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** Thermlright Le GRAND MACHO is out! ** - Page 4

post #31 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Most case fans are not much good.

730T has a CPU clearance of 170mm. This is 178mm from motherboard surface to case.

Assuming it is GA-Z97X Gaming GT you have 75mm from center of CPU to near side of first PCIe socket and 52mm to near side of RAM socket.

I'm pretty sure you can remove the top fins from RAM without any problems and it does not void the warranty. This lowers their height to 39mm plus 3mm added height above motherboard for socket makes them 42mm tall. The bottom of cooler / top of CPU is 8mm above motherboard. Case has 178mm so front fan must be 120mm to clear RAM .. or RAM has to be less than 38mm from motherboard to it's top.

Best way to test case airflow and temps is to use a low cost wired remote digital themometer like show in 2nd post of 'Ways to Better Cooling'. That way you can see if the case's intake airflow is being contaminated / heated up by components hot exhaust.

This is why I say to have case fans speed controlled by component temps and airflow demands. Component fans change spee d to supply the air need to keep component cool. If case fan do not do the same, they supply more airflow than needed at low speed, airflow that is needed at medium load, and not enough airflow to meet the needs at high load and heat .. which is only made worse by components' heated exhaust being reused and thus heated the component airflow even higher.

doyll,

If I've read your "Ways to better cooling" thread earlier, it would have saved me a lot of time taking measurements inside the case, lol. My son's board is indeed the GA-Z97X Gaming GT. You must have access to an incredible database of motherboard layouts/dimensions to come up with the center of CPU to 1st PCIe socket and to 1st RAM slot so quickly, but I digress.

With the offset design of the Thermalright LGM, even with the TY147 on the front should still clear the 1st RAM slot, so the Trident X height shouldn't matter (but I agree, that with fin removed, height drops to 39mm), especially since he has 2x8GB populated in the 2nd and 4th slots. The back of the LGM will come very close to the Corsair AF140 exhaust fan (more on fans later), with about 5mm to spare. As mentioned in my 1st post, the proximity of the back of the LGM to the AF140 should help with the cooling, correct?

Okay the fans in his 730GT include 2xAF140L as intake in the front, in addition to 1xAF140 as exhaust. All are supposed to be 67.43cfm/1.2mm/H2O (I think, found this on Anandtech site, Corsair doesn't give static pressure) @ 1000rpm. These 3 fans, along with the Scythe SFF21G (75cfm/3.78mm/H2O @ 1900rpm) and 2x (leftover) Corsair A70 cooler fans (50cfm/1.8mm/H2O @ 1600rpm) are connected to a Lamptron fan controller, normally set between 50-60%, higher when needed. I need to get a digital thermometer so I can take actual internal to case temps. Currently, with the Cryorig H5 Universal with XT140 in front and XF140 in back, cpu idle temp is around 27-28C, and temps are generally well under 70C with normal use. It is only with linpack or IBT that temps push into the mid 80s. As Vcore is fairly low @ 1.255V (actually using adaptive voltage with equivalent of 1.255V fixed), that's why I think a better cooler could help him push his overclock higher, but now have no way to stress test to be certain (due to excessive temps; I don't let any overclocked system approach 90C).

Have you used/compared the Thermalright LGM RT and the R1 Ultimate? I know the R1 Ultimate would not work in my son's system, but since there is only a couple degrees performance difference between the Ultimate and the Universal, such comparison data would be very useful. I must say I have a preference for the LGM RT due to aesthetics alone. The white accents of the H5 (and R1) Universal work okay in his system, but I personally prefer the look of the LGM.

Thanks again, doyll, for all the great information and help . Oh, and I'm in Oregon, US. I also need to see what happened to my sig/info.
post #32 of 88
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bebopper View Post

doyll,

If I've read your "Ways to better cooling" thread earlier, it would have saved me a lot of time taking measurements inside the case, lol. My son's board is indeed the GA-Z97X Gaming GT. You must have access to an incredible database of motherboard layouts/dimensions to come up with the center of CPU to 1st PCIe socket and to 1st RAM slot so quickly, but I digress.

