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[videocardz] AMD to launch 300W GPU with High-Bandwidth-Memory - Page 35

post #341 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nvidia Fanboy View Post

A lot of those AMD users arguing the 680 and 970/980 are high end cards just don't want to admit that Nvidia is using their midrange cards to compete effectively against AMD's high end cards.

On the flip side, I guess they do kind of have a point in regards to the performance and price. If a product is one of the best in performance and also one of the highest in price, is it considered a high end product even if we know the guts of it are midrange? If Honda released a magical Civic with a 4 cylinder engine that somehow competed with Ferrari in acceleration, handling, and speed and also costs as much as a Ferrari, would we still consider that Civic to be a midrange product? I dunno, I'm just rambling.

Yes. A Civic is a Civic. Don't go and try to fancy it all up! wink.gif
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post #342 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

How about you guys call the 680 and 980 high end and the rest of us that know better will call them what they are;mid-range chips that perform really well. The reason Nvidia did what they did with both the 680 and 980 is put more profits in their pocket. I don't hate on Nvidia for doing things that way, but I am not going to sit here and act like it is not happening either. When Nvidia releases their next high end chip (GM200), you can bet it is going to consume gobs of power as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsumi View Post

It was the mid-range chip in the Kepler family. There is no dispute about that.

And I never said it wasn't. This is just how nVidia is going to do for now as its working out for them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSlayer View Post

People are whiney because they're not "big die".

Yup.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSlayer View Post


"Hi I'm thick and don't understand other people have different purchase rationales than 'take all my money give me fast!', you people are pathetic for NOT wanting 300w dumped into your room by your GPU! Who cares about boiling alive during the summer and immersion being broken as you sweat."

GJ m80

Its not being thick, its just seeing a trend of the PC Master race being a bunch of whiny little.... When this card launches people will gobble this thing up just like they did with the 290/X, just like we did with the Titan (even though you had tons of people on this forum crying about the 1k price point), just like the 780, etc etc. We're all suckers for new product and people will find ways to reminded whatever faults said product has.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nvidia Fanboy View Post

A lot of those AMD users arguing the 680 and 970/980 are high end cards just don't want to admit that Nvidia is using their midrange cards to compete effectively against AMD's high end cards.

On the flip side, I guess they do kind of have a point in regards to the performance and price. If a product is one of the best in performance and also one of the highest in price, is it considered a high end product even if we know the guts of it are midrange? If Honda released a magical Civic with a 4 cylinder engine that somehow competed with Ferrari in acceleration, handling, and speed and also costs as much as a Ferrari, would we still consider that Civic to be a midrange product? I dunno, I'm just rambling.

No and yes, you wouldn't consider it just a Civic. Just like you wouldn't consider a Corvette Z06 a base Corvette. Nor would you consider a Corvette ZR1 a Z06 or a Base. Because the badge and guts of said vehicle changes it all.
Edited by Rei86 - 1/14/15 at 11:57am
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post #343 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111 View Post

That's just more evidence that the gtx 980 is midrange.

Tonga is undoubtedly midrange. And with the transistor density being so similar, tongas performance should get really close the gtx 980s. But it isn't.

Even if we consider the cutdown, the gtx 970 is likely more cutdown than the r9 285 considering it has less shaders enabled and there is a giant gulf in performance between them at 50%.

Hopefully AMD has something special coming. While Nvidia has been making record profit at 28nm generation, AMD has generally been surviving off console revenue. With Console revenue peaking this quarter according to AMD, they are going to need their other revenue generator, GPU sales, back.

If GTX 980 is mid range then R9 290/X is midrange too.
post #344 of 772
i think those monikers are just their way of doing market segmentation. Arguing about it makes no sense really. I bet Lisa and Jen-Hsun sitting comfortably on their chair thinking how else they could get more money for the board.
post #345 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themisseble View Post

If GTX 980 is mid range then R9 290/X is midrange too.

290x had the largest die size in AMD's GCN 1.1 generation. Therefore the 290X was AMD's top end chip. Just like the 7970 had the largest die size for AMD's GCN 1.0 generation.
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post #346 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themisseble View Post

If GTX 980 is mid range then R9 290/X is midrange too.

Why?

The gtx 980 and Tonga are closers in die size and transistor count.

Both have 256bit buses which is the hallmark of the midrange. Heck even their power consumption is similar.

AND most importantly, the codename for the gtx 980/970 aka gm204 is midrange.

