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[OC3D] AMD's Zen will have a "greater than 40%" IPC improvement over Excavator, says Lisa Su - Page 23

post #221 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dudewitbow View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

I wonder what kind of GPU horsepower AMD plans on putting behind their Zen APUs? Imagine like a 7950 level GPU in their APU. That would be pretty damn nuts.


id imagine something very similar to what was displayed at CES(therefore GTX 950 performance). given that the 7850k is essentially a DDR3 HD7750(implying obviously that it has to be faster than a 7750), having the numbers for power consumption for the test setup at CES, something similar could be on it (just a DDR4 variant unless the APU will have onboard ram of its own) would be my guess. But if AMD can get 7950 performance on the apu(lol instantly makes it faster than the XBO and PS4) Then welcome the new small form factor APU gaming build. (would also be a contender for value steambox build if AMD pulls through with promise of better linux drivers, but im not holding them to that)

Id have to make a tri fire with my 280xs lol.. tahiti would be alive and well for 5 years :O
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post #222 of 841
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiOfPie View Post

Cine is a best-case scenario for Skylake over Haswell. By averaging a bunch of benches, Anand only found about a 5-6% improvement, and 7zip/3DPM single thread had performance regressions.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/9483/intel-skylake-review-6700k-6600k-ddr4-ddr3-ipc-6th-generation/9

I don't think Kaby's gonna be 10% over Sky, nor do I think Cannon's gonna be 10% over Kaby. Even if Intel does manage to pull those numbers, Cannonlake will only be ahead of Zen by about 25%.

And that's pretty much how far ahead of Phenom II Nehalem was, no?

PCPer did similar testing to Anand and found consistently faster results across the board:

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/Intel-Core-i7-6700K-Review-Skylake-First-Enthusiasts/Testing-Setup-and-SiSoft-San

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/Intel-Core-i7-6700K-Review-Skylake-First-Enthusiasts/Media-Encoding-Tests

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/Intel-Core-i7-6700K-Review-Skylake-First-Enthusiasts/Rendering-and-Scientific

http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Processors/Intel-Core-i7-6700K-Review-Skylake-First-Enthusiasts/Compression-and-Encryption

As far as 7-Zip results go, it is most likely due to the fact that Skylake responds greatly to higher speed memory and using basic DDR4-2133 is a bottleneck; compared to when they are testing Haswell they are using DDR3-1866, even DDR3-1600 has a better Cas Latency than DDR4-2133:

DDR3-1866 CAS9 9.64ns
DDR3-1600 CAS9 11.25ns

DDR4-2133 CAS15 14.06ns

Let's say for arguments sake they used DDR4-2133 CAS14, still 13.12ns, even more unrealistic is that they used DDR4-2133 CAS13, yet still we are at 12.18ns. So no matter how you look at it, running DDR4-2133 is a bottleneck in scenarios where higher frequency memory would produce better Cas Latency and as such produce better results for certain applications.

Nevertheless, you would be surprised by the performance increase Skylake gains from overclocking. In Cinebench R15 alone, taking Skylake from 4.2GHz to 4.7GHz nets an 11.7% increase in performance. I speculated in another thread that Kaby Lake (Skylake Refresh) or what might be called the 6790k will have a 4.7GHz boost. Then add another die shrink for Cannonlake, that can bring another 10% increase in performance (clock for clock).

I guess 25% is a lower estimate when comparing Phenom II vs Nehalem because you can look at older CPU benchmarks and see as much as a 38% difference in performance (from an 1100T to a 930):



But I guess that depends on the processors you are comparing something you didn't specify.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyVT View Post

If they left Fury and Fury X at it's original clock it would've been. I really hate that dude who said it. However with all the cards dealt to AMD and where it stands financially it's standing firm. There are many niche products that are perfect for most consumers.

What exactly was the original clock, and how would that change anything when a 980 Ti can gain up to a 36% increase in performance after overclocked? I wouldn't say they are financially standing firm based on the most recent financial results, while they are doing better than previous quarter it isn't better in the grand scheme of things. They really need to knock it out of the park with Zen. Despite all of this, I would really like to hear about AMD's many niche products, if you could please enlighten me.
Edited by BiG StroOnZ - 1/25/16 at 1:22am
post #223 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by ebduncan View Post

man oh man, someone had to go and poke the bubble about AMD Zen again. People were crunching numbers the last time AMD said Zen would be 40% faster than excavator. Of course those numbers could never really be looked at to because even excavator has yet to be seen in the desktop market. AMD did note that the 40% was independent of process node, so that is what we are probably seeing. AMD is likely playing with some engineering samples now. Honestly if AMD is getting better results than they planned for, now would probably be a perfect time to slip out a benchmark or two to hype the market. Perhaps they could do it when they are talking about Polaris. Show a benchmark running on a AMD Zen system something simple like 3dmark firestrike.

