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[M] Europe and Russia to colonize dark side of the Moon with joint space base - Page 5

post #41 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpankyMcFlych View Post

The "dark" side of the moon would probably be useful for telescopes and whatnot. Get a much better view of the cosmos when the dark side is facing away from the sun.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laysson View Post

People dying of famine on Earth, yeah let's colonize the Moon, so good.

Those people should grow some food then or something, it's nothing to do with us. We can't force the backwards parts of the world to accept the rule of law, to form stable governments, to reduce their populations to manageable levels, and to stop killing eachother. They have to do these things for themselves. Aid money is a bottomless pit that accomplishes nothing, literally throwing money down a pit. Advancing the common good through stuff like the research accomplished through the space program does far more for everyone the world over then aid money has ever done.

The space program is a big part of how the first world can help the third.

Agreed.
Sometimes lump sums can help in case of grand scale natural disasters, but for the most part it's all a matter of too many people with no respect for individual rights or civil behavior.
post #42 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chakravant View Post

Article 2.

Which says ...
Quote:
Article II

Outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means.


They aren't claiming the moon. But make no mistake, they are claiming their base ON the moon.

I'm sorry, but even China and the USSR gave up on the failed notion of "everyone owns everything and we have to pay for everything for everyone". Sorry, but Communism is dead. Private property, especially state property that costs billions of dollars, is sovereign.

Further, let's be real here. Authority on a piece of paper means NOTHING without the threat and power of a "What if?" What will the UN do if Russia starts putting a base up there and doesn't allow anyone but who Russia wants up there? The fact of the matter is, without the MIGHT of several key nations, the UN is a toothless bunch of paper pushers who can do nothing. Hell, if it wasn't for those key nations, they wouldn't have any money, any resources, any "security forces", any way to get to the moon, or even a single 9mm handgun.
Edited by 47 Knucklehead - 10/21/15 at 4:24pm
post #43 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by GingerJohn View Post

The UN Security Council is comprised of several permanent member states and several non-permanent, elected ones. The permanent member states include the three countries that have actually put people in space; China, Russia, and the USA.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_members_of_the_United_Nations_Security_Council

So yes, the UN has gone to space, and they do have a fair bit of power.

I read all that as Jedi Council for some reason lol
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post #44 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvarez View Post

Scrolled down for this kinda comment.

Wasnt disappointed.

I swear there should be a special case of Godwin's Law for those kinds of comments.

Godwin's Law: Space Edition

"As online discussion about space travel grows longer, the probability of comparing it with starving people approaches 1".

However, I am kind of skeptical that Roscosmos or even the ESA could afford to make a joint effort for such a moon project in this time frame. They still need a lot of subsidies for more R&D, when compared to the US. Isn't Russia also in a wishy-washy economic state right now? Their military activity is a sure way to distract from that.
post #45 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chakravant View Post

Article 2.

Which says ...
Quote:
Article II

Outer space, including the moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means.


They aren't claiming the moon. But make no mistake, they are claiming their base ON the moon.

I'm sorry, but even China and the USSR gave up on the failed notion of "everyone owns everything and we have to pay for everything for everyone". Sorry, but Communism is dead. Private property, especially state property that costs billions of dollars, is sovereign.

Further, let's be real here. Authority on a piece of paper means NOTHING without the threat and power of a "What if?" What will the UN do if Russia starts putting a base up there and doesn't allow anyone but who Russia wants up there? The fact of the matter is, without the MIGHT of several key nations, the UN is a toothless bunch of paper pushers who can do nothing. Hell, if it wasn't for those key nations, they wouldn't have any money, any resources, any "security forces", any way to get to the moon, or even a single 9mm handgun.
What happens when we develop the technology to claim great swaths of land in this way? I can see that turning ugly real quick.
post #46 of 103
I have high hopes that NASA isn't completely stupid from a PR vantage point (Unlike the American public) and realizes that a mission to Mars will likely garner much more support than returning to the moon (no matter how much sense that might make).

With the uneducated religious fervor that is spreading across the nation (US) that vilifies science (and common sense), I can only hope that other countries will take up the mantle and push ahead to explore the boundaries of science. I'm afraid that we will be out of the game for awhile, unless we can make it a "national security issue". Of course, if a few corporations could get rich off it it... rolleyes.gif
post #47 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post

Which says ...
They aren't claiming the moon. But make no mistake, they are claiming their base ON the moon.

I'm sorry, but even China and the USSR gave up on the failed notion of "everyone owns everything and we have to pay for everything for everyone". Sorry, but Communism is dead. Private property, especially state property that costs billions of dollars, is sovereign.

Further, let's be real here. Authority on a piece of paper means NOTHING without the threat and power of a "What if?" What will the UN do if Russia starts putting a base up there and doesn't allow anyone but who Russia wants up there? The fact of the matter is, without the MIGHT of several key nations, the UN is a toothless bunch of paper pushers who can do nothing. Hell, if it wasn't for those key nations, they wouldn't have any money, any resources, any "security forces", any way to get to the moon, or even a single 9mm handgun.
"Might makes right." is not legal policy in the US, China, or Russia.
Money does not make parts of the moon sovereign. That is the entire point behind the treaty in the first place.
post #48 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Murderfini View Post

Sadly america isn't included. America isn't included?headscratch.gif

This country is hardly interested in space science compared to what it used to.
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post #49 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpykeZ View Post

This country is hardly interested in space science compared to what it used to.

I think space weapons were deemed too expensive.
post #50 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlatonicBS View Post

Great now they Aliens on the dark side of the moon will speak Russian or one of a dozen other languages not named American

Not sure if serious or just...
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