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How can I win the dust war?! - Page 4

post #31 of 61
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max78 View Post

Ya when you srart vacuuming it creates a static charge, not sure how safe that is if your vacuuming the inside of the pc.
I'm sorry, but what? Seriously? I've vacuumed dust out of computers for two decades. Please show me the scientific basis of your assertion that a vacuum creates static. Mine certainty never have, and I'm not in the business of physically touching anything in the case with a vacuum attachment, nor with my hands unless properly grounded. Thanks. My allergies are bad enough as it is. I'm not just going to blast dust in the air. Nor do I have time to carry my rig out to the driveway in order to dust it out with a compressor/canister every time it needs cleaning. The overall theme of this thread has coalesced around the good idea that having to do that kind of intrusive work is exactly what should be avoided.
Edited by linuxjedi - 9/25/15 at 9:04pm
post #32 of 61
It's more like Dust in the wind. The dust war never ends. Just have to keep up on the maintenance. Keep those custom rigs clean.
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post #33 of 61
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master__Shake View Post

compressed air pushes dust further in and never takes off the fine layer that settles on any sort of flux present from manufacturing.

i vaccuum my stuff and haven't had any sort of failures.

i even use the brush bit for it.

i have even used the dishwasher.
I have definitely never used a dishwasher ;-)

Pointing out the Flux issue was very keen. I realized right away you were right, because I once worked for a chip fabrication company way back when. I should probably go over things with a concentrated alcohol swab before installation. Really good point. Thanks for that.
post #34 of 61
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wickedout View Post

It's more like Dust in the wind. The dust war never ends. Just have to keep up on the maintenance. Keep those custom rigs clean.
I once broke an enterprise class server fan back in college because I acted like a moron and blasted it with compressed air. Not only is it wrong to blow dust into a case or chassis, it's obvious that fan blasting is dangerous when you pause to think what happens to a loosely coupled mechanical component when it is vibrated against its own center. The imbalance in rotation of the blade hub against its motor housing breaks things inside, either instantly or eventually, due to stress fractures in the rigid plastic. Blasting carelessly also overdrives the fans, damaging them even further. They aren't meant to spin that fast. You have to take care to hold the fans while running air across them in any direction--in OR out-- or they break. And if I'm going to apply air movement as a mechanism for dust removal, I really prefer that it not be directed into the case or back up at my face and eyes. I also prefer to not apply air at a speed that I can't regulate vs the use of a machine which generates a gentler, constant, regulated speed (a vacuum with detailing attachments). I wish I could say I didn't learn this the hard way. I really do. But I know most of us do a lot of stupid things in college. Maybe it isn't just the professors who teach us after all. One expensive mistake later, and you know you'll not soon repeat it.

I don't always clean my case, but when I do, I vacuum. Stay dust-free, my friends
Edited by linuxjedi - 9/25/15 at 9:25pm
post #35 of 61
The OP:
I am not going to bother to go back and quote everything you have said, but so far, you have either dismissed ideas or have been a bit condescending with "Common sense says" and "sadly anyone who can think independently," etc.
If you are unwilling to entertain the experience or suggestions of others, why did you bother to waste anyone's time with asking of them about this topic when you already have all the answers?
Concerning static/ESD and home vacuum cleaners, the article below is a bit aged, but the premise hasn't changed; like turning the steering wheel to move the tires in the desired direction.

http://www.howtogeek.com/57870/ask-how-to-geek-why-you-should-never-vacuum-your-pc-converting-books-for-the-kindle-and-controlling-multiple-computers-with-one-keyboard/

It appears you really weren't looking for suggestion that may help you, but rather using OCN as a sounding board for your frustration. Fine, but state that from the get-go so other can read and move on.

