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176.1khz output missing from selectable options Realtek ALC1150 onboard

post #1 of 22
Thread Starter 
The entire reason I'm posting this is because I just configured my PS3 for 176.4khz audio output and I listened to some music I had stored on it and I couldn't believe how much better it sounded than my PC, so now I need to figure out how to get 176.4khz output from my PC to my receiver, but the option is missing and my receiver only supports a maximum of 176.4khz. I can select 192khz, but the receiver defaults to 44.1khz because it doesn't support 192khz. The maximum supported output sample rate I can output to the receiver, from the selectable options on the PC, is 96khz and I'm not satisfied after hearing the PS3 at 176.4khz.

It's onboard audio and I'm using the optical output to the receiver. The chip is Realtek ALC1150 7.1ch with "Purity Sound" 115dB SNR and it has been great for what I need so far except for that one limitation, no 176.1khz option for output, which now I think I need. Is it a hardware limitation or software limitation? Am I going to have to get a sound card to get what I need? I always remember this option being available on my last few computers which had even worse onboard audio... so kinda bummed. Any help is appreciated!



Edited by r0llinlacs - 10/31/15 at 10:45am
    
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post #2 of 22
Simple. Your sound adapter doesn't support that sample rate. I doubt your PC and PS3 sound any different, especially when it's sending a digital signal to the same DAC. The only reason you think it does is because you can see which one is plugged in.
 
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post #3 of 22
Thread Starter 
I'll accept the first part of your response... but the second part, I can't. They sound entirely different, I wouldn't be posting this if they didn't.
    
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post #4 of 22
You can't confirm this with a sighted test. Even if you had someone else change the source a bunch of times, I doubt you could ever tell the difference, because there would be none. A digital signal is a digital signal. It either makes it and results in an audible sound, or gets corrupted and sounds like white noise.
 
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post #5 of 22
Thread Starter 
Well I can tell you right now, there are two gigantic differences between my PS3 and my PC.

PS3 = 176.4khz w/ dithering enabled
PC = 96khz w/ no dithering

All signals are not the same, by and far. I have very good ears and I can not stress enough how much better the PS3 sounds.
Edited by r0llinlacs - 10/31/15 at 10:44am
    
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post #6 of 22
I don't think you're understanding what's going on here OP.

Your music is most likely recorded at 16bit 44.1Khz. 176Khz would be 4X the sample rate of your source material. If you are upsampling (which really doesn't make a tremendous difference btw but you seem to think it does) then you will get a true (well almost true. It's technically 176Khz but it's just sampling each slice 4X) 176Khz playback. If you're playing 44.1Khz audio across a device that is set to output at 176 and you are NOT upsampling, you will hear 44.1Khz, exactly as if the DAC were set at 44.1Khz. I think there is some mindfudgery at work here.

The odds of your PC having upsampling are slim to none.

If you want to hear what REAL high res audio sounds like, do not go to pirate bay and do not download "Diana Krall 4 SACD" which is definitely not 4 albums in WAV @ 9000+kbps @ true 192Khz. I definitely didn't download it and it definitely doesn't sound amazing.

You'll want a true audiophile player to listen, of course. Foobar bare minimum. HQplayer, Jplay or Jriver would be preferable. Make sure you set your soundcard to 192Khz.

If you want to truly benefit from some high quality sound, get some real sound equipment. Run your PC out to a high quality USB DAC then out to your home theater. USB sounds better than optical, coax, and every other digital signal transport.
Edited by mistersprinkles - 10/30/15 at 10:11pm
post #7 of 22
Please stop giving him false advice.

USB "sounds" no different than any other digital transport. IT CAN'T sound any different. A 0 is a 0 and a 1 is a 1. It either works, or it doesn't. If the signal gets corrupted on the way, it will result in a total loss of audio. Also, don't try to bring jitter into this. Jitter only has to do with the the final reproduction stage of the audio inside of the DAC (the DAC's clock). If timing is a tad off in the digital domain, but it still correctly sees a 0 as a 0 and a 1 as a 1, said jitter is erased at EVERY stage where there's a cache or a buffer.

You don't need to spend a fortune to hear good sound. There is a point of diminishing returns, which is above $100 and only offers measurable and inaudible differences, and then there is absurdity, which is beyond $1,000 and offers snobbery status.

The signals might not be the same, but it's doubtful that either of them are doing any audible changes to the original sound.
Edited by ramicio - 10/31/15 at 3:59am
 
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post #8 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by ramicio View Post

Please stop giving him false advice.

USB "sounds" no different than any other digital transport. IT CAN'T sound any different. A 0 is a 0 and a 1 is a 1. It either works, or it doesn't. If the signal gets corrupted on the way, it will result in a total loss of audio. Also, don't try to bring jitter into this. Jitter only has to do with the the final reproduction stage of the audio inside of the DAC (the DAC's clock). If timing is a tad off in the digital domain, but it still correctly sees a 0 as a 0 and a 1 as a 1, said jitter is erased at EVERY stage where there's a cache or a buffer.

You don't need to spend a fortune to hear good sound. There is a point of diminishing returns, which is above $100 and only offers measurable and inaudible differences, and then there is absurdity, which is beyond $1,000 and offers snobbery status.

The signals might not be the same, but it's doubtful that either of them are doing any audible changes to the original sound.

I can't stand people like you. It does sound different. USB is asynchronous and is clocked both on the way out and on the way in for minmal jitter. Other standards are absolutely ridden with jitter which affects the timing and quality of the sound.

People like you who say "digital is digital" are ignorant.
post #9 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistersprinkles View Post

I don't think you're understanding what's going on here OP.

