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Get a load of this whacky problem.

post #1 of 13
Thread Starter 
So, I'm working on a newer DAW (digital audio workstation). I grabbed an FX-8350 with a Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD3 (rev. 1.1), with 16GB ram, some SSDs, etc... My previous DAW was running a Phenon II X6 1045T with 8GB ram, HDD, etc...

Anyway, the new system has an interesting problem - which is sort of baffling me currently.

When using my trusty old Thermaltake ToughPower 750W modular power supply (the one that was used in my existing DAW, and also in prior iterations of it, as well as my own system for a time), the computer will completely lose power while either beginning Windows installation OR booting into Windows... UNLESS there is something plugged into the front panel USB 2.0 port. confusedsmiley.png So long as something is plugged into the front panel USB 2.0 port, everything works fine... Now, if I pull something out of the front panel USB 2.0 port, it shuts off immediately.

Now, if I use this Corsair CX600 (non modular) PSU, everything works just peachy. Problem is, I do not want to use the CX600 as it's not modular and honestly, that ThermalTake ToughPower has been super stable and one of my most reliable PSUs for years now. I'd like to continue to use it in this version of the DAW, but this particular problem is absolutely baffling me. If I take the ToughPower and put it back into the old system, it runs it perfectly. If I use it to power up other systems around here, everything is just great. Why is it having such a problem with this particular computer? Is there some chance that it just has some strange incompatibility with the Motherboard? I should mention that I had tried changing the USB header that the front panel is connected to, and it made no difference.

Oh, and one other piece of info. After the PC cuts power on itself, you cannot turn it back on until you've shut the main power switch on the PSU off for a few seconds. Also, if you leave the PC in BIOS, it stays on no problem. Only when booting to Windows or Windows installation does it die out. I was almost thinking that maybe it's some sort of weird ground issue that the ThermalTake is picking up on, and shutting down as protection... but it doesn't make sense why that would only happen if entering Windows installation or Windows itself (for example, I had to install Windows with the CX600).

I'm all ears (or, well, eyes in this case) - and thanks!
Edited by TamaDrumz76 - 10/22/15 at 1:15am
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post #2 of 13
Wow! The Zombie Apocalypses has started - in your PSU!

Only thing I can think of:
PSUs are supposed to supply 5 volts to the motherboard, even with the PSU switched off, to keep the BIOS eprom charged. If yours isn't, and the BIOS battery is low/dead perhaps.................

subscribed......
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post #3 of 13
Thread Starter 
Yeah, I don't know. I've never quite experienced something along these lines before. The voltage stability on the ThermalTake is killer and I've run my over-clocked, multi-video card system on it before without a hiccup. It's exceptionally strange, especially as it only seems to occur when Windows is beginning to be loaded (again, either the installer or into the actual OS if it's already present).
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post #4 of 13
Thread Starter 
I took the front panel apart to see if the USB port shares a PCB with the power switch or anything to see if maybe something is screwy there, but they do not. The PCB which has the USB ports only also has the front panel audio on it, the power and reset switches are entirely separate. This is really throwing me through a loop. I tried clearing the CMOS, flashing different BIOS versions, etc... Nothing is changing this oddity so far.
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post #5 of 13
In your BIOS is booting from USB set?
Is that the only Boot Device set to boot from? Also sheck under Hard Drives and see if all your drives are listed.

I think you would see the same symptoms if trying to boot from a USB stick that didn't have an OS on it and it was the only drive in your BIOS.

I really doubt you have a hardware problem, but then, the other PSU works fine???????????
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post #6 of 13
Thread Starter 
Drives show properly. Boot is set to go from SSD drive. Since I'm done installing Windows, I put the boot order back to HDD first in list, then CD/DVD, then USB. Heh, and yeah - all is normal with the other PSU.

The only thing I can think is that the ThermalTake must be shutting itself off, with one of its protection circuits, maybe detecting a bad ground, or short circuit or whatever... but it's incredibly strange that it only does this when loading the OS or OS installer (if OS not already present). If I throw a wireless adapter in the front USB 2.0 port, the PC will boot and run fine - I can run stress tests, etc, it will stay on and work great (unless I remove that device from the front USB port, then OFF it goes, haha).
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post #7 of 13
I have had issues where certain PSUs just don't play nice with some systems. I have a Cooler Master 750W PSU, for example, but it wouldn't drive my P5Q board; I had to put in an OCZ 550W PSU to get it to work.

