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New Water cooling Rig build questions [will turn into Build Log]

post #1 of 9
Thread Starter 
Hello All,

SORRY FOR THE LONG POST smile.gif I posted this in the WC guide for noobs but didn't get a response, probably because that is a very wide open and active thread. So decided to break it out to its own post for some help.

So I have only ever done AIO type water cooling and it has worked out well. But now for my next build, I have decided to do a full custom Water loop. It wont be NEARLY as fancy as some i have seen on here, but hopefully it will get the job done. So Far this is what I have listed for components i would need. There is a good chance this list is wrong, or missing items, or I have the type of item. So please feel free to correct me or guide me, as i come to you for help.

-Core Components

-5960X
-Asus Rampage V Extreme
-16GB or 32GB of DDR4 Memory (Crucial or Corsair)
-2x GTX 880/880 Ti/Titan II
-Corsair Commander Mini (Already Own)
-Case is a 900D (already being use for current build)
-AX1200i (already in current build, hoping it has enough power to power all of this, Please let me know if this wont be enough power, as i would then have to buy an AX1500i)

Water Cooling Items

-2x 480 Monstra 480 Radiators (any other 80mm 480 Radiators?)
-8x Sp120 High Performance PWM fans for Radiators - Will use Corsair link to rev them down to 800-1k RPM with plenty of head room if i really want to bench, and say screw the noise. I think worst case, if Corsair link craps out again, I will move to a Drive bay Fan controller with PWM splitter if i really need to.
-2x D5 Pump - Probably wont get PWM version, but will get variable version. Any certain Companies D5 pump better than others
-flexible tubing- No Idea who to get. Need something flexible enough that will let me work with it. Wanted to do Flexible as this is my first build, didn't want to get in over my head with hard acrylic.
-compression fittings - Will go with Matt Black or Deep blood Red fittings. Price sucks but seem to be the best compression fittings.
-EKWB X3 400 Reservoir
-EK X3 multi port top for Res - This will allow me to have an inlet on top of the Res to my understanding
-Silver Kill Coil - (So I can't seem to get a straight answer if i will need this or not. See below for question)
-2x GPU block - EK nickel with backplates
-1x CPU block - EK Supreme Nickel
-EX dual D5 Top
-EK SLI Parallel bridge
-Distilled Water -

Tube Sizing - I will most likely go with 1/2 ID and 3/4 OD flexible tubing. I think i should get good flow rate with this.

So I have a few questions.

1.)So for the CPU and GPU blocks, i will most likely be getting EK Nickel Blocks. My Radiator is Copper, so From my reading i should be okay and just use a Kill Coil, correct?

PICTURE OF BUILD DRAWN OUT






This is basically what i am thinking for my setup. I figured for the Pump, i would just some double sided sticky velcro and just attach it to the bottom of the case? What other ways would i be able to attach them to the floor?
-Also Should i have the Rear 140mm Fan blow into or out of the case?
-For the Monsta 480, should i have the Fans in Push or Pull. Or does it not matter and just a matter of looks?

Again sorry for the long post, as I do have a lot of questions. I will be doing a build log once everything does come out and is able to purchase. I would imagine mid September is when CPU/MOBO/GPU/RAM will all be out and purchasable.

I am sure i will have more questions, but i really do appreciate any help and for anyone taking the time to help a WC new like myself. If there is a better thread to post this in, please let me know and i will.

Most of this stuff I will get off of FrozenCPU most likely. Still having a hard time finding 480 Monsta Radiators in the USA
Edited by CaliLife17 - 8/22/14 at 11:53pm
     
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post #2 of 9
Thread Starter 
So doing more research, it seems people were not able to do the RIVE in a 900D with 25mm fans and the Mosta 480 which is 86mm thick. Seems like the 8-pin connection for the CPU gets blocked. Here is the thread on oc.net, Post #17

http://www.overclock.net/t/1393949/build-log-ovrsghtx2-900d-rebuild-done-for-now/0_100#post_20099389

I am also going to take a chance and assume that the Rampage V Extreme will be the same size as the RIVE. Looking at the leaked documents for the X99 Deluxe, it has the same size as the X79 deluxe. So based off of that, what my plan is, for the 1 fan that is over 8-pin CPU connection, i will be ordering one low speed Yate loon, which is 20mm thick instead of 25mm thick. I hope this gets me the space i need. WORST case, i feel like i can go even thinner and get the Scythe Slip Stream Slim at 12mm. Here is the link to the slim fans

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=36_1130_408

Yes having 1 fan on the Rad not the same as others will stand out like a sore thumb, but the upside is i get to still use the 2x 480 Monsta's, then im okay with that. Performance over looks.

