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[Eurogamer] Uncharted 4 pushes PS4 tech to the next level - Page 35

post #341 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by zealord View Post

It is a bit more complicated than that.

You have to factor in the amount of sheeps people Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo brought into the gaming world by "making computers easier to play on".

Those people do blindly buy games. That is where the money at. Sony kind of pushes those exclusive titles because of that.

Believe me we both dream of a world where all games come to PC, but PC alone can't bring enough profit to warrant a 50+$ million production.


If PC was the only gaming platform then the quality of games would look very different. Especially in the art, animation and story department.

In terms of what kind of games we are getting, consoles do not hold PC back. They actually help us get titles and vice versa to some extend.

The only thing that is holding the development back a little bit is the limited hardware, especially the xbox one, that the consoles offer. Noone would buy a console for 899$ even if it had a GTX 980 GPU in it.

E.g. if Sony had released a 3 times as powerful console, but it cost 899$ and Xbox had released the Xbox one for 499$ then everyone would buy an Xbox.

I agree consoles probably have increased the industry by bringing a lot more people into gaming, but I disagree with them bringing anything that would not have existed if the consoles never existed.. Because there is absolutly nothing the consoles do that cannot be done on a PC aswell.. I think all these brilliant games made on consoles by brilliant developers would also have been made on PC if that was the only platform arround..

Consoles are only there for companies like MS and Sony to get a big piece of the pie and they smartly used the gap in the market of gamers looking for ease of use and who were on a budget to low to get a good PC setup.. And they do hold PC gaming back, especially now we have all these multiplatform games.. Developers of those all have to take into account that their games still have to run on limited and very old hardware when in the later part of a console lifecycle.. Also the fact things like dedicated server support etc has dissapeared and modtools etc, all show the consolemarket did not have a positive effect on PC gaming.. Especially the FPS genre really suffered imho..

Valve might have a good alternative for consolegamers now with their Steamboxes, bassicly a console but made for the PC platform.. But it's 20 years late really.. I wonder what would have happened if those existed already 20 years ago, I doubt the 1st Playstation would have had much of a chance in the market then..

But anyway if it was up to me every game would be made for just 1 open source platform so everybody could play the same games without having to buy into different platforms and no single manufature would dictate all of us what can and cannot be done on that platform, so we would not have so many restrictions because of lowest common denominator hardware, overpriced games and other stupid things like pay extra for online play etc..
Edited by Inflatable - 9/19/15 at 6:44pm
post #342 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inflatable View Post

Valve might have a good alternative for consolegamers now with their Steamboxes, bassicly a console but made for the PC platform.. But it's 20 years late really.. I wonder what would have happened if those existed already 20 years ago, I doubt the 1st Playstation would have had much of a chance in the market then..
I disagree. Making a PC that fits in a box that's roughly the same size as an xbone or PS4, and fits within the price budget of those consoles, yields you a system that's roughly comparable in performance to either. You don't get quad-Titan performance without a price tag to match, and that's the lesson Valve has yet to learn with the steam box program--or worse, they just don't care and are trying to foist SteamOS on everyone to muddy the waters even further with yet another walled garden limited-function OS.
post #343 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by irced View Post

I disagree. Making a PC that fits in a box that's roughly the same size as an xbone or PS4, and fits within the price budget of those consoles, yields you a system that's roughly comparable in performance to either. You don't get quad-Titan performance without a price tag to match, and that's the lesson Valve has yet to learn with the steam box program--or worse, they just don't care and are trying to foist SteamOS on everyone to muddy the waters even further with yet another walled garden limited-function OS.

agreed.

I highly doubt the Steamboxes are going to succeed. Imho they are dead on arrival.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inflatable View Post

I agree consoles probably have increased the industry by bringing a lot more people into gaming, but I disagree with them bringing anything that would not have existed if the consoles never existed.. Because there is absolutly nothing the consoles do that cannot be done on a PC aswell.I think all these brilliant games made on consoles by brilliant developers would also have been made on PC if that was the only platform arround..

Consoles are only there for companies like MS and Sony to get a big piece of the pie and they smartly used the gap in the market of gamers looking for ease of use and who were on a budget to low to get a good PC setup.. And they do hold PC gaming back, especially now we have all these multiplatform games.. Developers of those all have to take into account that their games still have to run on limited and very old hardware when in the later part of a console lifecycle.. Also the fact things like dedicated server support etc has dissapeared and modtools etc, all show the consolemarket did not have a positive effect on PC gaming.. Especially the FPS genre really suffered imho..

Valve might have a good alternative for consolegamers now with their Steamboxes, bassicly a console but made for the PC platform.. But it's 20 years late really.. I wonder what would have happened if those existed already 20 years ago, I doubt the 1st Playstation would have had much of a chance in the market then..

But anyway if it was up to me every game would be made for just 1 open source platform so everybody could play the same games without having to buy into different platforms and no single manufature would dictate all of us what can and cannot be done on that platform, so we would not have so many restrictions because of lowest common denominator hardware, overpriced games and other stupid things like pay extra for online play etc..