I also remember a time when I had a P35 board (I think it was my ASRock 4Core1600Twins-P35) somehow get into a cycle where it kept powering on, then cutting out, lather, rinse, repeat. I think I traced that problem to my 24pin cable being *just* loose enough to transiently lose connection, but not loose enough to utterly fail to power the system when I pressed the front switch. Pushing all my power cables snugly in prevented that, I do believe.

So I guess the moral of the story is sometimes PSUs plain don't play nice, and pushing cables in one more time just to be sure can fix otherwise weird problems.
Edited by Quantum Reality - 10/23/15 at 9:53am
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post #8 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by TamaDrumz76 View Post

Drives show properly. Boot is set to go from SSD drive. Since I'm done installing Windows, I put the boot order back to HDD first in list, then CD/DVD, then USB. Heh, and yeah - all is normal with the other PSU.

The only thing I can think is that the ThermalTake must be shutting itself off, with one of its protection circuits, maybe detecting a bad ground, or short circuit or whatever... but it's incredibly strange that it only does this when loading the OS or OS installer (if OS not already present). If I throw a wireless adapter in the front USB 2.0 port, the PC will boot and run fine - I can run stress tests, etc, it will stay on and work great (unless I remove that device from the front USB port, then OFF it goes, haha).

Without a 4 channel recording Oscilloscope, my best guess is the one of the rails is triggering overload shut down. Switching the power off resets the latch circuit to off. I guess you will have to go bigger with the power supply or under volt the CPU and slow it down. I don't remember what the standard Vcore is for a 8350. Less than 1.35v may be a good place to start, I think. Could also try setting base freq to 3.6Ghz. Just speculation without knowing the Thermaltake current triggers. The motherboard could also be shutting off the power good signal (Green wire).
post #9 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantum Reality View Post

I have had issues where certain PSUs just don't play nice with some systems. I have a Cooler Master 750W PSU, for example, but it wouldn't drive my P5Q board; I had to put in an OCZ 550W PSU to get it to work.

I also remember a time when I had a P35 board (I think it was my ASRock 4Core1600Twins-P35) somehow get into a cycle where it kept powering on, then cutting out, lather, rinse, repeat. I think I traced that problem to my 24pin cable being *just* loose enough to transiently lose connection, but not loose enough to utterly fail to power the system when I pressed the front switch. Pushing all my power cables snugly in prevented that, I do believe.

So I guess the moral of the story is sometimes PSUs plain don't play nice, and pushing cables in one more time just to be sure can fix otherwise weird problems.

I'm sort of thinking this might be the case of it just not liking this board. I've re-inserted cables multiple times, tried other cables (like for example, the 8pin CPU power cable), etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by warpuck View Post

Without a 4 channel recording Oscilloscope, my best guess is the one of the rails is triggering overload shut down. Switching the power off resets the latch circuit to off. I guess you will have to go bigger with the power supply or under volt the CPU and slow it down. I don't remember what the standard Vcore is for a 8350. Less than 1.35v may be a good place to start, I think. Could also try setting base freq to 3.6Ghz. Just speculation without knowing the Thermaltake current triggers. The motherboard could also be shutting off the power good signal (Green wire).

Yeah, it's a bit weird. I have an oscilloscope, but not a recording 4 Ch. The Corsair CX600 runs the system without a hitch. When I boot the system up with the 750 ThermalTake and leave the wireless adapter in the front USB port, the system also runs without problem, as it should. When stress testing with both PSUs, the ThermalTake does provide better and more consistent rails. I'm really thinking that this board just doesn't like the ThermalTake PSU or visa-versa. I'm going to continue messing around with it this weekend and see if I can make any headway.

Do any of you think there is any chance of some sort of electrical interference going on while running the 24pin ATX power cable along the back of the motherboard tray and also having the front panel connection wires along them? I've never experienced this in any other system, but it might be worth checking for the heck of it. Perhaps I'll clip the zip-ties this weekend and separate the wiring and see if it makes any difference. Sure would be annoying for cable-management sake if it does.

Thanks for the replies thus far!
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post #10 of 13
Just an idea, have you tried unplugging everything non-essential and booting up? Extra HDD's, optical drives, video cards, etc. Funny that it's fine in BIOS with nothing in the USB port. There's a much higher load in the system once you go past BIOS and start loading the OS. Kinda does sound like a PSU issue.
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Overclock.net › Forums › Components › Power Supplies › Get a load of this whacky problem.