I have been staying up late the past few nights trying to visualize how all the tubing is going to go and what angle of compressions fittings i will need. I kinda have a general idea, but still is hard for me to figure it all out. Also trying to figure out the Drainport location and also the Fillport. My thought process is, i can take advantage of the many ports on the bottom 480 Rad and connect a Drainport valve. For the fill port I am thinking that since I am getting the Multi-port top for the EK X3 Res, it looks like i can take advantage of one of those and make it a fill port. Thats my idea, I could be Way off in my thinking so please do correct me if im wrong.

I also decided to get an Aquero 6 XT and put 4 corsair PWM fans per channel with splitters. I read how the Corsair PWM fans dont do very well with more than 5 or 6 per channel, as Corsair seems to drop the ball on that one. So with the Aquero 6, i feel since im only doing 8 Rad Fans, i can use all 4 fan channels and be okay.

Since i am having a hard time figuring out exactly what Fittings at what angles and types i need, I think im going to order most of my stuff, minus the Fittings and start to put it into my case to get a better idea of what i will need to get, where the tubing will run into the Rads, and so forth.

Below is my cart so far of what i will be purchasing the weekend. I think PPCS is still having there sale, so that too is also making want to buy now to take advantage of that.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I have no idea what the normal amount of tubing people normally need, so i order 16feet. its cheap enough, but i have no idea if that is way overkill, if thats not enough. I feel like that is MORE than enough, but any input would be great.

I have sent out emails to PPCS and FrozenCPU to see when they might get some Monsta 480's in as i have not found any yet.

I have also decided that i will be doing Blood Red Bitspower fittings, with Blue tubing. Plan is to be Red/Blue color scheme. And no not for USA, but i am a big Transformers fan, back to the 80's growing up watching G1 transformers. My color is being pulled from one of my favorite transformers comics, Transformers: More Than Meets the Eye Ongoing. One of my Favorite Covers is from Ongoing #23 (Pic below) so that is where i am getting my color theme from.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

So that is where I stand right now. I will turn this Thread into a build log once i start to get parts in, and once CPU/MOBO are released. Also from what i have read it looks like current LGA-2011 blocks will work with LGA-2011-3 boards, so im debating where the order an EK Acetal+Nickel CPU block now, or wait and see if they come out with anything new for X99 boards.

I will update with some pics of my current RIG later tonight. Right now its all Air cooled. Recently i moved from a 2600k on a Z68 board (which had an AIO) over to a Z77 Maximus V Extreme. When i made that move, i went back to a air cooled CPU since i sold my AIO with the parts of the Z68. When i got the 780Ti KPE i was going to go all Water and upgrade to an Ivy-E setup, but when i started to hear about an 8-core Haswell-E chip coming out, i decided to put those plans on hold, and wait for X99. So sadly my KPE have no been used to their full potential. I have still got a good OC on them on air, but they really have not been able to shine. I will probably sell those when 8xx series gets announced, as i feel its a waste of money to get blocks for them and only have them for a month or so.
Edited by CaliLife17 - 8/23/14 at 3:17pm
     
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post #3 of 9
Monsta really performs best with good static optimized fans in push pull. Otherwise, thinner radiators with push/pull will outperform it. So I suggest you to look for RX v3 or UT60 rads.
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post #4 of 9
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeXel View Post

Monsta really performs best with good static optimized fans in push pull. Otherwise, thinner radiators with push/pull will outperform it. So I suggest you to look for RX v3 or UT60 rads.

Ya every time i have seen someone say push/pull is better, i always see the counter argument that push/pull doesn't really add much. Also watching linustechtips on push/pull, and Martinsliquidlab, it alway seems that there is no real benefit to Push/Pull. That is why i figured that a thicker rad, low FPI, will have more surface area to dissipate heat, and then just run it in push with fans at about 1k-1.2k RPM. That was my train of thought.

