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[Guru3D] AMD faces Lawsuit over Core Count on Bulldozer - Page 10

post #91 of 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by FallenFaux View Post

Bulldozer has eight Integer units which can all execute instructions simultaneously, therefore is has eight cores.

So according to your definition; a part of the back-end is a core inside a CPU core. That doesn't make any sense at all, like it says if you have a back-end you have a front-end as well which both should be forming together a core. All AMD did is duplicating the ALU cluster which is a part of the back-end.

A basic CPU core;



Clearly seeing a front-end together with a back-end.

AMD; "Yo lets get another ALU cluster in here"



Point is; a core is a CPU on its own - A 2nd ALU cluster can't solo being a core because it's completely nothing without the front-end.
post #92 of 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47 Knucklehead View Post


I'm sorry, words have meaning. Unilaterally changing the meaning of a thing just to fit your own particular narrative is wrong.

This is done all the time. How about ATVs? Some were/are two wheeled, some three, some four or more. Some have/had two stroke engines, some two stroke with oil injection (so no premix), some with four stroke engines. Some with 1 cylinder air cooled - some with multiple cylinders and water cooled. Some of these vehicles are for single rider sport, but some are for rescue. They are still ATVs, but very much differ in purpose and design. So a CPU is designed differently than another...that was previously defined, what's the point. If we can't redefine things, progress can be stifled.
post #93 of 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faithh View Post

A basic CPU core;



Clearly seeing a front-end together with a back-end.

Woah, what?! Then... Intel's first x86 CPU... wasn't even a CPU! eek.gif




No FPU, no L2 cache, no branch prediction, no OoO execution, not even a memory controller... Maybe the tech changes so rapidly that a fixed definition is impractical.
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post #94 of 333

I'm tired of some guys that said AMD has no right to define Core!! :doh:

 

then What is Core? Really Who are you ? It's their architecture not you.

 

From Anandtech

Quote:
Architecturally Bulldozer is a significant departure from anything we've ever seen before. We'll go into greater detail later on in this piece, but the building block in AMD's latest architecture is the Bulldozer module. Each module features two integer cores and a shared floating point core. FP hardware is larger and used less frequently in desktop (and server workloads), so AMD decided to share it between every two cores rather than offer a 1:1 ratio between int/fp cores on Bulldozer. AMD advertises Bulldozer based FX parts based on the number of integer cores. Thus a two module Bulldozer CPU, has four integer cores (and 2 FP cores) and is thus sold as a quad-core CPU. A four module Bulldozer part with eight integer cores is called an eight-core CPU. There are obvious implications from a performance standpoint, but we'll get to those shortly.

 

They defined this as Core.a True 8 core has nothing to do with Performance.it can be slower than Phenom II 1070 or Faster than Core i7 2600K.when you say this car has a True 4 cylinder, you can't compare to other cars to determine performance and see How fast "True".

True =/= Performance

post #95 of 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faithh View Post

So according to your definition; a part of the back-end is a core inside a CPU core. That doesn't make any sense at all, like it says if you have a back-end you have a front-end as well which both should be forming together a core. All AMD did is duplicating the ALU cluster which is a part of the back-end.

A basic CPU core;



Clearly seeing a front-end together with a back-end.

AMD; "Yo lets get another ALU cluster in here"



Point is; a core is a CPU on its own - A 2nd ALU cluster can't solo being a core because it's completely nothing without the front-end.

Although there is no set definition of a "core" (which is part of the problem) I have never seen anyone try and claim that a core "is a CPU on its own." That would mean that the last "true" multi core CPU that we had was the Pentium D, since it was just 2 CPUs glued together and shared no resources. That obviously isn't a practical definition since no modern CPU meets it.

The reason we don't keep making CPUs that way is that it's a complete waste of resources. Every core does not need every single component of a CPU, they can and do effectively share resources.

Also for the record, the diagram you picked is actually for a single core Intel Atom Z5XX CPU... So that diagram isn't just a single core, it's the entire CPU.
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post #96 of 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Questors View Post

This is done all the time. How about ATVs? Some were/are two wheeled, some three, some four or more. Some have/had two stroke engines, some two stroke with oil injection (so no premix), some with four stroke engines. Some with 1 cylinder air cooled - some with multiple cylinders and water cooled. Some of these vehicles are for single rider sport, but some are for rescue. They are still ATVs, but very much differ in purpose and design. So a CPU is designed differently than another...that was previously defined, what's the point. If we can't redefine things, progress can be stifled.

No. An ATV, and All Terrain Vehicle has NOTHING to do with the number of wheels (beyond what is defined below ... ie 2 or 6 or 8), air cooled or water cooled, 1 cylinder or more, etc.

If you really want to know what defines an ATV, here it is under law:

15 U.S. Code § 2089 - All-terrain vehicles
Quote:
(e) DefinitionsIn this section:
(1) All-terrain vehicle or ATVThe term “all-terrain vehicle” or “ATV” means—

(A) any motorized, off-highway vehicle designed to travel on 3 or 4 wheels, having a seat designed to be straddled by the operator and handlebars for steering control; but
(B) does not include a prototype of a motorized, off-highway, all-terrain vehicle or other motorized, off-highway, all-terrain vehicle that is intended exclusively for research and development purposes unless the vehicle is offered for sale.

Sorry, but your example is a bad one.

Also, like I said, words have meanings, and you can't go making up meanings to sell stuff to the public just because you want to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

Woah, what?! Then... Intel's first x86 CPU... wasn't even a CPU! eek.gif




No FPU, no L2 cache, no branch prediction, no OoO execution, not even a memory controller... Maybe the tech changes so rapidly that a fixed definition is impractical.

Exactly.
Edited by 47 Knucklehead - 11/6/15 at 5:14pm
post #97 of 333
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xuper View Post

a True 8 core has nothing to do with Performance.it can be slower than Phenom II 1070 or Faster than Core i7 2600K.when you say this car has a True 4 cylinder, you can't compare to other cars to determine performance and see How fast "True".
True =/= Performance

I agree, I was thinking about that 8core Atom C2750. Despite having 8 cores, an i3 is going to outperforming it 95% of the time.
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post #98 of 333
Why do I have a sudden and inescapable urge to shoot myself in the face? Fun story. That's about it.

LOL
     
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post #99 of 333
Lawyers are the grammar nazi's of the advertising world. So basically a few thousand people will get a check for $10 a piece and a handful of people will split millions.
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post #100 of 333
Looks like AMD is an easy target these days! The last time I saw something like this was Creative. :3

By the way, some of Intel's designs will also be affected if this lawsuit flies. Isn't L3 and EDRAM shared?
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