times larger than the A7 TDP.

It is standard Nvidia mobile tactic. Go way above the TDP every other chip maker is willing to go past, brag about how you're faster than them, and then wonder why there's one or two devices that ever use Tegra. You'll notice that battery life slides are clearly missing from any slides related to K1, and there's good reason for that.

iPad Mini gets about 12 hours 30 minutes in engadget review. Meaning with K1 TDP you're looking at somewhere between 3 and 5 hours of battery life with the same quality of battery you will find in iPad. And that's implying Xiaomi will strive to use the same quality battery that Apple would.

I really don't understand how some of you make such a fuss over AMD CPU TDP being 125w while Intel is at 74w while Nvidia comes along and releases something with double the TDP and no one cares about TDP all of a sudden?

The difference between Ivy Bridge quad core TDP and FX 9590 TDP is nearly proportional to the difference between A7 TDP and K1 TDP. The odd thing is that people whine about 9590 TDP being so disproportionate in a form fact that's plugged into a wall, yet when a device that's designed to have long battery life and not burn your hands has a TDP that's way too high (at least judging by what other companies are willing to do with their chips), no one cares about TDP and power consumption!

It's not very hard to beat the competition in performance when the competition is trying to walk a fine line between power consumption, battery life, and performance and you just go "yolo performance we have 'ULP' in a marketing slide!"

Every Tegra release is the same. Some company releases a device that rocks benchmarks. Everyone goes "wow Tegra's amazing". The device is released, it gets ridiculously hot and has horrible battery life. No one cares about it anymore. No more Tegra devices are created except for Shield. Then start over again.


Like I have been saying... To be usable it wont be able to run ay 7w TDP.

Like all tegra chips before it.

LOL @ Alatar, what does the AMD tablet being plugged in has to do with anything?
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post #30 of 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by bencher View Post

Like I have been saying... To be usable it wont be able to run ay 7w TDP.

Anyone who knows hardware should know that TDP isn't indicative of power consumption.

And they should know even better that you can configure the same chip in different ways. Lower clocks mean lower TDPs.

And lo and behold we have K1 in a 7.9 inch tablet offering twice the 3d performance of the A7 powered ipad mini. As well as similar battery life of course.

Quote:
LOL @ Alatar, what does the AMD tablet being plugged in has to do with anything?

Mullins performance drops by ~10% when not plugged in.
 
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[i7 5960X @ 4.8GHz] [Rampage V Extreme] [Titan 1400MHz (1500MHz bench)] [Various] 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
[250GB 840EVO +2x SpinpointF3 1TB RAID0] [LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change] [XSPC X2O 750 pump/res] [Monsta 360 full copper + EK XT 360 + XT 240] 
MonitorPowerCaseAudio
[Crossover 27Q LED-P 1440p+ASUS 1200p+LG 1080p] [Corsair AX1200] [Dimastech Easy v3.0] [Sennheiser HD558s] 
CPUCPUMotherboardGraphics
FX 8320, FX 8350, Phenom II x2 555BE i7 3930K, i7 860, i7 4770K, 68x Celeron D CVF, commando, 2x RIVE, Z87X-OC Asus 4870x2, Sapphire 4870 
GraphicsGraphicsGraphicsGraphics
2x 5870, 5850, 5830, 5770 2x 3870x2, 3870 GTX Titan, GTX 480, GTX 590 GTX 285, GTX 260, 4x 9800GT, 8800GTX 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
4x4GB vengeance, 2x4GB predatorX, 2x1GB OCZ DDR2 Intel X25-M 80GB LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change OCN Marksman 
CoolingCoolingOSPower
2x old tek slims (GPU) Various watercooling stuff win7, winxp AX1200 
Case
test bench / cardboard box 
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Benching
(17 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
[i7 5960X @ 4.8GHz] [Rampage V Extreme] [Titan 1400MHz (1500MHz bench)] [Various] 
Hard DriveCoolingCoolingCooling
[250GB 840EVO +2x SpinpointF3 1TB RAID0] [LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change] [XSPC X2O 750 pump/res] [Monsta 360 full copper + EK XT 360 + XT 240] 
MonitorPowerCaseAudio
[Crossover 27Q LED-P 1440p+ASUS 1200p+LG 1080p] [Corsair AX1200] [Dimastech Easy v3.0] [Sennheiser HD558s] 
CPUCPUMotherboardGraphics
FX 8320, FX 8350, Phenom II x2 555BE i7 3930K, i7 860, i7 4770K, 68x Celeron D CVF, commando, 2x RIVE, Z87X-OC Asus 4870x2, Sapphire 4870 
GraphicsGraphicsGraphicsGraphics
2x 5870, 5850, 5830, 5770 2x 3870x2, 3870 GTX Titan, GTX 480, GTX 590 GTX 285, GTX 260, 4x 9800GT, 8800GTX 
RAMHard DriveCoolingCooling
4x4GB vengeance, 2x4GB predatorX, 2x1GB OCZ DDR2 Intel X25-M 80GB LD PC-V2 SS Phase Change OCN Marksman 
CoolingCoolingOSPower
2x old tek slims (GPU) Various watercooling stuff win7, winxp AX1200 
Case
test bench / cardboard box 
  hide details  
Reply
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