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PCI-E Lane help.

post #1 of 6
Thread Starter 
im using z170 asus hero http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/70055-asus-maximus-viii-hero-z170-motherboard-review-3.html
they have 3 pci-e lane if im not wrong.
since im using zotac amp extreme 980ti it blocks my 2nd pci-e lane.
and i want to put my intel 750 / samsung 950 pro on the 3rd pci-e lane will that decrease performance ?
1st lane = zotac amp extreme
2nd lane = block by the size of the graphic card
3rd lane = intel 750 or samsung 950 pro. will that decrease the performance. or arent able to optimize the speed of the ssd ?
post #2 of 6
Nah you should be fine. Current GPU's can't even saturate the full PCIE 3.0 x16 slot. That's why you can run your card on PCIE x8 and receive no performance hit. Sent an email to Asus asking them the same and they will for sure let you know how to truly setup your configuration.
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Kylo RED
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Samsung 840 pro 128GB  Seagate 3TB HDD Custom Water Cooled Loop [Apogee XL, D5 Pump, E... Deepcool RF RGB 120MM Fans x6 
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post #3 of 6
You probably want to put your Zotac in the top long grey PCIe slot (also known as PCIE_X16/X8_1 in the manual). It gets its PCIe lanes directly from the CPU. Put your Intel 750 or Samsung in the bottom long black PCIe slot (PCIEX4_3 in the manual). That slot gets its PCIe lanes from the motherboard's chipset, rather than the CPU. If you don't have any PCIe cards in any of the 3 short black PCIe slots, your Intel 750 in PCIEX4_3 will run at x4, which is plenty for a PCIe NVMe card.

Since it won't be directly off the CPU, you'll have a slightly increased amount of latency with the NVMe compared to if you installed it in PCIE_X16/X8_1 instead of putting the Zotac there. But for most applications of the average user that degree of latency supposedly is negligible, and it's a tradeoff you make to get the best speeds for the video card.

http://www.kitguru.net/components/motherboard/luke-hill/asus-maximus-viii-hero-z170-motherboard-review/3/

As far as I understand it, if you put the Zotac in the top slot it will run at x16 (or, at worst, at x8), which should be plenty of bandwidth for it.
Quote:
Our testing [circa November 2013] has pretty clearly shown that for gaming using either PCI-E 2.0 or PCI-E 3.0 will give you nearly identical performance. Oddly, in some benchmarks PCI-E 2.0 was actually faster than PCI-E 3.0. At the same time, x16 was not consistantly faster than x8. Again, x8 was actually faster than x16 in many cases. So unless you care about getting up to 1.5 FPS better performance, you might actually want to manually set your video cards to operate at x8 speeds - although we really would not recommend doing so.
https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Impact-of-PCI-E-Speed-on-Gaming-Performance-518/#Conclusion

Note: Pretty good explanation of what x16, x8, x4, and x1 mean at:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-pci-express/3/
Edited by quipers - 9/28/15 at 7:04am
post #4 of 6
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NexusRed View Post

Nah you should be fine. Current GPU's can't even saturate the full PCIE 3.0 x16 slot. That's why you can run your card on PCIE x8 and receive no performance hit. Sent an email to Asus asking them the same and they will for sure let you know how to truly setup your configuration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by quipers View Post

You probably want to put your Zotac in the top long grey PCIe slot (also known as PCIE_X16/X8_1 in the manual). It gets its PCIe lanes directly from the CPU. Put your Intel 750 or Samsung in the bottom long black PCIe slot (PCIEX4_3 in the manual). That slot gets its PCIe lanes from the motherboard's chipset, rather than the CPU. If you don't have any PCIe cards in any of the 3 short black PCIe slots, your Intel 750 in PCIEX4_3 will run at x4, which is plenty for a PCIe NVMe card.

Since it won't be directly off the CPU, you'll have a slightly increased amount of latency with the NVMe compared to if you installed it in PCIE_X16/X8_1 instead of putting the Zotac there. But for most applications of the average user that degree of latency supposedly is negligible, and it's a tradeoff you make to get the best speeds for the video card.

http://www.kitguru.net/components/motherboard/luke-hill/asus-maximus-viii-hero-z170-motherboard-review/3/

As far as I understand it, if you put the Zotac in the top slot it will run at x16 (or, at worst, at x8), which should be plenty of bandwidth for it.
https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Impact-of-PCI-E-Speed-on-Gaming-Performance-518/#Conclusion

Note: Pretty good explanation of what x16, x8, x4, and x1 mean at:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-pci-express/3/
someone quoted me "The first two slots are PCIe 3.0 x16 meaning you can plug your Graphics card into either of them. Both of these slots are directly connected to the CPU so there is no difference in speed.