So I dont know. It has been real hard for me to find an actual definitive answer on this, and i feel like i probably never wont. Im trying to maximize my cooling potential and also not have it so i have to run 2k RPM fans. I know Push Pull will let me run the fans at even lower RPM, but soo many fans to deal with wink.gif and I for whatever reason feel the 480 Monsta would give me better performance.

Plus 8 fans on radiators will be much easier to manage and wire than 16 smile.gif. But i will keep doing my research on this. I have not purchase the Rads yet, so that decision can change.
Edited by CaliLife17 - 8/23/14 at 5:01pm
     
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post #5 of 9
Thicker rads need more powerful fans to push air through that thickness. You can see that in Bundymania's review where Monsta pretty much sucks at low RPMs and becomes better at higher speeds. And even then it's not that much better to justify the thickness. 60mm push/pull > monsta just push or pull. Monsta in push/pull > anything else.

Besides there are also new HW labs that seem to perform even better and Mayhem is release new rads too which look promising.

Martin's testing shows push/pull gains 2-3C over just push or pull which sometimes is bigger than thicker rad.

Anyway what I'm trying to say is 20mm fan is a bad idea on Monsta. You really want at least a good single 25mm fan like GT15 to get best out of it. Otherwise, 60mm rad with proper set of fans is a better idea.
Edited by DeXel - 8/23/14 at 6:16pm
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Ivy Bridge
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post #6 of 9
Thread Starter 
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeXel View Post

Thicker rads need more powerful fans to push air through that thickness. You can see that in Bundymania's review where Monsta pretty much sucks at low RPMs and becomes better at higher speeds. And even then it's not that much better to justify the thickness. 60mm push/pull > monsta just push or pull. Monsta in push/pull > anything else.

Besides there are also new HW labs that seem to perform even better and Mayhem is release new rads too which look promising.

Martin's testing shows push/pull gains 2-3C over just push or pull which sometimes is bigger than thicker rad.

Anyway what I'm trying to say is 20mm fan is a bad idea on Monsta. You really want at least a good single 25mm fan like GT15 to get best out of it. Otherwise, 60mm rad with proper set of fans is a better idea.

+Rep to you! You have convinced me to move away from the Monsta 480s (plus the hardship of finding them in stock anywhere). I will move to a a Push/Pull setup on a 60mm Rad for both the top of my 900D and the bottom as well.

from the limited reviews of the GTX Nemesis 480 i have read, those do seem very impressive. Also have seen good reviews for the XSPC 480 V3 and also for the UT60. GTX Nemesis is about $50 bucks more expensive per Rad than either the UT60 or XSPC V3, so i will need to keep researching to see if the HW Labs Rad is worth the price premium. I do like the Extra Port options on the XSPC V3 and UT60, and the UT60 even has a drainport which is nice.

So back to more research on the Rads. So far they all seem to be pretty comparable.

Also now that i am going to be going to a Push/Pull setup, I think i will need to rethink my Fan choice away from Corsair. From my reading on OC.net (i forget which thread had it) it was discovered that corsair PWM fans have an issue with them that they become unusable when you start to add more than 5 fans per PWM channel (they revert back to full speed). Since i will now be using more fans, I will need fans that i can put 8 fans per channel. Corsair seems like they just wont cut it.

Now to go see what fans i should do, and make a decision on what Rads i will purchase. lots of research tonight smile.gif i will post a new Cart either tonight or tomorrow of my revised choices. Also any input anyone wants to give, I am more eager to listen.

This is going to be on fun build smile.gif
Edited by CaliLife17 - 8/23/14 at 9:22pm
     
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post #7 of 9
Thread Starter 
Did some more research this weekend on reservoir sizes, and looked at some more 900D builds with the 400ml length EK res, and I have decided to downsize to the 250mm length X3 EK Res. From my research I did, it looks like reservoir size doesn't really have that big if any of an impact on the cooling performance. The only thing it seems to help with is you wouldn't need to top off as much since it can hold more liquid.

