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[WFFC]Nvidia Responds To Witcher 3 GameWorks Controversy, PC Gamers On The Offensive - Page 8

post #71 of 94
The game's benchmarks, if anything, demonstrate planned obsolescence perfectly. What with the 960 outperforming all but the top end of all Kepler cards (still by a minor margin too).

Nvidia needs a strong AMD to drive competition and thus innovation. Whether they like it or not, they need them.
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post #72 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadRabbit View Post

And again, WHQL means nothing...

But I agree, even if they won't release new drivers, at least they should release new CFX profiles.
it may not mean much to enthusiast, but if AMD want to equalize their product quality with Nvidia, they need to get on the WHQL. It is just like a product certification, without that, their product is always going to be consider a "B" class product. Isnt AMD always wanted to stop being called a cheaper solution? I think they should start here first = the driver.

Nvidia can do whatever gameworks they want & get away with it since they have the market share dominance, people are still buying their stuff. That is not going to change until AMD up their driver team.
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post #73 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganf View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingCain View Post

I am sorry but a world without proprietary software will never exist, and frankly, even as a developer, I wouldn't want to live in such a world where a programmer or business are not allowed to protect their property rights or their creations. Choosing to be open source is a noble thing, forcing developers to do it is tyrannical.

What we truly need is an independent body that sets hardware and software standards. For example they could verify things like middle-ware will do no harm against the competition, establishes video game quality standards both in image quality and engine performance, prevents the release of broken products, and has the power to penalize each company that breaks the rules or at least discloses it to the public transparently.

There's a difference between protecting your intellectual property and saying "If you want to use our monitor tech, you've got to use our video cards." or "If you want physics, you can either buy our video cards or play at 30fps."

Proprietary SYSTEMS, not proprietary products. I value my freedom of choice. So does the rest of the PC world outside of gaming. How many office software packages do you have that can only use one file type, and why has that changed since the 90's?

Yep... Gaming is going backwards, not forward. This crap needs to stop.

What you are "wanting" has never existed, and arguably can't exist as there is not one manufacturer that produces every component so they could create an open platform. On top of which, where would be their funding? Open source does not keep business afloat. Hardware/Software vendors have to work together in harmony even still. Everything getting licensed or cross-licensed. Your CPU is proprietary, as is the chipset on your motherboard, to the integrated memory controllers on the DRAM chips.

Gaming graphics are at an all time high, gaming hardware has never been more powerful, the gaming industry is generating billions of dollars annually, modding is now usually expected and easier than before, we have vast digital access and fair pricing (for the most part), and we now have a choice in OSes in some AAA titles. For triple AAA choices, many of us have catalogs of games we have bought and not even played yet. Nvidia has a middleware and AMD have their own API. If I buy an AMD card, I get Mantle, if I get NVIDIA I get GameWorks. I wouldnt expect Office for Windows to run on a Mac, but here Nvidia is letting that happen. The same nVidia which used to disable features all together if AMD was detected on the machine. So they are making progress towards being more inclusive.

So what metric are you using to gauge that gaming is going backwards?
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post #74 of 94
Doesn't GTA V have Gameworks in it? That game runs great on my 780Ti Classy, even with the special NVIDIA stuff enabled and the benchmarks I've seen show it around the same as a 290X. Is there a difference in that vs how The Witcher 3 used it?
 
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post #75 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inelastic View Post

Doesn't GTA V have Gameworks in it? That game runs great on my 780Ti Classy, even with the special NVIDIA stuff enabled and the benchmarks I've seen show it around the same as a 290X. Is there a difference in that vs how The Witcher 3 used it?

Dont think so. As far as I know it has nvidia shadows but also amd shadows ...no additional stuff as far as I know
post #76 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by majin662 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inelastic View Post

Doesn't GTA V have Gameworks in it? That game runs great on my 780Ti Classy, even with the special NVIDIA stuff enabled and the benchmarks I've seen show it around the same as a 290X. Is there a difference in that vs how The Witcher 3 used it?

Dont think so. As far as I know it has nvidia shadows but also amd shadows ...no additional stuff as far as I know

It has HBAO+ and TXAA as well.

It has nvidia and AMD specific shadows. An example of multiple code paths, if { amd code } else { nvidia code }. Its obvious AMD/nvidia were involved with development early on.
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post #77 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingCain View Post

It has HBAO+ and TXAA as well.

It has nvidia and AMD specific shadows. An example of multiple code paths, if { amd code } else { nvidia code }. Its obvious AMD/nvidia were involved with development early on.

Forgot about those. ThankS. Guess it could technically be considered gameworks then?!?


