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Is 144HZ Freesync TN panel worth sacrificing the color of an IPS panel? - Page 5

post #41 of 53
Keep in mind, IPS suffer from horrible corner glow. All my U2414H suffered from it and it's a common problem with IPS tech. I exchanged 3 of them until I got one that I found acceptable, but even then, the one I kept still had the problem. I eventually sold the monitor when I directly compared it to my current XL2411z 144hz panel. The difference between colors wasn't really that big, and at 24", the viewing space is so small, I found the viewing angles weren't as problematic as everyone likes to portray them to be. I think once you start getting above 25", the viewing angles become more important, as there is a larger viewing area.

And dark scenes on the Dell IPS, forget about it with the IPS glow. Absolutely killed any dark wallpapers I used and gaming in dark scenes. Once you see it, you'll obsessively focus on it when it shows itself. Seriously, it was gross. The corners literally look like a shiny washed out white color. The higher the brightness, the worse it was. My TN has zero glow, zero black light bleed, and dark scenes look far more consistent, even though the contrast isn't as deep.

Here is a good example of the IPS glow on the U2415 from another user. Look top right and bottom right. http://i.imgur.com/HEOykOJ.jpg

All my U2414h had the glow in both bottom left and right corners.
Edited by gene-z - 2/10/16 at 2:13am
    
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post #42 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by gene-z View Post

Keep in mind, IPS suffer from horrible corner glow. All my U2414H suffered from it and it's a common problem with IPS tech. I exchanged 3 of them until I got one that I found acceptable, but even then, the one I kept still had the problem. I eventually sold the monitor when I directly compared it to my current XL2411z 144hz panel. The difference between colors wasn't really that big, and at 24", the viewing space is so small, I found the viewing angles weren't as problematic as everyone likes to portray them to be. I think once you start getting above 25", the viewing angles become more important, as there is a larger viewing area.

And dark scenes on the Dell IPS, forget about it with the IPS glow. Absolutely killed any dark wallpapers I used and gaming in dark scenes. Once you see it, you'll obsessively focus on it when it shows itself. Seriously, it was gross. The corners literally look like a shiny washed out white color. The higher the brightness, the worse it was. My TN has zero glow, zero black light bleed, and dark scenes look far more consistent, even though the contrast isn't as deep.

Here is a good example of the IPS glow on the U2415 from another user. Look top right and bottom right. http://i.imgur.com/HEOykOJ.jpg

All my U2414h had the glow in both bottom left and right corners.

+rep. I have an old tn panel 1080, that has bad color shift at an angle. My new tn panel, though, not much. Mine is a 28 inch and i see no problem. only one angle - looking up - that is, if my eye level is about the level of the table. Not sure why anyone would do that.



it's a phone pic.
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post #43 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lass3 View Post


but it felt slow, like all other VA panels I've seen. Way too much blur when playing Quake Live or other fast paced fps games.

If you're referring to motion blur, it would be more correct to say that it looked slow rather than felt slow. Felt slow would refer to input lag, although competitive gamers say it feels slow with Turbo240 enabled (which removes the motion blur so pick your poison).
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post #44 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noshuru View Post

Thank you, I'm fully aware what banding is, what the bit-depth of a monitor is, and I have no issues with binary. Why are you telling me all this? Where did I insinuate that a bit-depth of 6bit is superior to higher bit-depth solutions? Did you maybe reply to the wrong person?

Because you had said
Quote:
Either way, 99% of the content you will consume is in sRGB, and for that you only need a monitor capable of displaying an sRGB gamut.

So I was illustrating why that statement isn't exactly true. To say it's "all you need" dismisses the fact that not all sRGB compliant panels show the full range properly.

Your full RGB values will be great, but your inbetween might be in bad shape. You can get an sRGB monitor with virtually no perceivable banding.

EDIT: Also, to highlight that the backlight, while vital, has nothing to do with the bit-depth of a monitor, and in turn, how accurate the colors look.

This is why your saying that the panel technology has "nothing to do with how correct the color is" is simply not true.

Edit 2 for a second reply:
Quote:
Originally Posted by gene-z View Post

Keep in mind, IPS suffer from horrible corner glow. All my U2414H suffered from it and it's a common problem with IPS tech. I exchanged 3 of them until I got one that I found acceptable, but even then, the one I kept still had the problem. I eventually sold the monitor when I directly compared it to my current XL2411z 144hz panel. The difference between colors wasn't really that big, and at 24", the viewing space is so small, I found the viewing angles weren't as problematic as everyone likes to portray them to be. I think once you start getting above 25", the viewing angles become more important, as there is a larger viewing area.

And dark scenes on the Dell IPS, forget about it with the IPS glow. Absolutely killed any dark wallpapers I used and gaming in dark scenes. Once you see it, you'll obsessively focus on it when it shows itself. Seriously, it was gross. The corners literally look like a shiny washed out white color. The higher the brightness, the worse it was. My TN has zero glow, zero black light bleed, and dark scenes look far more consistent, even though the contrast isn't as deep.

Here is a good example of the IPS glow on the U2415 from another user. Look top right and bottom right. http://i.imgur.com/HEOykOJ.jpg

All my U2414h had the glow in both bottom left and right corners.

What you see with the lights off, looking from a front facing view isn't IPS glow. That is 100% backlight bleed.

IPS glow is when the screen has a navy blue tinge across it when viewing very dark or all black scenes, especially noticeable off angle, and is exhibited by all IPS panels to some degree.

