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[WFFC]Nvidia Responds To Witcher 3 GameWorks Controversy, PC Gamers On The Offensive - Page 3

post #21 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Scone View Post

Be a sheep then see if I care. Raging Chain knows the industry pretty well also yet you'd rather just rant about your morals rather than dealing in facts.

"It's already known". Known how, by WCCF? Ever heard the expression forest through the trees.

You can't have a sensible discussion that way. If anything, you're wasting other peoples time...

Already known by facts from EVERY review site out there. FACTS.

Also, this dev is selling for two markets (AMD, Nvidia) so it's THEIR responsobility to cater for both of them, if they don't they lose customers and that's an first way to go down, if you can't understand that keep your fanboyish way of thinking and good luck in the future.
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post #22 of 94
When i played TR i could not stand the hair of Laura. I had to have TressFX ON. With W3 you really don't need HairWorks. Stock hair is not as bad. It's not like HairWorks runs with no penalty for Nvidia users either.
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post #23 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Scone View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadRabbit View Post

I've seen your excuses before in the other topics and I will not waste my time on You but what I said is exactly that. AMD isn't the dev nor selling the game for profit so it's the devs choice, actually 3 of those. Use HW, use Tress or do your own. Only the third will cater for both companies. And it's already known using HW will gimp AMD more than Tress gimps Nvidia. No, this dev can take a hike as far as I care. Either lazy or just got paid enough.


Be a sheep then see if I care. Raging Chain knows the industry pretty well also yet you'd rather just rant about your morals rather than dealing in facts.

"It's already known". Known how, by WCCF? Ever heard the expression forest through the trees.

You can't have a sensible discussion that way. If anything, you're wasting other peoples time...

Keep the gloves up above the belt (don't name call), I know quite a bit about GameWorks, I signed up for their indie license and got approved.

I also dabble in CUDA programming and OpenCL, I had the same concerns about Mantle that everybody has now about GameWorks, but Mantle proved to be beneficial into leading towards to a major overhaul in nVidia drivers and DX12 / Vulkan going to Close to metal. We can agree that everyone benefits.

Nothing is stopping a video game from using TressFX and HairWorks. There is no block on AMD to work with a vendor.

There is no block in sharing code with AMD. I want to be 1000% clear, there is NO block on sharing code with AMD. There IS a block on sharing it with unlicensed vendors / programmers.

Which means:
A.) AMD should pony up get a license.
B.) AMD should provide a similar library, if they don't want developers using an awesome toolset.
C.) Stop pointing the finger at another company for their own performance issues / developer relationships.

Developers are responsible for how GameWorks is:
A.) Implemented.
B.) Level of implementation.
C.) Working with AMD to increase performance on GameWorks code specifically.
D.) Working with AMD to provide alternative code.

Nobody forces developers to use GameWorks, nobody is bribing them, easier to program features IS the bribe. Being able to incorporate fur and hair without having to build it from scratch. The last 10 years, features like that have been getting cut from games. Not enough time, too buggy, takes too long to implement.

I agree an open source library would be great. They don't have to do that though. They don't have to give the stuff they create away for free, and to imply they do cheapens the good will of companies making the effort to cross lines and open sourcing their software. It is a huge deal and basically, most business see it as throwing cash down the toilet.

If nVidia was bribing developers, AMD would sue them. It is super illegal. If AMD had a case on anti-trust, they would sue them.

If Richard Huddy or Roy Taylor could corroborate any claims they have made, or a single AMD fan could prove, WITH FACTS, that nVidia is the cause of all your woes, I would be first in line to burn nVidia down to the ground.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post

When i played TR i could not stand the hair of Laura. I had to have TressFX ON. With W3 you really don't need HairWorks. Stock hair is not as bad. It's not like HairWorks runs with no penalty for Nvidia users either.

That's a good point, HairWorks is not essential to the game.
Edited by RagingCain - 5/19/15 at 7:02am
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post #24 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadRabbit View Post

Already known by facts from EVERY review site out there. FACTS.

Also, this dev is selling for two markets (AMD, Nvidia) so it's THEIR responsobility to cater for both of them, if they don't they lose customers and that's an first way to go down, if you can't understand that keep your fanboyish way of thinking and good luck in the future.


So in conclusion I'm a fanboy because NVIDIA spent twice the amount in R&D over AMD in the last 3 years, pushing technologies in games. If it makes me a fanboy because I'd rather buy a GPU from a vendor that is making that sort of headway with developers, then yes I guess I am a fanboy.

