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[OC3D] AMD's Zen will have a "greater than 40%" IPC improvement over Excavator, says Lisa Su - Page 29

post #281 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlanK3r View Post

AMD is focusing at best selling segment of gaming CPUs with Zen. And it is LGA11xx, not the LGA2011. Second point is TDP of Zens CPUs. It is 95W "only" for highend models.

AMD stated that they are aiming for the top of the market, not just gamers. They will absolutely target every potentially profitable segment they can. If they only release quad core CPUs, they will only have SMT and clockspeed for differentiation, which gives them a very weak portfolio and exposes them to excessive risk without offering any worthwhile product for the bulk of the market.

Right now, 6+ cores should be the sweet spot for profit and upgrades. You can bet AMD knows this.
post #282 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyVT View Post

That's good news if it's 40% more IPC at a significantly lower frequency. It may make higher benches than we can expect.

Did you just misspeak? IPC is performance per clock/cycle. A lower frequency would be bad no matter what.

If, however, you meant "40% more performance at a significantly lower frequency," then, yes, that would be awesome - and would need more than 40% IPC required to accomplish that.
post #283 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themisseble View Post

Hmm
Do you know that AMD is going down from 28nm to 14nmFinFet?
So what double performance of GTX 980TI on 14nm is impossible?

Like I said If AM4 will support larger CHIP like 300-350mm^2 that could happen or even greater performance... but dont expect it under 600$ .

That isn't how that works....

Going from 28nm to 14nm doesn't just double performance.
    
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post #284 of 841
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Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

That isn't how that works....

Going from 28nm to 14nm doesn't just double performance.
Of corse not. With new arch that will allow 30% more perf on same node.. then it is very posdible
post #285 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Themisseble View Post

Of corse not. With new arch that will allow 30% more perf on same node.. then it is very posdible

The point is that going from 28nm to 14nm, ideally would allow 4x the transistors per area. Not 2x. Usable space on a wafer is quadratic.

Now there's some caveats with how 14nm is defined, and FinFET increasing space needed per transistor a bit, but should/could still be above 2x, compared to 28nm.
Edited by Tivan - 1/25/16 at 2:47pm
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post #286 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tivan View Post

The point is that going from 28nm to 14nm, ideally would allow 4x the transistors per area. Not 2x. Usable space on a wafer is quadratic.

Now there's some caveats with how 14nm is defined, and FinFET increasing space needed per transistor a bit, but should/could still be above 2x, compared to 28nm.

Thermal density can't be ignored either.

Although, as we all can agree, an APU with a 380 level GPU on it would be mighty fine! I have always been a fan of AMD's APUs, they just do so much for such a convenient package. The extra GPU power more than makes up for the CPU when it comes to household and business work.
    
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post #287 of 841
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Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

Thermal density can't be ignored either.

Although, as we all can agree, an APU with a 380 level GPU on it would be mighty fine! I have always been a fan of AMD's APUs, they just do so much for such a convenient package. The extra GPU power more than makes up for the CPU when it comes to household and business work.

Agreed!

And I'm holding some hopes for HSA as well! Maybe one day it'll be standard practice to program with GPU compute and shared GPU/CPU memory in mind.

Now looking at the assumed Polaris power envelope, I'm cautiously hopeful that smaller node size can achieve significantly lower operational voltage/power consumption, if designing the architecture specifically for that, so the Thermal Density issue might get ironed out more and more, over the cutting edge lifespan of the node. Still a big (recurring) challenge.
Edited by Tivan - 1/25/16 at 3:06pm
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post #288 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tivan View Post

Agreed!

And I'm holding some hopes for HSA as well! Maybe one day it'll be standard practice to program with GPU compute and shared GPU/CPU memory in mind.

Now looking at the assumed Polaris power envelope, I'm cautiously hopeful that smaller node size can achieve significantly lower operational voltage/power consumption, if designing the architecture specifically for that, so the Thermal Density issue might get ironed out more and more, over the cutting edge lifespan of the node. Still a big (recurring) challenge.

My stance on thermals? If it doesn't burn anything down, I am fine!

biggrin.gif

My feet get cold anyways, the 400 series from Nvidia was a bit of an added bonus for me!
    
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post #289 of 841
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

My stance on thermals? If it doesn't burn anything down, I am fine!

biggrin.gif

My feet get cold anyways, the 400 series from Nvidia was a bit of an added bonus for me!

Don't worry, we can keep the total power consumption of a big chunk of silicon high! Scalability is gonna be great if we just get operational voltage/heat per transistor down. thumb.gif

Thermal density is a big issue if you want to die shrink an architecture, and expect to be able to run it at the same clocks+voltage, though. Even though it's obviously confined to a smaller die area.

Getting voltage down without going lower on clock speed, that's the dream!

Personally, I just go for the biggest slice of silicon of the most state of the art architecture I can reasonably afford, and downclock if I don't like the thermals/fan sound. (at least for dGPUs) redface.gif
Edited by Tivan - 1/25/16 at 3:33pm
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post #290 of 841
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyVT View Post

The original clock on the Fury cards was supposed to be about 850mhz and 500mhz on memory. You would've got the opportunity to overclock it by 200mhz on the core. Then the 980 ti showed up and totally made AMD turn heads, I think they underestimated their competition.

Niche products like R9 Nano, AM1 systems, SoC non-consumer products and it's newest wraith cooler. I'm sure there is more, that's all I can think of on the top of my head.

The clock on the Fury X is currently 1050MHz, and 500MHz on the memory:



https://www.techpowerup.com/gpudb/2677/radeon-r9-fury-x.html

So 850MHz would be lower, and 500MHz would be exactly the same. Besides this fact, is that the card doesn't overclock well at all even with unlocked voltage:



Nano thermal throttles, APUs are for low cost budget builds, and the "wraith cooler" has yet to be implemented (even though I don't see how this helps improve sales), and what specific non-consumer SoC products are you talking about exactly, the G-Series?
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