With the offset design of the Thermalright LGM, even with the TY147 on the front should still clear the 1st RAM slot, so the Trident X height shouldn't matter (but I agree, that with fin removed, height drops to 39mm), especially since he has 2x8GB populated in the 2nd and 4th slots. The back of the LGM will come very close to the Corsair AF140 exhaust fan (more on fans later), with about 5mm to spare. As mentioned in my 1st post, the proximity of the back of the LGM to the AF140 should help with the cooling, correct?

Okay the fans in his 730GT include 2xAF140L as intake in the front, in addition to 1xAF140 as exhaust. All are supposed to be 67.43cfm/1.2mm/H2O (I think, found this on Anandtech site, Corsair doesn't give static pressure) @ 1000rpm. These 3 fans, along with the Scythe SFF21G (75cfm/3.78mm/H2O @ 1900rpm) and 2x (leftover) Corsair A70 cooler fans (50cfm/1.8mm/H2O @ 1600rpm) are connected to a Lamptron fan controller, normally set between 50-60%, higher when needed. I need to get a digital thermometer so I can take actual internal to case temps. Currently, with the Cryorig H5 Universal with XT140 in front and XF140 in back, cpu idle temp is around 27-28C, and temps are generally well under 70C with normal use. It is only with linpack or IBT that temps push into the mid 80s. As Vcore is fairly low @ 1.255V (actually using adaptive voltage with equivalent of 1.255V fixed), that's why I think a better cooler could help him push his overclock higher, but now have no way to stress test to be certain (due to excessive temps; I don't let any overclocked system approach 90C).

Have you used/compared the Thermalright LGM RT and the R1 Ultimate? I know the R1 Ultimate would not work in my son's system, but since there is only a couple degrees performance difference between the Ultimate and the Universal, such comparison data would be very useful. I must say I have a preference for the LGM RT due to aesthetics alone. The white accents of the H5 (and R1) Universal work okay in his system, but I personally prefer the look of the LGM.

Thanks again, doyll, for all the great information and help . Oh, and I'm in Oregon, US. I also need to see what happened to my sig/info.
I scale the manufacturer's motherboard drawings to figure out the center CPU to near side of PCIe and RAM socket measurement. Been doing it for years and never got it wrong yet.

2nd post in thread is how to setup thermometer. I like the indoor outdoor because it gives me both case intake and probe readings at a glance.

I don't like the Corsail fans. Their specs are not accurate and don't forget, the airflow rating with absolutely no resistance .. not the way we use them. The static pressure rating is pressure reached when fan stops flowing air... also a rating not applicable to your uses.

The R1 Ultimate and Universal are basically the same cooler. I say basically because the Universal has it's pipes and fin packs set back a little more, but the pipe and fin areas are the same. Only difference in cooling is the thin front fan. If you get the R1 Universal and put a .. can't remember fan model number ..a 2nd fan the same as middle one one, the cooling is the same as Ultimate.

Later or in the morning I will post mesurements of both R1 coolers and LGM as well.
post #33 of 88
Thread Starter 
The front of LGM fin pack is only 22mm front center CPU. That is 4.5mm less than the front of it's base is. Base front is 26.5mm from center of CPU (53mm total.
Le Grand Macho is a slightly modified HR-22; new base with one less heatpipe is not as thick, same fin pack size, same number of fins, same total height.