Maybe that is too much to ask for haha. I've had that upgrade itch since skylake came out. I almost bought a Skylake I7, but the prices got jacked sky high around the holidays, so just been waiting for the time being. I'd really like to be able to consider an AMD option for my next upgrade, but I'm not gonna wait around.
Me too!
5820k or wait... headscratch.gif

I'll most probably pull the trigger.
Edited by Ashura - 1/24/16 at 10:29pm
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post #224 of 841
Don't we have a Zen hype thread someplace? I am sure I saw one ... tongue.gif
 
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post #225 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaker View Post

Don't we have a Zen hype thread someplace? I am sure I saw one ... tongue.gif

We're all hyped everywhere we go! C'mon, a new platform is coming out for us to overclock and then join 1 of 3 factions: Anti AMD, Neutral, Pro AMD. 10 ghz on LN2 or go home thumb.gif
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post #226 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaker View Post

Don't we have a Zen hype thread someplace? I am sure I saw one ... tongue.gif

ZEN 5GHz @ 1.15V core

What about price predictions?
2C/4T? 80-140€?
4C/4T ? 150 - 200€ or even more?
4C/8T ? 250 - 300€ or even more?
6C/12T ? 350 - 400€?

Will ZEN core get BE edition?
Edited by Themisseble - 1/25/16 at 1:25am
post #227 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themisseble View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaker View Post

Don't we have a Zen hype thread someplace? I am sure I saw one ... tongue.gif

ZEN 5GHz @ 1.15V core

What about price predictions?
2C/4T? 80-140€?
4C/4T ? 150 - 200€ or even more?
4C/8T ? 250 - 300€ or even more?
6C/12T ? 350 - 400€?

Will ZEN core get BE edition?

I could see them doing a "Black BE Edition"
post #228 of 841
I am very interested in Zen too. I am sure that my Z97+4790K will "survive" this year too, till I see what Zen has to offer. Z97 is still very good to have. I hope that Zen is going to be at least as powerful as Skylake. This performance gain won't be a very good reason to upgrade from the 4790K but the lower Price, DDR4 Memory and the new chipset features most definetly will be. Plus the fact that I am a Radeon GPU (290X/8GB) user and I would be tempted to create an 100% new and powerfull AMD build.
post #229 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLeakStuff View Post

Funny how you totally disregard that ATOM CPU when its the only Intel core thats fair to compare against.
And its 32nm.... rolleyes.gif

Can't honestly speak for newer results but last I'd checked Jaguar was faster than the equivalent Atoms.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faithh View Post

You seem to be missing the point, clearly. Alright, because Intel offers far superior performance per watt and because of a lower manufacturing process they can permit more execution units which logically will consume more space. (Comparing the x architectures at the same manufacturing process). First of all, the jaguar back-end looks empty and secondly it's garbage compared to Core 2.

I mean, there's like nothing in there


Jaguar is a really bad architecture, it can't even compete with a 11 years old architecture. Also, don't you think 512MB of L2 cache is amazing? It's 256KB per core, FYI.

Complexity isn't a sign of a brilliant CPU architecture, though. Netburst and Bulldozer prove that...it doesn't matter if a core is as simple as all hell if that also means its fast for its power consumption, heat output and the like.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iLeakStuff View Post

What stands on their side?

Them managing to compete with Intel on a comparatively shoestring budget for the majority of the time we've used PCs.

Seriously, people only remember their last arch...What about the Athlon64? What about the Athlon Classic? What about the K6? They were all either faster or just as fast as Intels offerings, typically.
Right now, they're focused on what they need to get out (Remember, BD was started when they were still on top) and had a designer that has consistently made industry leading chips wherever he goes be it AMD or Apple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascii Aficionado View Post

Inc faildozer 2.0

Please share with us the leak you so obviously have that we all don't to be so sure on Zen's performance.
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post #230 of 841
I'm guessing:

2C/4T - 3.3 GHz / 3.6 GHz - ~65W - $70

2C/4T - 3.5 GHz / 3.7 GHz - ~65W - $90

4C/8T - 3 GHz/ 3.4 GHz - ~65W - $160

4C/8T - 3.3 GHz / 3.6 GHz - ~95W - $190

6C/12T - 3.1 GHz / 3.4 GHz - ~95W - $240

6C/12T - 3.3 GHz / 3.6 GHz - ~125W - $280

8C/16T - 3.1 GHz / 3.4 GHz - ~125W - $320

8C/16T - 3.3 GHz / 3.5 GHz - ~125W - $350

With Skylake having about 25% higher IPC, most of the chips would have about 20% slower in ST and about 25-35% faster in MT.
Edited by Tojara - 1/25/16 at 4:32am
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