Also, while the 900D can fit the 400ml X3 Res, it does look pretty big in there, and as this being my first build, i think having the smaller 250ml Res will really be much more manageable when it comes to tubing. Looking at the specs on EK, looks like the 250ml length Res holds ~440ml of fluid, where as the 400ml one holds ~820ml of fluid. So its almost double the liquid, but it seems that wont really benefit me.

i am also finishing my PPCS cart today, and then going to order, also have a 5960x Pre-order on Amazon, and going to pre-order some 16gb Trident DDR4 2400 ram on newegg this week. New CC should be here this week since i had to get a new card(long story), so plan is to order PPCS when new card comes in and also the Ram.

Still plan on doing a dry run, as in mounting rads, Res and pumps to see how many fittings and need and which ones. Since this is my first build, don't have a great idea of how many of each type i need.
Edited by CaliLife17 - 8/25/14 at 12:26pm
     
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post #8 of 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliLife17 View Post

Snip (Click to show)
Did some more research this weekend on reservoir sizes, and looked at some more 900D builds with the 400ml length EK res, and I have decided to downsize to the 250mm length X3 EK Res. From my research I did, it looks like reservoir size doesn't really have that big if any of an impact on the cooling performance. The only thing it seems to help with is you wouldn't need to top off as much since it can hold more liquid.

Also, while the 900D can fit the 400ml X3 Res, it does look pretty big in there, and as this being my first build, i think having the smaller 250ml Res will really be much more manageable when it comes to tubing. Looking at the specs on EK, looks like the 250ml length Res holds ~440ml of fluid, where as the 400ml one holds ~820ml of fluid. So its almost double the liquid, but it seems that wont really benefit me.

i am also finishing my PPCS cart today, and then going to order, also have a 5960x Pre-order on Amazon, and going to pre-order some 16gb Trident DDR4 2400 ram on newegg this week. Snip (Click to show)
New CC should be here this week since i had to get a new card(long story), so plan is to order PPCS when new card comes in and also the Ram.

Still plan on doing a dry run, as in mounting rads, Res and pumps to see how many fittings and need and which ones. Since this is my first build, don't have a great idea of how many of each type i need
.

FWIW, if you weren't aware already, PPCs is having a back-to-school sale that will last thru Aug 27th ...

PPCs 2014 back-to-school sale
Quote:
Spend $50-499 get 7% off: "SCHOOL14-7"
Spend $500-999 get 8.5% off: "SCHOOL14-8.5"
Spend over $1000 get 10% off: "SCHOOL14-10"

And if you miss that I suspect they will have something similar for Labor Day (Sept 1) - they usually do for each holiday. You can subscribe to their mailing list / newsletter (down on the left side of the page) if you want to get notified of their sales and discount codes

And last but not least, even if there's not a better sale going at the time, you can always use the perpetual code 'OCN55' instead to receive a 5.5% discount on any order any time at Performance PCs (in case you were wondering, no, you cannot combine discount codes)

Similarly, you can use the code 'OCN' to get 5.1% off any order at FrozenCPU.
Edited by Unicr0nhunter - 8/25/14 at 7:28pm
post #9 of 9
Thread Starter 
Ending up ordering my PPCS order before the sale ended, so i could take advantage of it. Below is my order: Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

They were out of some items, so i will also be putting in an order tonight with Frozen CPU, cart below Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Still deciding between all nickel or Nickel+acetal top. Doesn't seem there will be any real performance difference (have heard the acetal might bow a little less, which might help with larger chips like the 5960x, but would be very very minimal difference)

Plan on ordering 5960x, Rampage Extreme V, and either Crucial Ballistic X or Ripsaws DDR4 memory tomorrow as well.

PPCS order is suppose to be arriving wednesday. My hope is the weekend of Sept 7th, i can start putting things into my case, check the orientation of things and start to figure out how many compressions fittings i need of what kind. Once i figure that out i will go ahead and order those.

I am also on the fence on wether i want to just get Blocks for my 780 Ti KPEs and just use those now, or wait and see what Nvidia does for GPUs. My issue is say they annoucned GPUs week of September 9th, at best, they are available a week or 2 later, then add on top of that i would have to wait another few weeks for Classified versions to come out, as i never buy reference boards. So i am thinking about just buying blocks for the KPE and using those for now, so i dont have to wait.

That would mean i would have to drain my loop and refill it for the new blocks. I plan on adding a T valve somewhere to help me drain my loop easier, but need to figure out where i will put it.
     
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