It certainly beats defending their competitors on a public forum and continuously saying "it's not fair". Why don't you ask AMD what they intend on doing about it? Because from where I'm sitting GameWorks is doing nothing but giving me the option to increase my graphic fidelity.
post #25 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Scone View Post

So in conclusion I'm a fanboy because NVIDIA spent twice the amount in R&D over AMD in the last 3 years, pushing technologies in games. If it makes me a fanboy because I'd rather buy a GPU from a vendor that is making that sort of headway with developers, then yes I guess I am a fanboy.

It certainly beats defending their competitors on a public forum and continuously saying "it's not fair". Why don't you ask AMD what they intend on doing about it? Because from where I'm sitting GameWorks is doing nothing but giving me the option to increase my graphic fidelity.

How about you go back a couple of posts and see what I actually said already?

I already said that devs should rather implement their own tech into their own engine rather than using either HW or Tress, that's the only way the end consumer will win. And I already said or rather asked, if it's not possible to add both, HW and Tress, for both AMD and Nvidia.

Both Nvidia and AMD alreay spent the R&D cash knowing they might not get it back without spending even more to push devs to use it so the easiest and best way for us would be to let those both die out and every dev use their own tech, optimized for BOTH vendors. But here's the catch, it's easier to use one or the other...and somewhat being lazy.

Also if I'm wasting your time, feel free to use the block button.
Edited by MadRabbit - 5/19/15 at 7:03am
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post #26 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingCain View Post

Keep the gloves up above the belt (don't name call), I know quite a bit about GameWorks, I signed up for their indie license and got approved.

I only mentioned you on the basis what you were saying was one of the only posts that rang true at all smile.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadRabbit View Post

How about you go back a couple of posts and see what I actually said already?

I already said that devs should rather implement their own tech into their own engine rather than using either HW or Tress, that's the only way the end consumer will win. And I already said or rather asked, if it's not possible to add both, HW and Tress, for both AMD and Nvidia.

Also if I'm wasting your time, feel free to use the block button.

That's even more impractical. If it were that simple GameWorks would have even less reason to exist. Studios don't have those kind of resources.

I understand it's the principle if you are a consumer with an AMD GPU, but you have to understand that AMD want you to hate GameWorks.
Edited by Silent Scone - 5/19/15 at 7:08am
post #27 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Scone View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingCain View Post

Keep the gloves up above the belt (don't name call), I know quite a bit about GameWorks, I signed up for their indie license and got approved.

I only mentioned you on the basis what you were saying was one of the only posts that rang true at all smile.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadRabbit View Post

How about you go back a couple of posts and see what I actually said already?

I already said that devs should rather implement their own tech into their own engine rather than using either HW or Tress, that's the only way the end consumer will win. And I already said or rather asked, if it's not possible to add both, HW and Tress, for both AMD and Nvidia.

Also if I'm wasting your time, feel free to use the block button.

That's even more impractical. If it were that simple GameWorks would have even less reason to exist. Studios don't have those kind of resources

I was referring to the sheep part. Keep it friendly thumb.gif
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post #28 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Scone View Post

I only mentioned you on the basis what you were saying was one of the only posts that rang true at all smile.gif
That's even more impractical. If it were that simple GameWorks would have even less reason to exist. Studios don't have those kind of resources

Actually it wouldn't. More competition would mean more advances but without the gimping side. We've had card detecting before game starts for at least 15 years now, just put in two differents paths, one for TressFX where needed and other for HW where needed.

And since you liked to call out @RagingCain

Even he said this
Quote:
Developers are responsible for how GameWorks is:
A.) Implemented.
B.) Level of implementation.
C.) Working with AMD to increase performance on GameWorks code specifically.
D.) Working with AMD to provide alternative code.

That was my whole point to begin with.

Also, since you edited your post. I don't hate GameWorks...Of course AMD wants that and I want to be a billionare...
Edited by MadRabbit - 5/19/15 at 7:24am
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post #29 of 94
People should stop blaming hardware vendors, it's game developers who should get all the blame, they choose to take an easier route and use Gameworks and stuff like this. In perfect world game developers would not use any such libraries and be responsible for game optimization on all hardware. On a side note I failed to see any effect of hairworks in Witcher 3 except plummeting fps, so it literally would not matter for end user if developers wouldn't use it.
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post #30 of 94
There is something shady with the Intel and Nvidia domination when it comes to their business practices for sure. All I know is I'm not buying an Nvidia card for a long time. I won't do anything that moves my beloved PC gaming industry to a monopoly if I can
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