Your music is most likely recorded at 16bit 44.1Khz. 176Khz would be 4X the sample rate of your source material. If you are upsampling (which really doesn't make a tremendous difference btw but you seem to think it does) then you will get a true (well almost true. It's technically 176Khz but it's just sampling each slice 4X) 176Khz playback. If you're playing 44.1Khz audio across a device that is set to output at 176 and you are NOT upsampling, you will hear 44.1Khz, exactly as if the DAC were set at 44.1Khz. I think there is some mindfudgery at work here.

That's what dithering is. It can make a huge difference depending on the type of dithering used.
Quote:
The odds of your PC having upsampling are slim to none.

That's right, PC doesn't dither anything. 96khz isn't divisible by 44.1khz. This creates quantization errors (distortion) that can only be fixed by dithering. This is why the PS3 sounds tons better. It's not distorting like my PC does.
Quote:
If you want to hear what REAL high res audio sounds like, do not go to pirate bay and do not download "Diana Krall 4 SACD" which is definitely not 4 albums in WAV @ 9000+kbps @ true 192Khz. I definitely didn't download it and it definitely doesn't sound amazing.

You'll want a true audiophile player to listen, of course. Foobar bare minimum. HQplayer, Jplay or Jriver would be preferable. Make sure you set your soundcard to 192Khz.

If you want to truly benefit from some high quality sound, get some real sound equipment. Run your PC out to a high quality USB DAC then out to your home theater. USB sounds better than optical, coax, and every other digital signal transport.

How about just send me a song? I don't use P2P.

I can't set anything to 192khz because my receiver does not support it. That's why the PS3 is at 176.4khz and the PC is at 96khz (because there's no 176.4khz option on my PC).

I use winamp and have no interest in any other players.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ramicio View Post

Please stop giving him false advice.

USB "sounds" no different than any other digital transport. IT CAN'T sound any different. A 0 is a 0 and a 1 is a 1. It either works, or it doesn't. If the signal gets corrupted on the way, it will result in a total loss of audio. Also, don't try to bring jitter into this. Jitter only has to do with the the final reproduction stage of the audio inside of the DAC (the DAC's clock). If timing is a tad off in the digital domain, but it still correctly sees a 0 as a 0 and a 1 as a 1, said jitter is erased at EVERY stage where there's a cache or a buffer.

You don't need to spend a fortune to hear good sound. There is a point of diminishing returns, which is above $100 and only offers measurable and inaudible differences, and then there is absurdity, which is beyond $1,000 and offers snobbery status.

The signals might not be the same, but it's doubtful that either of them are doing any audible changes to the original sound.

I'm split between both of you on that one. USB can sound better because of higher quality DAC's, but that won't matter if you're running it digitally into a receiver. Unless you're running analog out from the DAC into the receiver, or unless the DAC outputs bit depths and sample rates your computer doesn't, it won't sound different.

Don't get me started on speakers. Having a good clean signal/source is only 1/4 of the battle. Having a good signal path (nice cables with superior noise rejection), good clean sounding amplifiers, and good even sounding speakers (with good crossovers) are all equally important to get good sound, not to mention taking into account the acoustics of the room they'll be placed in.

I've installed and heard some very, very, very expensive speakers in my time. Everything from cheap $40 junk to speakers that cost $3,000+ per pair. There IS a difference. Like I said earlier, having a good signal/source is a good starting point, but if your speakers can't reproduce that signal faithfully, it's a waste of a good signal. Distortion is inherent in everything. The reason expensive audio components cost so much is because they don't distort or color the original signal. They put extensive R&D into making sure the frequency response is as even as can possibly be.

The best speakers I've heard to this day cost over $2k a pair. The sound they put out was amazing. I'm talking hearing subtle nuances you've never heard before, in a song you've heard a million times. Speakers can make all the difference, just as much as a good signal can make. Does this justify the cost? Probably not, but there is definitely a difference.
Edited by r0llinlacs - 10/31/15 at 10:46am
    
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post #10 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by mistersprinkles View Post

I can't stand people like you. It does sound different. USB is asynchronous and is clocked both on the way out and on the way in for minmal jitter. Other standards are absolutely ridden with jitter which affects the timing and quality of the sound.

People like you who say "digital is digital" are ignorant.

You can't prove your nonsense on blind tests.

You lack complete understanding of digital circuitry and signal paths. Every time a digital signal hits a cache or a buffer, jitter is gone. THE ONLY JITTER THAT AFFECTS THE SIGNAL AUDIBLY IS THE CLOCK OF THE DAC. A 0 is a 0 and a 1 is a 1. A simple crystal has low enough jitter as to be inaudible.
 
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COOLMAX 700 watt modular Norco RPC-3216 Areca ARC-1222 w/ BBU 4 SFF-8087 Cables 
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i5-2500k ASUS P8Z68-M Pro 16 GB (4 x 4GB) Mushkin Enhanced Silverline DDR... 64GB Kingston SSD 
Optical DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Blu-ray reader and DVD/CD burner combo drive Scythe Big Shuriken 2 Rev. B Windows 7 Ultimate x64 1440x900 old LG LCD with anti-glare film peeled... 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Dusty old Dell PS/2 Seasonic 560 watt modular Lian-li PC-V354B Some generic one from Best Buy 
Mouse PadAudioAudio
Plain black ASUS Xonar Essence STX Bottlehead Crack w/ Speedball 
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Overclock.net › Forums › Components › Sound Cards and Computer Audio › 176.1khz output missing from selectable options Realtek ALC1150 onboard