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A Different Recoding Program and Editing program

854 views 34 replies 12 participants last post by  axipher 
#1 ·
Hey guys
I used to use FRAPS a lot for my recordings I didn't really notice any frame hits until my hard drive started to become a bit more full after downloading quite a few games.

I want to swap from fraps to another program but I want the program to be able to record 1080P @ 60 FPS if possible with minimum effort in configuring.

What I used to do was get uncompressed Fraps videos and then compress them with virtual dub, which didn't have a lot in the way of editing but it had real good compression when I used X264vfw H.264/mpeg-4 AVC codec.

So I'm wondering if there are any alternatives that can do the same as fraps without taking a huge hit in my FPS or compress it on the fly while keeping the same resolution and frames per second.

I'm also looking for another program to cut and add/edit scenes into my videos but when I do it I don't really want to compress it further, just render it. Anyone have ideas for a program like that?

A friend also told me to consider using this or something but I don't think I have the requirements for it

http://gamerzone.avermedia.com/products/live_gamer_series/extremecap_u3/specification/en

CPU: I5-2500k (not overclocked)
GPU: Sapphire AMD Radeon 6950 2GB
RAM: 8GB G.skill F3-12800CL9-4GBRL (although when I search it only comes up with 2x2gb when I got 2x4gb)
Motherboard: ASUS p8z68-V

Thanks
 
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#4 ·
Obs
 
#6 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by CravinR1 View Post

Obs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sisaroth View Post

Might also be worth trying out

-Afterburner
-DxTory with Lagarith Lossless codec
I will try all 4 of em. Thanks for the suggestions guys, will see how they go, although I think I might need a little help with dxtory if what a lot of people say is true with it
 
#12 ·
MSI Afterburner is pretty good. Way more features than Fraps like the buffer you can set so you never miss anything. I set a 1GB buffer using ram so i get about 30 second loop in case something good happens and i decide i want the footage. Plus its free
thumb.gif


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQ7Z1s-Xqf0
 
#13 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by superj1977 View Post

MSI Afterburner is pretty good. Way more features than Fraps like the buffer you can set so you never miss anything. I set a 1GB buffer using ram so i get about 30 second loop in case something good happens and i decide i want the footage. Plus its free
thumb.gif


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQ7Z1s-Xqf0
I use MSI AB all the time for recording.
I record Uncompressed with it, which is something FRAPS can't do. FRAPS always encodes lossy or lossless, so it always has a pretty high CPU usage when recording while MSI AB in the Uncompressed mode barely uses any, it just needs a lot of HDD write speed and storage space.

When I feel like recording with lossy compression, I do use FRAPS, since I believe it does it better than MSI AB's compression settings even though they are more customizable. I'm sure I could find a config for lossy recording that I like with MSI AB but I find it easier to just switch between the two depending on what I'm doing.

You should definitely give AB a try OP, but before you judge it you should try the Uncompressed mode with a dedicated RAID0 recording drive to get the best results. 1080p@60 will be around 360MB/s so you'll want about 4 decent drives in RAID0 to get smooth results, but once you have those, the removal of the realtime encoding should prevent your games from getting choppy while recording.

For editing I pretty much stick to VirtualDUB myself as well, but when I want to do some extra stuff I use Camtasia, however I do not recommend it since it's kind of crap.

As for compressing your videos after the recording and editing, you should give Handbrake a try.
 
#15 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by superj1977 View Post

Yup Handbrake is awesome for further reducing the size with minimal loss. I use nothing else but Handbrake myself and have used it long time.
Usually High profile RF24, still good quality and brings size down quite a bit, a good trade off i feel.
RF:0 makes the files small enough for me, I like to do things lossless if possible, but pretty much anything above 30 is decent enough for uploading and web usage.
I use RF:0 on the stuff I keep, and RF:20 on unimportant stuff that goes online.
 
#16 ·
I use Dxtory, but not to record. Instead, I setup Dxtory to capture game footage and output it as RawCap via directshow output. This creates a "camera" of my game play with zero performance hit, and no quality loss. Then I can use that camera as a source in any program I wish (as long as they will take a camera as a source). Typically, I use it as a source in X-Split or OBS so I can stream, and save a copy locally. The advantages of doing this are OBS and X-Split typically don't play nice with crossfire setups, it's less resource intensive for some odd reason then just using the built in game cap of those programs(at least it is in crossfire), and the other advantage is: it allows programs that don't cap full screen game play to cap full screen game play (FFSplit).