Do what you want to do, but don't waste others time. Their time is no less valuable than yours.
Edited by Questors - 9/26/15 at 7:17am
post #36 of 61
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Questors View Post

The OP:
I am not going to bother to go back and quote everything you have said, but so far, you have either dismissed ideas or have been a bit condescending with "Common sense says" and "sadly anyone who can think independently," etc.
If you are unwilling to entertain the experience or suggestions of others, why did you bother to waste anyone's time with asking of them about this topic when you already have all the answers?
Concerning static/ESD and home vacuum cleaners, the article below is a bit aged, but the premise hasn't changed; like turning the steering wheel to move the tires in the desired direction.

http://www.howtogeek.com/57870/ask-how-to-geek-why-you-should-never-vacuum-your-pc-converting-books-for-the-kindle-and-controlling-multiple-computers-with-one-keyboard/

It appears you really weren't looking for suggestion that may help you, but rather using OCN as a sounding board for your frustration. Fine, but state that from the get-go so other can read and move on.

Do what you want to do, but don't waste others time. Their time is no less valuable than yours.
Questors, you are mistaken. I certainly agree that everyone's time is valuable. You don't appear to have noticed the multiple times I expressed accepting and thankful responses. I won't take up your time by going back to quote them all. After all, I am your guest here. I've never known about this site before and many of the cool technologies that others have shared freely. I'm sorry to have offended you. When I asked for advice, I was surprised to see that suggestions were made advocating ideas that in my own personal experience have proven to be damaging. It's true that people are important and the importance of their time is all equal, but not all ideas are equal. The specialized filters from south Africa are a technological marvel, and the effectiveness of pantyhose was clearly demonstrated with photos and multiple persons coming forward with the same tip. Foam is something I've seen before with both positive and negative sides to the coin, so I'm eager to hear more about that if the follow up is forthcoming.

As for the oil dip builds, I wasn't the first nor will I ever be the last to point out the mess that makes over time. All I had to do was look into it a little before a plethora of evidence and experience showed it to be problematic. Finally, concerning the compressed air, I don't need to delve deeply into why that is not recommended, because I already did that quite thoroughly.

I appreciate the link you shared. The personal blog author provided his opinion in the exact manner as it was provided here. It was not in any way supported with factual information. When I talked about how I broke a fan with compressed air, that was a demonstration of fact. Simply saying that compressed air breaks fans without explaining how or why and providing factual evidence to establish the truth...that would be the same logical fallacy as saying all vacuums create static and therefore shouldn't be used. Ok, well, let's see. I have contrary evidence that it isn't true, and no one provided me with any kind of factual information to prove otherwise. This is the embodiment of the notion I wrote about a few sentences back when I said then, and restate now, that not all ideas are equal. When I ask for advice, it's not incumbent on me to applaud each suggestion in order to make sure that everyone feels like all time is valuable. In fact, it's more of a service to others reading this thread when we are brave enough to question ideas that are potentially damaging. Our computers are worth more than a few sentences typed on a keyboard that suggest doing something which could ruin them and void their warranties in the process, making a financial recovery impossible.

For a second time I'll apologize that I offended you. I'd like to keep on topic from this point forward if possible. If you want to talk about me personally instead of the topic, please send me a PM. I hope more folks with good ideas will chime in, if there are modders who've tried other things still unmentioned, but if not, I think we've got at least three good approaches to try here, or even combine. That's a step in the right direction!

Edited to correct phone keyboard typos.
Edited by linuxjedi - 9/26/15 at 8:20am
post #37 of 61
vacuum is generally considered bad because the nozzle of the vacuum are typically made of material that will accumulate static electricity as air pass through it. after the static buildup, it will tend to discharge onto the closest grounding source which unfortunately is typically your computer components.

as for winning the war on dust, have you considered maybe to just migrate to a better designed case with positive pressure airflow and filtered intake that is easy to access/clean?
post #38 of 61
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by psyclum View Post

vacuum is generally considered bad because the nozzle of the vacuum are typically made of material that will accumulate static electricity as air pass through it. after the static buildup, it will tend to discharge onto the closest grounding source which unfortunately is typically your computer components.

as for winning the war on dust, have you considered maybe to just migrate to a better designed case with positive pressure airflow and filtered intake that is easy to access/clean?
Yes. I am definitely going with a new case for starters. I think I'll add the specialized contour-fitting filters also mentioned here. Since I'm starting a new build soon, I'll be doing it from the onset. I'll also make sure my fans are configured for positive pressure, which is an excellent idea that I never knew until you and a couple other folks shared that. I'm really glad you did =)