.
As for your stock case rear exhaust, I would use matching fans on the Le Grand Macho. I know it has the TY-147B and not the normal TY-147A, but the only idfference is TY-147B has slotted sides in fan shroud while TY-147A is solid side. I have used both and I honestly fan little to no differnce. On sound meter the B is about 1.5dB quieter, but if there is a difference if airflow it is not enough to show up in temperature results. Temps vary +/-0.2c at most between test runs, so it is possible if I ran 50 complete test setups and runs I might find a 0.1-0.2c difference, but I'm not going to spend weeks of testing to see if there might be that slight a difference. tongue.gif


Here is comparisons of Cryorig R1 Ultimate and R1 Universal. You an see how Universl has everything set back a few mm, but biggest difference is XF140 25.4mm fan versus XT140 13mm fan on the front. Put a XF140 on front of R1 Universal and it performs the same as R1 Ultimate. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)




post #34 of 88
Thanks again, doyll. Since the thermometer I ordered is on its way, I'm going to wait and take case internal temp measurements first to better understand situation with current setup (as you've suggested) before making final purchasing decision. Still planning on the LGM RT (especially with price lower and similar, if not slightly better, cooling perf vs the R1 Universal). I appreciate your suggestion to replace the AF140 rear exhaust with TY147A (wish the black version were available here though). Might take the opportunity to replace front intake fans as well, depending on what the temp measurements indicate.
post #35 of 88
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bebopper View Post

Thanks again, doyll. Since the thermometer I ordered is on its way, I'm going to wait and take case internal temp measurements first to better understand situation with current setup (as you've suggested) before making final purchasing decision. Still planning on the LGM RT (especially with price lower and similar, if not slightly better, cooling perf vs the R1 Universal). I appreciate your suggestion to replace the AF140 rear exhaust with TY147A (wish the black version were available here though). Might take the opportunity to replace front intake fans as well, depending on what the temp measurements indicate.
Keep in mind the TY-147A is a 140mm fan, but has 120mm mounting.


Squaring the TY-14x series fans is explained here in post #36 in "Ways to Better Cooling".
http://www.overclock.net/t/1491876/ways-to-better-cooling-airflow-cooler-fan-data/20_20#post_23389814

120mm to 140mm mounting adapter is explained in post # 23
http://www.overclock.net/t/1491876/ways-to-better-cooling-airflow-cooler-fan-data/20_20#post_23207921

Post # 31 shows the main TY-14x fan models and their PWM% to rpm curves
http://www.overclock.net/t/1491876/ways-to-better-cooling-airflow-cooler-fan-data/20_20#post_23348844
post #36 of 88
Thanks for the reminder, doyll. The Corsair 730gt has both 120 and 140mm mounts on the intake and exhaust locations, so should be an easy swap to the TY147.
post #37 of 88
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bebopper View Post

Thanks for the reminder, doyll. The Corsair 730gt has both 120 and 140mm mounts on the intake and exhaust locations, so should be an easy swap to the TY147.
Usually single 120/140mm mounts are not a problem .. unless there is not enough room for the round sides of fan to clear. I think the back vent will be no problem.
2x and 3x 120/140mm mounts often do not allow 140mm fans with 120mm mounts to stack up with functional mounting holes. I can't find a pic of case front without fans installed to see what the mount plate slot layout is, can't say if they will fit or not. If you have any airflow / heating issues we will figure it out. Thermalright has added the TY-147Asq on website, but no idea when they will be available. I've know about them for 6 months or more and they are just now known to public. We worked on the idea for over a year before that.
post #38 of 88
No worries, doyll. See attached picture that all should be good.

Thermalright's site claims the square version of the TY fans are (slightly) better? Not sure I understand.

P1020030.JPG 4993k .JPG file
post #39 of 88
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bebopper View Post

No worries, doyll. See attached picture that all should be good.

Thermalright's site claims the square version of the TY fans are (slightly) better? Not sure I understand.

P1020030.JPG 4993k .JPG file
The fans are blocking the mounting holes for 120mm fans. If you draw and 'X' from corner to corner and there is a square set of mounting holes with 105x105mm spacing on the lines the TY-147A will fit.

