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[AnandTech] GeForce+Radeon: Previewing DirectX 12 Multi Adapter with Ashes of the Singularity - Page 27

post #261 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyVT View Post


Correct, I was referring to hardware context switching. AMD is much much faster at it. I do honestly feel this gives it the technological advantage as the primary card. Optimizations or not. Often NVidia's optimizations as seen in the past with certain titles are a complete downgrade of the game's image quality and because it can only be seen down the pixel hardly anyone complains. If you want to get technical neither camp is the best, they always often produce the same level of hardware and quality.

I'm aware AMD context switching is faster, but given the lack of clarity given by NVIDIA it's fairly short sighted to think improvements will or cannot be made at driver level also. This is why there is need for collaboration. The game hasn't gone gold yet - the performance numbers may not reflect what you're seeing now.
post #262 of 326
Nvidia released a ver. that runs off the CPU

http://www.zdnet.com/article/nvidia-de-optimizes-physx-for-the-cpu/#!

It really does not make much difference with a 5 Ghz processor. It still manages to keep up with 2 OC ed 285s crossfired. Actually the games are better with them than they are with a GTX 690. But that's my opinion. Statistics can prove me wrong.
post #263 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Scone View Post

I'm aware AMD context switching is faster, but given the lack of clarity given by NVIDIA it's fairly short sighted to think improvements will or cannot be made at driver level also. This is why there is need for collaboration. The game hasn't gone gold yet - the performance numbers may not reflect what you're seeing now.

A lot won't relfect what we're seeing, but it is a definite that the recent NVidia GPU has no hardware context switching in the same or better nature than AMD's. Perhaps next year's generation will provide a better combination.
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post #264 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by ku4eto View Post

Ehh, dunno about this one. I think the GPU gotta be DX12 compliant.

lol yeah you're right. Still, it would be funny to see what performance gains I could achieve with that.
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post #265 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyVT View Post

A lot won't relfect what we're seeing, but it is a definite that the recent NVidia GPU has no hardware context switching in the same or better nature than AMD's. Perhaps next year's generation will provide a better combination.

Well if it is capable, I would be very much surprised at this point given the media attention. I don't think these techniques are going to cause NVIDIA much heartache for the time being though, these things are still very much in their infancy.
post #266 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyVT View Post

A lot won't relfect what we're seeing, but it is a definite that the recent NVidia GPU has no hardware context switching in the same or better nature than AMD's. Perhaps next year's generation will provide a better combination.

Or maybe AMD is gimping the NVIDIA card when it's the primary. That would explain why the 680 scores less when paired with a 7970, than it does by itself. biggrin.gif
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post #267 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serios View Post

You are the one that doesn't understand. Even if AMD would have published Mantle's source code right then when they announced it Nvidia would still not support it. That is what they said.
It was never about "we would support it but we can't" it was always "we won't support it".
Things are simple.
What are you talking about?? Async compute is not AMD's tech, they don't own it, they simply implemented in their GPUs when Nvidia didn't. How can AMD give Nvidia something it doesn't own?
Also nvidia's software implementation is limited, AMD has full hardware support, they don't need a software implementation.
AMD still supports Mantle for those developers that want to implement it, they just won't release general drivers and improvements any more.
There are two things: DX12 and Vulkan are identical to Mantle so it doesn't make sens for AMD to invest in a 3rd API and Nvidia was asked about Mantle support before DX12 and Vulkan were on the table as options and they have denied support right from the very start.
“Khronos Group has chosen the best and brightest parts of Mantle to serve as the foundation for Vulkan.”
Which was acknowledged by Khronos when they thanked AMD.
OpenCL and CUDA are not identical. For example OpenCL has better support for heterogeneous computing and can work on both CPUs and GPUs while CUDA is more concentrated around the GPU and it's main advantages it that it gets updated faster.
The problem is not Nvidia killing CUDA but what will happen as things go foreword.

AMD said "it will be open source" but they also said they will control it. Would you agree to your competitors controlling your drivers and code, before that code was even published?
it is just a spin to make them look good. AMD would never have published it. And Nvidia would not accept AMD to controlling an "open source" API, which was not even published and was favouring AMD's hardware.
If you had listened to nvidia talk in the podcasts when mantle was announced, you would have understood instead of blabbering. Nvidia said that as long as mantle is controlled by AMD and it is not published, and hardware specific to their hardware, they will never support it.
If AMD first published it as open, gave full control to someone else (like khronos which is also supported by nvidia as well as AMD), nvidia would possible support it. But not closed "open source".

DX12 and vulkan are not identical to mantle. Especially since mantle is very hardware dependent on AMD internal API (read about the BF4 nvidia fiasco to optimise the game and why it took so long).
They are taking ideas from mantle, not the API or the hardware dependencies in order to allow several manufacturers. This is not the same. They also took DX12 ideas into, nvapi, openGL, they are working not with just AMD but also Nvidia.
The same as Mantle took ideas from nvapi (which was way before mantle was even considered) or from OpenGL.
This is the reason why nvidia will support it. Because it is not controlled by AMD.

Regarding CUDA, it is not only concentrated about the GPU. And it will not die until someone else comes along. Which will also bring the end of OpenGL as it is now.
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post #268 of 326
Quote:
I wonder if other developers and games will implement something like this, and if NVIDIA and AMD are okay with this.

That is the key here. Interesting news for sure but I am not excited just yet. People forget what a joke the modern PC gaming industry has become. I'll be excited if and when we see multiple, well optimized and original/entertaining IP's taking full advantage of this, and not a second before then.

Temper your excitement people. Could be setting yourself up for major disappointment.
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post #269 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickcooperjr View Post

yes very true but they had the program engineers for alot of major software in theyre back pocket drinking theyre koolaid Nvidia put alot of money into these software DEV's pockets as they also did with alot of OEM's with a form of kickbacks and such and it was borderline illegal the way they done so so again Nvidia not playing well with others.

ADOBE (you know adobe premier / photoshop and such) is one of these companies that Nvidia only had to tell them to jump and they would ask how high it is because Nvidia pretty much owns them many other software companies are like this and it has to do with money Nvidia threw theyre way and kickbacks and such.

PLZ I would like to get back on topic but I wanted to set a few things straight before I backed away.

Actually adobe were the ones making nvidia jump. Adobe market is much bigger than nvidia to force anything on it. If tomorrow adobe brings something which only support AMD cards, Half of adobe users will switch to AMD in an instant. Their users are not loyal to nvidia but to what gives the best performance. If what you said was true, adobe would never have supported AMD's GPU in the latest versions, and apple would never have switched to AMD.
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post #270 of 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by GHADthc View Post

This is totally off topic, but looniam wanted an example of Nvidia doing the dodgy on a partner, I can't quite recall the exact details, but didn't Nvidia take a crap on XFX, one of their top AIB partners (at the time) simply because they wanted to also be a vendor for AMD? (My memory is hazy on this, but XFX may have been in the wrong and breaching a contract, but I can't quite recall)...also didn't EVGA want to do something similar once and got put in their place by Nvidia back in the day?

yep, NV dropped XFX about two years after going to ATI and blacklisted them from getting fermi. that does rate closer to a douche bag move than not playing nice.

thanks for reminding me about my XFX 9600GT . . good times. smile.gif
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