I think another advantage of using OBS or X-Split even if you don't stream is: your scenes can include whatever logo/overlay you normally incorporate into your video as you record instead of putting them in when you edit later.

I struggled a really long time with setting up to stream without having any performance issues, and this for me at least has been the best solution possible. I am sure there are better solutions for just straight recording (even though I think Dxtory rawcap> to file would be hard to beat quality wise), but if you are going to be streaming and recording particularly with a Multi-GPU setup, it is hands down the winner.

here is the setting in Dxtory:

2015-03-16_21-09-40.png


and here is what the camera would look like in OBS:

2015-03-16_21-12-19.png


and what it looks like in OBS:
2015-03-16_21-20-39.png
 
#17 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by superj1977 View Post

MSI Afterburner is pretty good. Way more features than Fraps like the buffer you can set so you never miss anything. I set a 1GB buffer using ram so i get about 30 second loop in case something good happens and i decide i want the footage. Plus its free
thumb.gif


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQ7Z1s-Xqf0
Ill take a look at that video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow11377 View Post

I use MSI AB all the time for recording.
I record Uncompressed with it, which is something FRAPS can't do. FRAPS always encodes lossy or lossless, so it always has a pretty high CPU usage when recording while MSI AB in the Uncompressed mode barely uses any, it just needs a lot of HDD write speed and storage space.

When I feel like recording with lossy compression, I do use FRAPS, since I believe it does it better than MSI AB's compression settings even though they are more customizable. I'm sure I could find a config for lossy recording that I like with MSI AB but I find it easier to just switch between the two depending on what I'm doing.

You should definitely give AB a try OP, but before you judge it you should try the Uncompressed mode with a dedicated RAID0 recording drive to get the best results. 1080p@60 will be around 360MB/s so you'll want about 4 decent drives in RAID0 to get smooth results, but once you have those, the removal of the realtime encoding should prevent your games from getting choppy while recording.

For editing I pretty much stick to VirtualDUB myself as well, but when I want to do some extra stuff I use Camtasia, however I do not recommend it since it's kind of crap.

As for compressing your videos after the recording and editing, you should give Handbrake a try.
Yeah small problem, till I can afford to get another HDD to replace one that died (backed up thank god) I cant do entirely uncompressed, was a miracle I could still use fraps for some games and tbh I don't know how to setup a RAID. Handbreak itself never worked for me on my older comp but ill give it another try I guess, but I do want to use a video editing studio like vegas maybe to add an intro and outro (if there are better suggestions for this im all ears) but I don't know how to render vegas without making it touch the quality of the video. Actually this raises another point, do I edit the video in some kind of studio program first or compress it first? (I only ever did use virtual dub since I never felt the need to make something like an intro/outro till now)

Quote:
Originally Posted by superj1977 View Post

Yup Handbrake is awesome for further reducing the size with minimal loss. I use nothing else but Handbrake myself and have used it long time.
Usually High profile RF24, still good quality and brings size down quite a bit, a good trade off i feel.
Hmm I will give it a try does it let you choose codec like virtual dub? Is there anything better than the x264vfw?

EDIT: I just gave dxtory a try, while it seemed to record ok in that loseless codec mentioned it did not record my my microphone despite having it there. I also tried using the x264 codec I used in virtual dub, and I got it to record and save a file and... well it turned out to be complete crap pardon the French, when I checked its media info It said 60fps but then had an original frame rate or 25 or something

Also can someone explain to me the fraps decompressor codec in dxtory? Any time I try Age of Mythology the game crashes when trying to use it is all
 
#18 ·
So DXtory with that lossless codec seems to work alright, less usage than fraps' codec except it might have 1 small issue I think. A guide I followed told me to use YV12 on it and the colour red seems to appear more like orange. Here are comparison images of the raw files (first one is fraps the second one is dxtory) . was also able to get sony vegas to use x264 finally. When they are both compressed they both seem go slightly more orange too.

frapsrawfile.png 3328k .png file


DxtoryRawfile.png 3111k .png file


Anyone know how to solve the colour issue?
 

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#19 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorFoley View Post

So DXtory with that lossless codec seems to work alright, less usage than fraps' codec except it might have 1 small issue I think. A guide I followed told me to use YV12 on it and the colour red seems to appear more like orange. Here are comparison images of the raw files (first one is fraps the second one is dxtory) . was also able to get sony vegas to use x264 finally. When they are both compressed they both seem go slightly more orange too.

frapsrawfile.png 3328k .png file


DxtoryRawfile.png 3111k .png file


Anyone know how to solve the colour issue?
If the image you uploaded is the correct one, and not a mistake, then you're not actually recording truly lossless with Dxtory.
The reason why reds don't look red is because it is actually degrading the colors, because it is not lossless. The same thing happens when you record with FRAPS in the lossy more, or save anything as a JPEG.

