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[reddit] MS Surface Book SSDs use Samsung TLC (terrible write performance)

post #1 of 53
Thread Starter 
BREAKING

I just heard back from Brett Howse from Anandtech. Their Surface Book review will be up later this week. He said they noticed the same issue; they got two Surface Books: one SB with the 512GB XG3 and one SB with the 512GB PM951. The PM951 model has far slower writes. He is currently investigating further--possible dual-sourcing going on. Much love to Anandtech for taking this issue seriously.

My fantasy may be true. Now...just to figure out how to snag the Toshiba XG3 versions and not these Samsung spinning disks masquerading as 2015 NVMe PCIe SSDs.

To all you Microsoft defenders, please, take all the PM951 models. You, apparently, won't notice a difference. tongue.giftongue.giftongue.gif

--

It wasn't a conspiracy theory. Anandtech has vindicated me (specifically Brett Howse). I am saved.


original post


Unlike the 2015 Lenovo's X1 Carbon laptop, the Microsoft Surface Book does NOT use the speedy 2GB/s Samsung MLC-based SM951 drives, but seemingly versions of the anemic Samsung TLC-based PM951 drives. See the unusually slow write speed in NotebookCheck's review. The PM951 uses TLC, according to Anandtech.



reddit source

Like, seriously anemic:

128GB PM951 ($1500 Surface Book)
Sequential read: 600MB/s
Sequential write: 150MB/s
Random read: 140K
Random write: 37K

256GB PM951 ($1700, $1900, and $2100 Surface Book):
Sequential read: 1000MB/s
Sequential write: 280MB/s
Random read: 250K
Random write: 74K

512GB PM951 ($2700 Surface Book):
Sequential read: 1050MB/s
Sequential write: 560MB/s
Random read: 250K
Random write: 144K

Sure, sequential speed isn't that important, but if you copy files...wow. You just got transported back five years in terms of performance...from a $1500 laptop.
Edited by ikjadoon - 11/2/15 at 10:38pm
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post #2 of 53
It looks kinda disappointing in general. No Nvidia Optimus support for the dGPU and the tablet only carries an 18Whr battery. Less than half the SP4, which is already reduced from like 42Whr compared to older SPs. IMO might've been a better idea to make a properly dock for the SP4.
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post #3 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoxile View Post

It looks kinda disappointing in general. No Nvidia Optimus support for the dGPU and the tablet only carries an 18Whr battery. Less than half the SP4, which is already reduced from like 42Whr compared to older SPs. IMO might've been a better idea to make a properly dock for the SP4.

oi, without a muxer, optimus is a terrible idea for video performance

all the idiot manufacturers just port all of the gpu output video to the iGPU then use that to render everything to the screen (not the 3d models) with no option of disabling the useless iGPU

the smarter ones, only put the muxer in high end laptops such as M17x, GT60/70 etc. you can properly switch to fully dGPU mode and completely bypass the HD3000
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post #4 of 53
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoxile View Post

It looks kinda disappointing in general. No Nvidia Optimus support for the dGPU .....

Err, it does have NVIDIA Optimus (but that's besides the point of terrible SSDs):
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anandtech (click button for link) View Post

Microsoft does have Optimus enabled, with the default setting in the custom control panel for Auto-Select on the GPU, but you can also change to integrated or the NVIDIA graphics. There is no GeForce Experience installed, so in order to make the change you have to dive into the Control Panel. It’s not very elegant but I think the idea is that you just leave it in auto and let the whitelist handle when the dGPU is enabled. My experience so far is that the whitelist seems a bit bugged right now, and the dGPU runs all the time when the Clipboard is docked, which is clearly not the way it is intended to be.

It's just broken, tongue.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by TK421 View Post

oi, without a muxer, optimus is a terrible idea for video performance

all the idiot manufacturers just port all of the gpu output video to the iGPU then use that to render everything to the screen (not the 3d models) with no option of disabling the useless iGPU

the smarter ones, only put the muxer in high end laptops such as M17x, GT60/70 etc. you can properly switch to fully dGPU mode and completely bypass the HD3000

So, kind of unrelated to terribad SSDs, but you realize that hardware mutliplexers have to turn the screen off and on every time they switch GPUs? That just sounds annoying. On a battery-conscious device, you want to minimize time on the dGPU. That requires lots of switching. And that's a lot of flickering...
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post #5 of 53
it also uses nTrig so the pen is no good.
post #6 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kand View Post

it also uses nTrig so the pen is no good.

I think the Surface Pro 3 used nTrig as well, no? I know it wasn't using Wacom like the first and second.
post #7 of 53
wow
that looks stunningly bad
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post #8 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndroidVageta View Post

I think the Surface Pro 3 used nTrig as well, no? I know it wasn't using Wacom like the first and second.

Why did they drop Wacom? frown.gif
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post #9 of 53
As to the original subject of the thread;

I have no problem at all with the drive in it NOT being able to write nearly twice the CPU's IO speed. That would be a useless component to have. Instead MS has gone for a reliable and low-speed component that probably uses less power and DEFINITELY generates less heat.


It's a no-brainer why they went with the Samsung.
post #10 of 53
Agreed. People here seem to just get used to high numbers with this, and jump on the low performance bandwagon without actually stopping to think about other reasons besides raw performance.
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