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[Fudzilla] Micron's answer to HBM - the company to double the speed of GDDR5 in 2016 (possibly named GDDR6) - Page 7

post #61 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klocek001 View Post

How is this NOT an answer to HBM?
If they doubled the speed of DDR5 then it'd much faster than HBM on Fury.
It is stop gap nothing more nothing less Micron and Intel have something similair to HBM ready. It might even be better than HBM so go figure. This is just some lame last effort to get extra money out of slightly revised old tech.
post #62 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler View Post

Don't forget that HBM1 is pretty much soon to be history, with HBM2 going into mass production instead.
The main thing I see that GDDR5X/GDDR6 will have over HBM2, is power. HBM2 will require more power than current GDDR.

Anything to back it up? HBM2 requiring more power than current GDDR sounds exactly the opposite, at least for equal bandwidth.
    
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post #63 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by maarten12100 View Post

It is stop gap nothing more nothing less Micron and Intel have something similair to HBM ready. It might even be better than HBM so go figure. This is just some lame last effort to get extra money out of slightly revised old tech.
HMC can never compete with HBM since HBM is so cheap, they can pull the rug from under HMC anytime they want.
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post #64 of 119
Quote:
So efficient wise its better than HBM2 and close to HBM1

The HBM2 on that chart is way more efficient than HBM1.

It draws 1.5x the power but provides 2x the bandwidth. GB/s per watt is the important stat!
Quote:
Anything to back it up? HBM2 requiring more power than current GDDR sounds exactly the opposite, at least for equal bandwidth.

Why are people suddenly saying that HBM2 is worse perf/watt than gddr? Drawing as much power doesn't make it inefficient. A 980ti and 480 draw similar amounts of power but the 980ti is many, many leagues more efficient.
Edited by Cyro999 - 12/13/15 at 4:54pm
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post #65 of 119

This thread went downhill fast with people turning it into an AMD vs nVidia vs Intel argument. For those who haven't grasped it yet: all three are committed to HBM and it's the future. If you are unhappy with that you should take it up with those three and tell them how great DDR5X is just because you say so. In the meantime both AMD and nVidia are set to release their high end HBM 2 cards the coming year. It's unknown what Intel are doing but they have said that they are working on it.

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post #66 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLeakStuff View Post


Hynix wont begin HBM2 mass production until late Q1 or early Q2.
Can I quote you on that? I need a source in order to bring about some disappointment in another forum.
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post #67 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klocek001 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by PontiacGTX View Post

all the reasons

uses more power,needs more space, has higher latency,less prefetch size,and less memory density

it isnt on HBM field
yes but who really cares about those, it's the performance that matters. I mean it's nice and all but it didn't make Fury X beat 980Ti.

GPUs get 275-300w.

If Memory takes 50w, CPUs get 225-250w for shaders.
If Memory takes 5w, GPUs get 270-295w for shaders.

That equates to +20% shaders, with a smaller PCB, and more bandwidth. Regardless of brand. Regardless of Arch.

By saying it didn't help the FuryX, you have a fundamental misunderstanding of GPU arches and how they work. A much better comparison would be that by using HBM, AMD managed to shove 40% more shaders in their GPU at the same power consumption as compared to the 290X.

Imagine if nVidia just shoved 40% more shaders in their GPU simply by switching to a faster memory type that also happens to allow the PCB to be smaller. Remember, HBM2 won't have HBM1's capacity limits.
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post #68 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

GPUs get 275-300w.

If Memory takes 50w, CPUs get 225-250w for shaders.
If Memory takes 5w, GPUs get 270-295w for shaders.

That equates to +20% shaders, with a smaller PCB, and more bandwidth. Regardless of brand. Regardless of Arch.

By saying it didn't help the FuryX, you have a fundamental misunderstanding of GPU arches and how they work. A much better comparison would be that by using HBM, AMD managed to shove 40% more shaders in their GPU at the same power consumption as compared to the 290X.

Imagine if nVidia just shoved 40% more shaders in their GPU simply by switching to a faster memory type that also happens to allow the PCB to be smaller. Remember, HBM2 won't have HBM1's capacity limits.
Cost of the larger die size to fit more shaders and yield of large dies, are probably much more important factors than power consumption in deciding how many shaders to implement. Just lowering power consumption doesn't automatically equal the ability to add many more shaders. I get what you're saying, but "imagine if nVidia just shoved 40% more shaders in their GPU simply by switching to a faster memory type that also happens to allow the PCB to be smaller" is a pretty unrealistic expectation.
Edited by Diablosbud - 12/13/15 at 6:30pm
 
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post #69 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diablosbud View Post

Cost of the larger die size to fit more shaders and yield of large dies, are probably much more important factors than power consumption in deciding how many shaders to implement. Just lowering power consumption doesn't automatically equal the ability to add many more shaders. I get what you're saying, but "imagine if nVidia just shoved 40% more shaders in their GPU simply by switching to a faster memory type that also happens to allow the PCB to be smaller" is a pretty unrealistic expectation.
That's because it is Nvidia. AMD/ATi did just that with GDDR5(hd3870>hd4850).
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post #70 of 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diablosbud View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

GPUs get 275-300w.

If Memory takes 50w, CPUs get 225-250w for shaders.
If Memory takes 5w, GPUs get 270-295w for shaders.

That equates to +20% shaders, with a smaller PCB, and more bandwidth. Regardless of brand. Regardless of Arch.

By saying it didn't help the FuryX, you have a fundamental misunderstanding of GPU arches and how they work. A much better comparison would be that by using HBM, AMD managed to shove 40% more shaders in their GPU at the same power consumption as compared to the 290X.

Imagine if nVidia just shoved 40% more shaders in their GPU simply by switching to a faster memory type that also happens to allow the PCB to be smaller. Remember, HBM2 won't have HBM1's capacity limits.
Cost of the larger die size to fit more shaders and yield of large dies, are probably much more important factors than power consumption in deciding how many shaders to implement. Just lowering power consumption doesn't automatically equal the ability to add many more shaders. I get what you're saying, but "imagine if nVidia just shoved 40% more shaders in their GPU simply by switching to a faster memory type that also happens to allow the PCB to be smaller" is a pretty unrealistic expectation.

Not going into 14nm it isn't.

It's unreal right now because we're at 28nm's cap size. Power consumption vs shader count would have been an entirely different story for the 7970 and 290X.
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