Just dont really remember too much hub bub about that specific feature set as compared to say witcher as far as advertising went
post #78 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by coelacanth View Post

DirectX is a Microsoft product.

Have you seen the list of collaborators on DX? It's not just MS.
post #79 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by majin662 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingCain View Post

It has HBAO+ and TXAA as well.

It has nvidia and AMD specific shadows. An example of multiple code paths, if { amd code } else { nvidia code }. Its obvious AMD/nvidia were involved with development early on.

Forgot about those. ThankS. Guess it could technically be considered gameworks then?!?


Just dont really remember too much hub bub about that specific feature set as compared to say witcher as far as advertising went

I just looked into it, but its a Gaming Evolved title as well. AMDs similar branding of Nvidia TWIMTBP.

Looks like GameWorks doesnt hold developers back from still optimizing the game with AMD. A statement relayed by several developers? I think its crazy that a user expects nvidias gameworks feature to work just as well on AMD hardware as Nvidias. They even told AMD users that nVidia software cant be optimized for AMD hardware and nVidia is the bad guy. Even though that doesnt mean the game cant be optimized for AMD.

I guess the real question is, is GTA V factual proof enough that while AMD may not get great performance in in GameWorks features such as hairworks, AMD are free to work with developers to add any AMD optimizations, like TressFX.

Of course AMD have to put forth the effort and provide resources. Nvidia had to build special effects for dev teams, otherwise they never did it themselves. When will AMD provide that level of dev partnership, as their standard? Not one off DICE romances, but sustained support and libraries? When was TressFX in the news for a major enhancement? Or additional effects being added? We even have Dr. Su on record admitting the software side needs work and is a focus of her attention.

Did AMD provide that level of support and resources to CD Projekt Red as they did with Rockstar? Why wasnt TressFX pushed by AMD into Witcher 3 as co-library?

1.) nVidia cant be providing enough money to bribe every GamesWork using developer.
2.) Several GamesWork libraries are in place where no ill effect is perceived on AMD hardware. Anomolous cases do exist however, those titles are anticipating AMD drivers as well.
3.) Anti-trust lawsuits are not being filed by AMD. Which substantiates no wrong doing has been found as of yet. Despite loud public claims from Roy Taylor and Richard Huddy.
Edited by RagingCain - 5/19/15 at 8:39pm
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post #80 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by RagingCain View Post

I just looked into it, but its a Gaming Evolved title as well. AMDs similar branding of Nvidia TWIMTBP.

Looks like GameWorks doesnt hold developers back from still optimizing the game with AMD. A statement relayed by several developers? I think its crazy that a user expects nvidias gameworks feature to work just as well on AMD hardware as Nvidias. They even told AMD users that nVidia software cant be optimized for AMD hardware and nVidia is the bad guy. Even though that doesnt mean the game cant be optimized for AMD.

I guess the real question is, is GTA V factual proof enough that while AMD may not get great performance in in GameWorks features such as hairworks, AMD are free to work with developers to add any AMD optimizations, like TressFX.

Of course AMD have to put forth the effort and provide resources. Nvidia had to build special effects for dev teams, otherwise they never did it themselves. When will AMD provide that level of dev partnership, as their standard? Not one off DICE romances, but sustained support and libraries? When was TressFX in the news for a major enhancement? Or additional effects being added? We even have Dr. Su on record admitting the software side needs work and is a focus of her attention.

Did AMD provide that level of support and resources to CD Projekt Red as they did with Rockstar? Why wasnt TressFX pushed by AMD into Witcher 3 as co-library?

1.) nVidia cant be providing enough money to bribe every GamesWork using developer.
2.) Several GamesWork libraries are in place where no ill effect is perceived on AMD hardware. Anomolous cases do exist however, those titles are anticipating AMD drivers as well.
3.) Anti-trust lawsuits are not being filed by AMD. Which substantiates no wrong doing has been found as of yet. Despite loud public claims from Roy Taylor and Richard Huddy.

That's actually a very good question. This game does show that it is possible for both to play nicely, but is that the case in general? Did Rockstar just throw a bunch of money at AMD and NVIDIA for luxury support of their game to get it done properly? Rockstar was under alot of pressure from gamers to get the PC version right, and they do have the budget to do things like that. CDPR doesn't have nearly the amount of resources that Rockstar has and they also are known for being gamer friendly, so did they just get entry level support and weren't able to get it done the way Rockstar did? It may be possible that their stuff does technically work together, but just needs more work than most developers can or are willing to put in in order for the game to be "fully optimized."
 
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