I understand your frustration. You remind me of myself 18 months ago. I know that PC is objectively the best platform with a lot of benefits if you know how to make use of them.
I think the easiest to understand comparison would be with microwave food and a good self-made meal. Microwave food tastes like ... well bad, but its easy, cheap and requires no time-investment.

You are approaching the whole thing with a scientific mind that expects the world to be like-minded, excuse me if I just assume you are above average intelligence, but a huge chunk of people that play games are probably not.
Why do so many people listen to bad music? Why do more people watch repetitive action movies like Iron man 3 instead of reading a book? Why do so many people play Call of Duty and buy the new one each year that is basically the same as last year instead of buying a game that challenges you?

We don't live in a perfect world.
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post #344 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimeracaust View Post

Who said open world or 100% freedom? The gameplay is very second rate in each section if you compare to other games in the genre, poor shooting mechanics etc., it really doesn't compare well.

I'll say it again, no one would play the game for the gameplay alone (I'll add if it had been a movie, it would have been a mid of the road summer action flick).

I don't doubt people enjoy the game, I just think it has very weak gameplay paired a decent-mediocre story that everyone loved because it was so well produced and pretty to look at.

History won't remember this game kindly and I honestly hope this generation moves away from games of this type, or at the very least this doesn't become the model for "AAA" games.

Well I am glad the industry does not listen to you and only make games for you. There are MILLIONS of people enjoying these kind of games because let me tell you again, the games are FUN. Really FUN.

Witcher 2 is a great game isn't it. It has great story, great settings, great gameplay (at least compared to Uncharted) but guess what? to me it is a yawn festival. I would take Uncharted series anyday over Witcher 2 (did not play witcher 3 yet)

You say no one would play Uncharted 2 for the gameplay alone. Why do you have to strip the game's content like that? Uncharted 2 is a game that combines great story and gameplay. They work together perfectly.

And what you say about people will forget this game, is a typical wishfull thinking of a classic PC Master Race attitude ( you might own a console but the attitude is there )... It's like "Hey I did not like the game, it is a console exclusive so let me talk crap about it ".... People will remember this game when PS5 comes out. They will ask and wish for Uncharted 5 in forums and everywhere, they will sign petitions for this to happen. If they skip another uncharted game in PS5 era (which they will) than same think will happen in PS6 era... Uncharted is one of the highest ranked and loved PS exclusives out there. Does not matter if you hate it or want it to burn down. Simple solution would be "DONY BUY THE GAME" instead of saying "I HOPE THESE GAMES DO NOT EXIST"

Quote:
Originally Posted by zealord View Post

I agree that The Last of Us is much better. Ellie is my absolute favourite. The character is so damn amazing. Ashley Johnson and Naughty Dog did a great job.

If I had to rank the Uncharted games and The Last of Us it'd be :

- Uncharted Games 7.2/10

- The Last of Us 9.4/10


Though I'm pretty sure Uncharted 4 is going to be better than a 7.2 for me personally. I didn't play the Uncharted games back in the day when they first release, but just recently. They do not age well in my opinion. The shooting, mechanics, A.I. and cheesy story is pretty outdated. I'm expecting Uncharted 4 to be MUCH MUCH more mature.


(btw I'm super hyped for The Last of us 2)

Last of Us really took everything to another level. More serious than Uncharted with serious feelings. Ellie is probably one of the best gaming characters out there. Everything about it was awesome.

I wonder if the story will be between Ellie and Joel in the 2nd game. There were rumours that it could be a story of other people in that time line.
post #345 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by irced View Post

I disagree. Making a PC that fits in a box that's roughly the same size as an xbone or PS4, and fits within the price budget of those consoles, yields you a system that's roughly comparable in performance to either. You don't get quad-Titan performance without a price tag to match, and that's the lesson Valve has yet to learn with the steam box program--or worse, they just don't care and are trying to foist SteamOS on everyone to muddy the waters even further with yet another walled garden limited-function OS.

Steam Link will be a bigger success than SteamBox if you ask me... I also believe that Valve is going to fail with steamboxes. But time will show us I guess.
post #346 of 365
What's the last game that really pushed A.I. forward the way HL2 / F.E.A.R. did back in 2004-2005?? Alien Isolation for A.I.?
post #347 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by zealord View Post

Noone would buy a console for 899$ even if it had a GTX 980 GPU in it.

E.g. if Sony had released a 3 times as powerful console, but it cost 899$ and Xbox had released the Xbox one for 499$ then everyone would buy an Xbox.