There's nothing stopping you from using PCIe 3.0 x16 slot 1 for the SSD and slot 2 for the graphics card.

I'm speaking from experience because I had to put my GPU into slot two with my first CPU cooler. There was zero difference in the running speeds." "this is also true, you could run the GPU in slot 2 and install the SSD on top of it in slot 1. "
is that fine ?
slot 1 = graphic card
slot 2 = empty
slot 3 = intel 750 ssd / samsung 950 pro
or
slot 1 = intel 750 ssd / samsung 950 pro
slot 2 = graphic card
slot 3 = empty
which is better and faster?
Edited by danielhowk - 9/28/15 at 6:40pm
post #5 of 6
My limited understanding is that you can do either. When you said in the opening post that your Zotac was blocking the second PCIe, I thought you meant that you had the Zotac in the top long PCIe and its installation there was physically keeping you from being able to use the second PCIe. (Some video cards, with watercooling and whatnot, are pretty big now.)

The NVMe only needs x4 bandwidth for full transfer capacity.
The graphics card presumably only needs x8 bandwidth.

If you put anything (such as the Intel or Samsung) in the top long grey PCIe
slot 1 = intel 750 ssd / samsung 950 pro
slot 2 = graphic card
slot 3 = empty
it will make that top PCIe and the long black one below it both run at x8, which will be more than enough bandwidth for the NVMe and adequate bandwidth for the graphics card.
The benefit will be that there shouldn't be any increase in latency with the NVMe in this configuration. Theoretically, it could slow down a graphics card that needs the full x16 bandwidth, but according to that article I linked to in the previous post, graphics cards applications had not yet reached that level of thirst for bandwidth as of about two years ago.

If you put the graphics card in the top long grey PCIe and the NVMe in the bottom long black PCIe
slot 1 = graphic card
slot 2 = empty
slot 3 = intel 750 ssd / samsung 950 pro
the graphics card will have a full x16 available from directly off the cpu and the Intel or Samsung will have a full x4 bandwidth from off the chipset (if you don't use any of the short PCIe slots). In this configuration, you won't have to wonder whether your graphics card is being held back due to lack of bandwidth, although, again, that is unlikely because graphics cards probably don't need that much bandwidth yet. The disadvantage is that there might be a slight amount of increased latency with the Intel or Samsung because the PCIe lanes are not directly off the cpu. Whether that increased latency would make any difference in real-world applications you actually use, as opposed to in synthetic benchmarks tests, I don't know.
post #6 of 6
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by quipers View Post

My limited understanding is that you can do either. When you said in the opening post that your Zotac was blocking the second PCIe, I thought you meant that you had the Zotac in the top long PCIe and its installation there was physically keeping you from being able to use the second PCIe. (Some video cards, with watercooling and whatnot, are pretty big now.)

The NVMe only needs x4 bandwidth for full transfer capacity.
The graphics card presumably only needs x8 bandwidth.

If you put anything (such as the Intel or Samsung) in the top long grey PCIe
slot 1 = intel 750 ssd / samsung 950 pro
slot 2 = graphic card
slot 3 = empty
it will make that top PCIe and the long black one below it both run at x8, which will be more than enough bandwidth for the NVMe and adequate bandwidth for the graphics card.
The benefit will be that there shouldn't be any increase in latency with the NVMe in this configuration. Theoretically, it could slow down a graphics card that needs the full x16 bandwidth, but according to that article I linked to in the previous post, graphics cards applications had not yet reached that level of thirst for bandwidth as of about two years ago.

If you put the graphics card in the top long grey PCIe and the NVMe in the bottom long black PCIe
slot 1 = graphic card
slot 2 = empty
slot 3 = intel 750 ssd / samsung 950 pro
the graphics card will have a full x16 available from directly off the cpu and the Intel or Samsung will have a full x4 bandwidth from off the chipset (if you don't use any of the short PCIe slots). In this configuration, you won't have to wonder whether your graphics card is being held back due to lack of bandwidth, although, again, that is unlikely because graphics cards probably don't need that much bandwidth yet. The disadvantage is that there might be a slight amount of increased latency with the Intel or Samsung because the PCIe lanes are not directly off the cpu. Whether that increased latency would make any difference in real-world applications you actually use, as opposed to in synthetic benchmarks tests, I don't know.
thank you rep + 1
it was a very detailed and clear information.
slot 1 = graphic card
slot 2 = empty
slot 3 = intel 750 ssd / samsung 950 pro
the increased latency should be really low / unnoticable ? i know you said you dont know. but when other people use it for other purposes did it slow down by alot or just marginal
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