Here is a comparison GIF between those two images you attached.
GJ6nIUg.gif


It appears to sharpen the image along with degrading the colors, causing a loss of detail especially visible in the anti-aliased icons and UI elements, but it is also noticeable everywhere else.

Solution: Record lossless.
As for why you thought you were, but actually haven't been.. I don't know, I don't use Dxtory sorry I can't help much there.
 
#20 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorFoley View Post


Ill take a look at that video
Yeah small problem, till I can afford to get another HDD to replace one that died (backed up thank god) I cant do entirely uncompressed, was a miracle I could still use fraps for some games and tbh I don't know how to setup a RAID. Handbreak itself never worked for me on my older comp but ill give it another try I guess, but I do want to use a video editing studio like vegas maybe to add an intro and outro (if there are better suggestions for this im all ears) but I don't know how to render vegas without making it touch the quality of the video. Actually this raises another point, do I edit the video in some kind of studio program first or compress it first? (I only ever did use virtual dub since I never felt the need to make something like an intro/outro till now)
Hmm I will give it a try does it let you choose codec like virtual dub? Is there anything better than the x264vfw?

EDIT: I just gave dxtory a try, while it seemed to record ok in that loseless codec mentioned it did not record my my microphone despite having it there. I also tried using the x264 codec I used in virtual dub, and I got it to record and save a file and... well it turned out to be complete crap pardon the French, when I checked its media info It said 60fps but then had an original frame rate or 25 or something

Also can someone explain to me the fraps decompressor codec in dxtory? Any time I try Age of Mythology the game crashes when trying to use it is all
You can actually add an Intro and Outro using VirtualDUB. Just open the intro.avi, append it with the recording.avi, then append the outro.avi.
You don't need Vegas to do that, although it would be a little easier with the GUI designed for video editing.

Always compress last. Never compress before editing, especially when dealing with lossy file formats and codecs. If you must compress inbetween steps, do so losslessly.
For example, using images, do Bitmap -> PNG -> Then JPG for the web. Don't do Bitmap -> JPG -> then JPG again. You can never reverse the effects of lossy compression so compressing it before editing it will require re-saving it, and filesizes also tend to get bigger when doing lossless compression on a lossy file.

If you had it set to record at 60 FPS, but got an output of around 25 FPS, that just means your HDD or CPU wasn't able to handle 60 FPS recording and went with the next best thing: as many frames as possible.
 
#21 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow11377 View Post

You can actually add an Intro and Outro using VirtualDUB. Just open the intro.avi, append it with the recording.avi, then append the outro.avi.
You don't need Vegas to do that, although it would be a little easier with the GUI designed for video editing.

Always compress last. Never compress before editing, especially when dealing with lossy file formats and codecs. If you must compress inbetween steps, do so losslessly.
For example, using images, do Bitmap -> PNG -> Then JPG for the web. Don't do Bitmap -> JPG -> then JPG again. You can never reverse the effects of lossy compression so compressing it before editing it will require re-saving it, and filesizes also tend to get bigger when doing lossless compression on a lossy file.

If you had it set to record at 60 FPS, but got an output of around 25 FPS, that just means your HDD or CPU wasn't able to handle 60 FPS recording and went with the next best thing: as many frames as possible.
Wait I did follow a guide with the codec for dxtory. would changing RGB default to YV12 affect it? and then using sony vegas to compress using x264 with the option convert to 4:2:0 have any effects to it?

I'm pretty sure that's right pictures with the right names
 
#22 ·
Nobody suggested Mirillis Action? Weird. My top choice next to Shadowplay.
 
#25 ·
The Raptr app allows you to set bitrate, recording framerate, and recording resolution. It records in MP4.
 
#26 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by MajorFoley View Post

Wait I did follow a guide with the codec for dxtory. would changing RGB default to YV12 affect it? and then using sony vegas to compress using x264 with the option convert to 4:2:0 have any effects to it?

I'm pretty sure that's right pictures with the right names
Changing color spaces shouldn't mess up the colors if it is handled correctly, but using 4:2:0 subsampling will degrade the color quality. Stick with 4:4:4 if you can.
 
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