Reading the specs for both TY-147Asq and TY-147A the A is 1db quieter and 11.1cfm more airflow.
TY-147Asq Sound Level : 16 - 22 dBAAirflow : 14.42 - 62.5 CFM
TY-147A . .Sound Level : 15 - 21 dB(A)Airflow : 16.9 - 73.6 CFM
The reality is I did not hear or see any difference in performance. 1db is not enough for us to hear a difference, but 11.1cfm is enough to see a difference in performance .. yet I did not see that difference when testing them as case fans and on coolers. My equipment is not scientific lab quality so I allow +/-1.5dB and +/-1.0c as same performance. This is a total of 3db and 2.0c. My actual readings were less than 1.0db and 1.0c different .. well within margin of error .. definitely about the same. wink.gif

I've been told others should be getting production run test samples (may have them now) so we should be seeing more test results soon.
Edited by doyll - 7/12/16 at 4:51am
post #40 of 88
Well, now I want to upgrade my NH-U12S to the Le Grand Macho RT... It would of course be useless as I run a Xeon 1231v3, but I could use the NH-U12S in my server and, again, feel my EPEEN growing again when I use my gaming rig rolleyes.gif

I'm just not THAT sure it will fit my motherboard, a mini-itx asus Z97i-plus ; haven't found any information about that ; do any of you also know if the backplate of the Asus STRIX GTX980 would be an issue for the cooler itself or the TY-147B, as this fan is protruding from sides to sides... I'm also wondering if the RAM is also cleared from the fan (I know, I could take measurements, but I'm bad a measuring things)...
     
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
intel core i5 4670k GIGABYTE Z97mx-Gaming 5 ASUS ROG GTX 1080ti G.SKILL TridentX 2x8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
SAMSUNG 850 Evo 2.5' SSD 500GB SAMSUNG 850 Evo 2.5' SSD 1TB SAMSUNG 850 Evo 2.5' SSD 250GB 2x bequiet silentwings 3 120mm pwm fans (case f... 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
bequiet silentwings 3 140mm pwm fan Windows 10 craptimate edition DELL U2414H CM quickfire TK Cherry MX black (custom keycaps) 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair RM550 Fractal Design Define C mini window version  Logitech G900 steelseries QCK+ 
AudioAudioAudio
AKG K702 Fiio E10K Olympus 2 Antlion ModMic 4 mute 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Intel i3 4130 Gigabyte h97i itx HyperX blue 8gb SAMSUNG 840 Evo Series SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Seagate barracuda 7200 2tb Wd Blue 1tb WD Red NAS Hard Drive SATA 6 Gb/s - 3.0 TB WD30... Toshiba Desktop HDD SATA6Gb/s - 3.0 TB DT01ACA300 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
beQuiet! SILENT WINGS 2 92mm PWM beQuiet! SILENT WINGS 2 92mm PWM Thermalright APX-100 unRAID 6 
PowerCase
Seasonic G-Series 550W Fractal Design Node 304 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
intel core i5 4670k GIGABYTE Z97mx-Gaming 5 ASUS ROG GTX 1080ti G.SKILL TridentX 2x8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
SAMSUNG 850 Evo 2.5' SSD 500GB SAMSUNG 850 Evo 2.5' SSD 1TB SAMSUNG 850 Evo 2.5' SSD 250GB 2x bequiet silentwings 3 120mm pwm fans (case f... 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
bequiet silentwings 3 140mm pwm fan Windows 10 craptimate edition DELL U2414H CM quickfire TK Cherry MX black (custom keycaps) 
PowerCaseMouseMouse Pad
Corsair RM550 Fractal Design Define C mini window version  Logitech G900 steelseries QCK+ 
AudioAudioAudio
AKG K702 Fiio E10K Olympus 2 Antlion ModMic 4 mute 
CPUMotherboardRAMHard Drive
Intel i3 4130 Gigabyte h97i itx HyperX blue 8gb SAMSUNG 840 Evo Series SSD 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Seagate barracuda 7200 2tb Wd Blue 1tb WD Red NAS Hard Drive SATA 6 Gb/s - 3.0 TB WD30... Toshiba Desktop HDD SATA6Gb/s - 3.0 TB DT01ACA300 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
beQuiet! SILENT WINGS 2 92mm PWM beQuiet! SILENT WINGS 2 92mm PWM Thermalright APX-100 unRAID 6 
PowerCase
Seasonic G-Series 550W Fractal Design Node 304 
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