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[ZDnet] Microsoft tries to clear the air on Windows 10 privacy furor - Page 4

post #31 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by cookieboyeli View Post

People who disagree with this, could you explain your logic to me?

Very easy to explain: you don't want your privacy, we do. You want to live in a dystopian tyranny, we don't. We will pay MS to spy on us, we don't want to but you do.

There, it's all explained.
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post #32 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
That is how it has been done forever. It does not work.

They will simply complain that you can not help them "now", and when you deny them assistance without it, they will interpret it as you deny them assistance period and will complain about your horrible service.
MS is not "The Watchmen" to be watched. They are the one the Watchmen watches.

NSA doesn't need to hack anyone, you can thank the Patriot Act. But I assure you, Event logs are very dry reading.
There are holes regardless. Willing to bet more then a few of you don't bother being ultra-strict with your Windows Firewall, ActiveX controls, or most other OS functions.

Also if you think what MS is collecting is bad... Ho man, you need to sit down and strap in, because Event Viewer is designed as a Client-Server app and has been for generations. It is designed to tell your domain servers what is wrong just to log it. And I mean log everything. Every update, every AV scan, every program fail, it is, if you calibrate it right, insanely fine grained. You think what MS is doing is easily hijack-able, one Trojan could have the grand majority of the things you do, all the way down to what services are running, kicking data out like a wood-chipper.

MS wants to see when things break. But this is not new. If you have even been "Tech Support", "Field Support" or any other type of support staff for a large company, you know what kind of control exists in base Windows. And it goes way back to Pre-XP. Microsoft wants some of that info so they can fix things too, only now it's mandatory.

As for adding the disable option... No. Not even if it was obscure. andrewq2's response to me is exactly why. You (imaginary users) can not be trusted. You will go out of your way to not help yourselves. You have proven this over decades to the point that every major company forces this now.
Since my users outnumber me and my co-workers about 1000:1, ya, I'll take all the help I can get. But you probably don't know that feeling if that's your opinion. wink.gif

P.S. If you work for a large corporation, just about everything you do is logged. Like, all of it. Even if you're still on XP. You'd be amazed.

Also, please, go open Event Viewer -> Windows Logs -> Application. What in there is "private", besides obviously omitted things like a username?
The average user is an idiot, at least about the OS. Even on OCN people complain about symptoms and not problems. Fixing things off symptoms is a complete pain, especially when the user will lie to you just to protect their pride.

That aside, Windows 10 is not a standard OS like XP/7/8, they were planning on going to a rolling-release pattern which is significantly more complex. Additionally, they want the Store, which will require telemetry just like the App Store and Play Store.

If this is all MS are doing please explain why every key stroke, every file you access, Bitlocker keys, every video you watch, etc. are uploaded to Bing's servers. Needing a key logger to ensure the safety and stability of their software is nonsense. I do not need them to keep me safe from myself for my own good, I can choose and decide which updates I install myself. While most people may be ignorant and know nothing I want the choice.

And just because you are propagating we live in a world that is far worse than that of 1984 and This Perfect Day I do not want to live in such a world.
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post #33 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by xenophobe View Post

I read both their statements to be "your privacy makes my job harder so I'm against it". They should be willing to take pay cuts if their jobs are easier, right? lol

Pretty much this.
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post #34 of 186
if i wasn't able to get education from my elms account i wouldn't be using windows 10. would stay on 8.1 + linux.
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post #35 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by xenophobe View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post

Just because the current status quo is not properly handled that does not excuse them to go full privacy invasion on people.

Make a better designed product - both Windows and third party applications - that have a "send error report about the last crash or last x number of crashes" button that is easy to find and display a list with the information that is going to be sent. Also, make it clear to the customer to not expect a swift response without said report. This is a matter of setting a standard that everybody knows about and we can all agree on.

If you do this on a case by case basis instead of just collecting everything about everyone you both preserve the vast majority of people's privacy, but you also get to have the information that is helpful to try and help those that need it.

I read both their statements to be "your privacy makes my job harder so I'm against it". They should be willing to take pay cuts if their jobs are easier, right? lol
Haha never thought of it like that. It really does boil down to this.
post #36 of 186
You can turn Off Telemetry in Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB, And yes there is a 4th option.

Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB has four telemetry settings: Off, Basic, Full, and Enhanced

All I did was go into gpedit.msc and set Telemetry to Enabled=Off

Simple ! biggrin.gif
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post #37 of 186
I hate to say it, but there is only one way to vote here...don't like Windows 10 for whatever reason, don't use it. Don't be mad because a company is not catering to a minority. Loads of people are using Windows 10, and that's just how it is. Complain all you want...but there is nothing you can do about it other than not use the product and find some other alternative instead.
post #38 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiOfPie View Post


My drop-dead requirements for upgrading my main rig are:
An option that (actually) allows me to disable driver updates.

THIS!

Worst thing they've ever done is "Automatic driver updates"... I don't want to start with my sad stories about this, well...
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post #39 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by criznit View Post

OH look another "M$ iz bad, privacyyyyyyyy!?!>!ML!M!" thread lol. If no one has noticed, privacy doesn't exist! EVERYTHING collects data, data mines or even sells your data to the highest bidder. If you grocery shop and use their store card, if you use netflix, if you watch tv, if you surf the internet (doesn't matter which browser or search engine, they all collect data), if you have a smartphone etc. you will subject yourself to some sort of data invasion. Do I like it? Heck no, but it exists. Not ONE company is pure in a "we don't collect data" type of way because that would be a lie. Anyone that works IT or has any IT background would tell you that data is like gold now and everyone has a way to get it from you if you like it or not. /rant

All arguments about MS having good intentions or not, this is completely correct.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron_Henderson View Post

I hate to say it, but there is only one way to vote here...don't like Windows 10 for whatever reason, don't use it. Don't be mad because a company is not catering to a minority. Loads of people are using Windows 10, and that's just how it is. Complain all you want...but there is nothing you can do about it other than not use the product and find some other alternative instead.