The PS3 launched at $600, the 360 i think was $300? That allowed M$ to get a huge lead last generation and crushed Sony early on. However the PS3 was a much more future proof system and back in 2006 the price on it wasn't exactly unjustified, like at all..... It gave you backwards compatibility for ps1/ps2 games, ps3 games obviously, and it was the cheapest blu-ray player at the time as well. It cost Sony around $900 to make each ps3 so they were incurring a huge loss for every system sold. The PS4 is making Sony profit from the beginning, they're no longer selling their systems at a loss. Now imagine Sony did the same thing with the PS4 like they did with the PS3 by packing it to the brim with features and computing horsepower comparable to high end (high end, not enthusiast grade hardware) pc hardware, while still maintaining the $399 price point but costing them more to manufacture each unit. They'll eventually start turning a profit on the system later in its lifespan like they did with the ps3, and they'd absolutely crush the xbox one more so than it does now with most games being 1080p 30-60fps on the ps4 with the xbox trailing behind at 720p/900p.

That said i'm really interested to know what the PS5 and Xbox Two? Will have in terms of hardware when it's their turn sometime around 2020. Will Sony and M$ both go the same route they are going now and not incur a loss on hardware sold, or deal with the losses in the beginning in favor for more powerful specs. I think in 5 years time 4k will be the new norm especially on PC, and many people will have 4k tvs in their living rooms. They're already becoming very affordable, and i just don't see people accepting another generation of systems staying at 1080p. It's not outrageous to expect 4k 30fps maybe 60fps in games from a console in 2020, when bleeding edge gaming PCs can already do that today.
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post #348 of 365
lol this again? So they finally ''innovated'' enough to have a third party OCing software on PS4?
    
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post #349 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malinkadink View Post

The PS3 launched at $600, the 360 i think was $300? That allowed M$ to get a huge lead last generation and crushed Sony early on. However the PS3 was a much more future proof system and back in 2006 the price on it wasn't exactly unjustified, like at all..... It gave you backwards compatibility for ps1/ps2 games, ps3 games obviously, and it was the cheapest blu-ray player at the time as well. It cost Sony around $900 to make each ps3 so they were incurring a huge loss for every system sold. The PS4 is making Sony profit from the beginning, they're no longer selling their systems at a loss. Now imagine Sony did the same thing with the PS4 like they did with the PS3 by packing it to the brim with features and computing horsepower comparable to high end (high end, not enthusiast grade hardware) pc hardware, while still maintaining the $399 price point but costing them more to manufacture each unit. They'll eventually start turning a profit on the system later in its lifespan like they did with the ps3, and they'd absolutely crush the xbox one more so than it does now with most games being 1080p 30-60fps on the ps4 with the xbox trailing behind at 720p/900p.
The PS3 actually costed around 830$ to make. Sony was losing around 220-240$ with each unit sold during the first year of its existence. It was also 399$ for the 40GB model and 699$ for the 60GB model. Microsoft was losing around 130$ with each Xbox 360 sold back in 2005.

Sony could have made a 700$ system with the PS4 and sell it at 400$ but they would have gone bankrupt. The PS3 made them bleed money for years until it turned profitable. The PS4 was profitable right out the gate. They couldn't afford to lose another 2-3 billion dollars in console hardware like with the PS3. Also the PS3 wasn't a lot more future proof than the Xbox 360. What made it so much more expensive was its Blu-ray player. It costed somehting like 130$ to manufacture. Had they put a standard DVD/HDVD player they could have saved a good chunk of money while keeping the system just as powerful but without Blu-ray of course. Otherwise they were fairly comparable.
Edited by Juub - 9/20/15 at 7:38am
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post #350 of 365
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inflatable View Post

This game looks really nice (I love the artwork and atmosphere).. It's just very sad it's part of the whole "exclusives" businessmodel that the consolebuilders use to lure people onto their dictated and restricted platforms.. A model that in no way is good for us gamers (WTH would I want to buy 3 computers that bassicly all do the same thing and then being forced to pay extra for stuff like inflated prices on games and online play on 2 of those platforms?!?).. I'm not falling for it anymore (yeah, I bought a Xbox and Xbox 360), Sony and MS can suck mine.. I went back to playing my games only on the most open platform (PC), which also happens to offer the best experience on almost every front (except hardwarecosts and ease of use).. It's a shame really that obvious very talented developers like the ones at Naughty Dog are part of that obnoxious "exclusives" buisinesmodel.. Their games would be even better if they were not restrictred to having to make them run on a restricted 400$ budget computer that won't get any hardwareupgrade for 6-7 years.. Sucks to miss out on games like this, but so be it.. Still plenty of other good games to play that are not part of this dark side of the gamingindustry, but it's a bit frustrating nonetheless (which is why I posted this)..

PC has plenty of exclusive too like every game ever made from Blizzard. Why complain just about console exclusives? Some of the best games of all time also happen to be console exclusives. Yoshi's Island, Donkey Kong Country 2, Goldeneye, the original Super Mario Kart, Pokemon Red/Blue, Link's Awakening, Starfox 64. I'm guessing that some of these games could not have been made if it weren't for the funding provided by being exclusive. I have no problem with exclusives as long as they create legendary games like these.
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