The vacuum parts I use are brushes designed for cleaning electronics. I should hope no one gets the idea from me that it's somehow a good idea to poke around inside your case with a vacuum/attachment designed for cleaning up water and paint. Really, really bad idea.
Edited by linuxjedi - 9/26/15 at 9:49am
post #39 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master__Shake View Post

compressed air pushes dust further in and never takes off the fine layer that settles on any sort of flux present from manufacturing.

i vaccuum my stuff and haven't had any sort of failures.

i even use the brush bit for it.

i have even used the dishwasher.

I'm not talking a can of air, i'm talking 90psi air out of a proper nozzle. it removes large quantities of dust from things like radiators, reference style GPUs, etc. a fine layer of dust cannot be removed from the inside of a vapor chamber heatsink by a vacuum, either, but more of it will come out with compressed air than a vacuum/brush.

index.php?ct=articles&action=file&id=7148

sure a dishwasher will do a better job, but a running PC in a dishwasher is a bad idea. I've actually run some stuff through a dishwasher - I got some stuff that was owned by a smoker, and the only way to get it clean was to put it in the dishwasher (which is preferable to a brush/scrubbing in the sink because surface mount tech).

when people talk of vacuums and brushes, unless they specifically call out specialized tools, I assume they're using normal home stuff - I have had people ask me to fix their fans after they break a blade off by hitting it with the vacuum (or busting the bearing in the center). if you carefully apply compressed air, the risk of damaging fans is relatively minor.
Edited by u3b3rg33k - 9/26/15 at 10:49am
 
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post #40 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxjedi View Post

Questors, you are mistaken. I certainly agree that everyone's time is valuable. You don't appear to have noticed the multiple times I expressed accepting and thankful responses. I won't take up your time by going back to quote them all. After all, I am your guest here. I've never known about this site before and many of the cool technologies that others have shared freely. I'm sorry to have offended you. When I asked for advice, I was surprised to see that suggestions were made advocating ideas that in my own personal experience have proven to be damaging. It's true that people are important and the importance of their time is all equal, but not all ideas are equal. The specialized filters from south Africa are a technological marvel, and the effectiveness of pantyhose was clearly demonstrated with photos and multiple persons coming forward with the same tip. Foam is something I've seen before with both positive and negative sides to the coin, so I'm eager to hear more about that if the follow up is forthcoming.

As for the oil dip builds, I wasn't the first nor will I ever be the last to point out the mess that makes over time. All I had to do was look into it a little before a plethora of evidence and experience showed it to be problematic. Finally, concerning the compressed air, I don't need to delve deeply into why that is not recommended, because I already did that quite thoroughly.

I appreciate the link you shared. The personal blog author provided his opinion in the exact manner as it was provided here. It was not in any way supported with factual information. When I talked about how I broke a fan with compressed air, that was a demonstration of fact. Simply saying that compressed air breaks fans without explaining how or why and providing factual evidence to establish the truth...that would be the same logical fallacy as saying all vacuums create static and therefore shouldn't be used. Ok, well, let's see. I have contrary evidence that it isn't true, and no one provided me with any kind of factual information to prove otherwise. This is the embodiment of the notion I wrote about a few sentences back when I said then, and restate now, that not all ideas are equal. When I ask for advice, it's not incumbent on me to applaud each suggestion in order to make sure that everyone feels like all time is valuable. In fact, it's more of a service to others reading this thread when we are brave enough to question ideas that are potentially damaging. Our computers are worth more than a few sentences typed on a keyboard that suggest doing something which could ruin them and void their warranties in the process, making a financial recovery impossible.

For a second time I'll apologize that I offended you. I'd like to keep on topic from this point forward if possible. If you want to talk about me personally instead of the topic, please send me a PM. I hope more folks with good ideas will chime in, if there are modders who've tried other things still unmentioned, but if not, I think we've got at least three good approaches to try here, or even combine. That's a step in the right direction!

Edited to correct phone keyboard typos.
I'm not offended.
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