And so is this.

My arguments are not saying that you should continue to use Win10, it's that you either put up or shut up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by garikfox View Post

You can turn Off Telemetry in Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB, And yes there is a 4th option.

Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB has four telemetry settings: Off, Basic, Full, and Enhanced

All I did was go into gpedit.msc and set Telemetry to Enabled=Off

Simple ! biggrin.gif

And this is why it doesn't matter. I was telling someone earlier that it wasn't going to effect large companies, and this solidified it. Thanks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liranan View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
That is how it has been done forever. It does not work.

They will simply complain that you can not help them "now", and when you deny them assistance without it, they will interpret it as you deny them assistance period and will complain about your horrible service.
MS is not "The Watchmen" to be watched. They are the one the Watchmen watches.

NSA doesn't need to hack anyone, you can thank the Patriot Act. But I assure you, Event logs are very dry reading.
There are holes regardless. Willing to bet more then a few of you don't bother being ultra-strict with your Windows Firewall, ActiveX controls, or most other OS functions.

Also if you think what MS is collecting is bad... Ho man, you need to sit down and strap in, because Event Viewer is designed as a Client-Server app and has been for generations. It is designed to tell your domain servers what is wrong just to log it. And I mean log everything. Every update, every AV scan, every program fail, it is, if you calibrate it right, insanely fine grained. You think what MS is doing is easily hijack-able, one Trojan could have the grand majority of the things you do, all the way down to what services are running, kicking data out like a wood-chipper.

MS wants to see when things break. But this is not new. If you have even been "Tech Support", "Field Support" or any other type of support staff for a large company, you know what kind of control exists in base Windows. And it goes way back to Pre-XP. Microsoft wants some of that info so they can fix things too, only now it's mandatory.

As for adding the disable option... No. Not even if it was obscure. andrewq2's response to me is exactly why. You (imaginary users) can not be trusted. You will go out of your way to not help yourselves. You have proven this over decades to the point that every major company forces this now.
Since my users outnumber me and my co-workers about 1000:1, ya, I'll take all the help I can get. But you probably don't know that feeling if that's your opinion. wink.gif

P.S. If you work for a large corporation, just about everything you do is logged. Like, all of it. Even if you're still on XP. You'd be amazed.

Also, please, go open Event Viewer -> Windows Logs -> Application. What in there is "private", besides obviously omitted things like a username?
The average user is an idiot, at least about the OS. Even on OCN people complain about symptoms and not problems. Fixing things off symptoms is a complete pain, especially when the user will lie to you just to protect their pride.

That aside, Windows 10 is not a standard OS like XP/7/8, they were planning on going to a rolling-release pattern which is significantly more complex. Additionally, they want the Store, which will require telemetry just like the App Store and Play Store.

If this is all MS are doing please explain why every key stroke, every file you access, Bitlocker keys, every video you watch, etc. are uploaded to Bing's servers. Needing a key logger to ensure the safety and stability of their software is nonsense. I do not need them to keep me safe from myself for my own good, I can choose and decide which updates I install myself. While most people may be ignorant and know nothing I want the choice.

And just because you are propagating we live in a world that is far worse than that of 1984 and This Perfect Day I do not want to live in such a world.

Wireshark it and prove it.

Till then, kthnxbye.
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post #40 of 186
Quote:
Originally Posted by garikfox View Post

You can turn Off Telemetry in Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB, And yes there is a 4th option.

Windows 10 Enterprise 2015 LTSB has four telemetry settings: Off, Basic, Full, and Enhanced

All I did was go into gpedit.msc and set Telemetry to Enabled=Off

Simple ! biggrin.gif

The problem is that Windows 10 Enterprise LTSB is not free for most people.

You have keys, I will have keys, but most people will have to put up with Home or Pro. Windows 10 Home is one of the most obnoxious user experiences I've had in living memory. Pro is better, and what can be done with gpedit helps a lot, but it's still like pulling teeth to get the OS to behave in a reasonable manner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron_Henderson View Post

I hate to say it, but there is only one way to vote here...don't like Windows 10 for whatever reason, don't use it. Don't be mad because a company is not catering to a minority. Loads of people are using Windows 10, and that's just how it is. Complain all you want...but there is nothing you can do about it other than not use the product and find some other alternative instead.

The more people protest about the legitimate and easily correctable issues they have, the more likely they are to be corrected. Many of the better aspects of Windows 10 are a direct result of the enormous backlash over the problems introduced with Windows 8.

If Microsoft wants to accelerate the transition to Windows 10, they are going to need to cater to the huge number of people who haven't switched yet. The fanatics and early adopters are already on the OS, and despite a promising early adoption rate (mostly because MS is trying to ram it down everyone's throat), it's going to be a long time before it surpasses Windows 7 at the rate things are going.

The operating system is free and is being pushed pretty hard...if there weren't major issues, we'd all be using it on all of our systems.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

My arguments are not saying that you should continue to use Win10, it's that you either put up or shut up.

Which is ridiculous.

Windows 10 is a delicious chocolate shake...with a big turd floating in it. I would like to use it, but fecal content needs to be reduced a bit further.
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Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Software News › [ZDnet] Microsoft tries to clear the air on Windows 10 privacy furor