Backlight bleed is visible from any angle, has a tendency to show up at the corners, and will always be the tint of the backlight itself, white. What you have in that photo is backlight bleed, and this can be a defect in any screen, regardless of the type of panel.
Edited by rolfathan - 2/10/16 at 7:52pm
post #45 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by boredgunner View Post

If you're referring to motion blur, it would be more correct to say that it looked slow rather than felt slow. Felt slow would refer to input lag, although competitive gamers say it feels slow with Turbo240 enabled (which removes the motion blur so pick your poison).

No VA monitor is considered fast and usable for fast paced gaming, unless we're talking casual play.

3 worst monitors all use VA panels:



Signal response bad too:



This was the monitor you told me had "good" viewing angles..Has a few downsides too..

I don't know why you think VA is superior. If it was that good, we would use VA panels in high end products instead of IPS. VA simply has too many cons.
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post #46 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lass3 View Post

No VA monitor is considered fast and usable for fast paced gaming, unless we're talking casual play.

3 worst monitors all use VA panels:

Signal response bad too:

This was the monitor you told me had "good" viewing angles..Has a few downsides too..

I don't know why you think VA is superior. If it was that good, we would use VA panels in high end products instead of IPS. VA simply has too many cons.

Honestly most gamers just don't know any better. They think IPS is better but know little about any of the technologies. The Acer Predator Z35 has very low levels of input lag, still has high response times though. The best VA screens are high end TVs although they aren't designed to have low levels of input lag since... they're TVs with a lot of processing. But they have the best LCD picture quality, and pretty good response times to the point where there's no ghosting/trailing/smearing like these AMVA monitors or the Eizo FG2421.

If only we could get panels of this quality in a G-SYNC/ULMB high refresh rate monitor with no input lag... easily feasible, but the demand isn't there because the market is too clueless.

Also I see you're yet another who thinks there's only competitive gaming and casual gaming, and nothing else. I'm neither. You seem to be a competitive gamer, so it goes without saying you don't care about picture quality and glowing grey blacks and just need speed.
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post #47 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by boredgunner View Post

Honestly most gamers just don't know any better. They think IPS is better but know little about any of the technologies. The Acer Predator Z35 has very low levels of input lag, still has high response times though. The best VA screens are high end TVs although they aren't designed to have low levels of input lag since... they're TVs with a lot of processing. But they have the best LCD picture quality, and pretty good response times to the point where there's no ghosting/trailing/smearing like these AMVA monitors or the Eizo FG2421.

If only we could get panels of this quality in a G-SYNC/ULMB high refresh rate monitor with no input lag... easily feasible, but the demand isn't there because the market is too clueless.

Also I see you're yet another who thinks there's only competitive gaming and casual gaming, and nothing else. I'm neither. You seem to be a competitive gamer, so it goes without saying you don't care about picture quality and glowing grey blacks and just need speed.

If VA is so superior, why do Samsung, Panasonic, LG etc. use VA panels in their LOWER/MIDRANGE TV's, while the high end TV's use IPS (or OLED)?

I'm not a "competetive gamer" - But I want my monitor to be fast and responsive. On all VA monitors I've tried, you can easily notice the delay when moving the mouse on the desktop or in games. Slight delay, like if VSYNC was enabled.
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post #48 of 53
You get used to color shift, and somewhat calibrated, the colors look pretty decent on TN, too. My eIPS looks somewhat better than my 144hz TN still, but I wouldn't be gaming on it anymore.

Main issue I have with TN: It starts looking pretty distorted from just a bit of an angle from below. So not very suited for portrait use.
For normal use, make sure it's angled in a way you see it 'from above' or facing directly towards it, at all times.
Caveat with the TN monitor I am using: default gamma curve was terrible (washed out looking), with any of the gamma presets. Needed messing with contrast and per color channel saturation.

If you get a TN monitor, unless it's a top of the line model, you might have to hope the monitor is calibrateable enough to fix factory settings, that may or may not be usable. (or rely on gpu/windows calibration)

I heard good things about the default calibration of some premium TN based monitors, though.
Edited by Tivan - 2/11/16 at 7:15am
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post #49 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by rolfathan View Post


Edit 2 for a second reply:
What you see with the lights off, looking from a front facing view isn't IPS glow. That is 100% backlight bleed.

IPS glow is when the screen has a navy blue tinge across it when viewing very dark or all black scenes, especially noticeable off angle, and is exhibited by all IPS panels to some degree.

Backlight bleed is visible from any angle, has a tendency to show up at the corners, and will always be the tint of the backlight itself, white. What you have in that photo is backlight bleed, and this can be a defect in any screen, regardless of the type of panel.

Wrong. Anyone can easily tell the difference between blacklight bleed and ips glow. Move your head to the center point of the affected area. Does the affected area improve? If yes, then it's IPS glow. Again, move your head to the affected area. Does the affected area look exactly the same? If yes, then it's backlight bleeding.
Edited by gene-z - 2/11/16 at 5:18pm
    
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post #50 of 53
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lass3 View Post

If VA is so superior, why do Samsung, Panasonic, LG etc. use VA panels in their LOWER/MIDRANGE TV's, while the high end TV's use IPS (or OLED)?

I'm not a "competetive gamer" - But I want my monitor to be fast and responsive. On all VA monitors I've tried, you can easily notice the delay when moving the mouse on the desktop or in games. Slight delay, like if VSYNC was enabled.

Samsung, Sony, and Vizio mostly use VA panels, especially for their high end TVs. LG is dumb for using IPS more than the rest and their TVs that do have lower review for the poor contrast that IPS provides. No matter what you think, VA and OLED are the preferred panel for the big screen where picture quality actually matters
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