Hawaii is the largest chip AMD has ever made, it has a transistor count more similar to the gtx 780 ti and titan. Additionally the board, power consumption and memory bus make it require a PCB that make it one of the mostly costly ever. High power consumption + 512 bit bus make for an expensive board for the GPU. Hawaii Transistor density is the highest ever for a videocard which allows it to even get somewhat close to the die size of 980, however this increases defect rates which increases its manufacturing costs probably again closer to gk110 levels.
Edited by tajoh111 - 1/14/15 at 12:13pm
post #347 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

The HBM card is probably the 390x. The 380x is a smaller card without hbm

I really doubt the 380X will not have HBM since the entire point is to reduce power
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themisseble View Post

That tonga is not full chip. again check at transistors.

tonga 5000
GTX 980 5200

4%?

http://www.techpowerup.com/gpudb/2398/radeon-r9-280x.html R9 280X 4300 trans

check this
http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/189034-amd-radeon-r9-285-review-the-gcn-1-2-torpedo-that-takes-out-nvidias-gtx-760

R9 285 can same Gflops as R9 280... with little lower clocks.

It's confirmed that the full Tonga core is a 2048 shader configuration. At least that's what this seems to imply

http://www.techpowerup.com/gpudb/2587/radeon-r9-m295x-mac-edition.html
http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-R9-M295X.129043.0.html

Apple got the M295X which is full Tonga. Notebookcheck also claims it's a 125W part, I guess these were specifically binned Tonga cores if true.
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post #348 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

Didn't you hear? This site is changing from Overclock.net to Efficiency.net. tongue.gif
You want GPUs that are made 10 years from now on to come with their own all-in-one nuclear power plant requiring to offer up one room of your home to house it? Over the past years PSU wattages have been increasing to obscene levels that's getting close to braker limits.
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post #349 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themisseble View Post

Benchmarks first ...
Which one is actually more efficient? R9 290X is the most powerful single GPU card on market - thats for sure. GTX 980 is the fastest GPU on market.

R9 290X give 5,6 GFLOPS
GTX 980 give 4.6 GFLOPS

R9 290X is 22% more powerfull.

FLOPS are not a great measure of overall processor performance, GPU or CPU.

For one you're just quoting that from a wiki at stock clocks. You can easily clock 980 ~35% higher than that on air (that's not even 1550mhz) while you can't laugh and run 290x's at 1350mhz on air.

I have benched 213gflops @4ghz on Haswell quad core, and other cpu (fx piledriver, sandy/ivy bridge) does what? 100-130? floating point operations per second is way more important for a gpu, but it's still not an easy stat that you can quote to say how much FPS you'll get.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagicBox View Post

You want GPUs that are made 10 years from now on to come with their own all-in-one nuclear power plant requiring to offer up one room of your home to house it? Over the past years PSU wattages have been increasing to obscene levels that's getting close to braker limits.

Not really the case. Power usage on medium and big chip size has stayed constant for Nvidia for the last three gens. People are generally buying smaller PSU's these days (with a market void of decent, low priced ~150-200w units) and for standard gaming desktops, the same size PSU's as always. 780ti used same power as 480 and the 1080 will use the same amount of power too. There's a ton of outrage in this thread from some site stating something that i thought would be obvious to most OCN users
Edited by Cyro999 - 1/14/15 at 12:29pm
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post #350 of 772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyro999 View Post

FLOPS are not a great measure of overall processor performance, GPU or CPU.

For one you're just quoting that from a wiki at stock clocks. You can easily clock 980 ~35% higher than that on air (that's not even 1550mhz) while you can't laugh and run 290x's at 1350mhz on air.

I have benched 213gflops @4ghz on Haswell quad core, and other cpu (fx piledriver, sandy/ivy bridge) does what? 100-130? floating point operations per second is way more important for a gpu, but it's still not an easy stat that you can quote to say how much FPS you'll get.
Not really the case. Power usage on medium and big chip size has stayed constant for Nvidia for the last three gens. People are generally buying smaller PSU's these days (with a market void of decent, low priced ~150-200w units) and for standard gaming desktops, the same size PSU's as always. 780ti used same power as 480 and the 1080 will use the same amount of power too. There's a ton of outrage in this thread from some site stating something that i thought would be obvious to most OCN users

Err, what? You can easily OC a 980 by 35% on air?

http://hwbot.org/hardware/videocard/geforce_gtx_980/

The average is about 19% from the looks of it. A bit better than the 290X's 14.4%
http://hwbot.org/hardware/videocard/radeon_r9_290x/

Where exactly are you getting your numbers?
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