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[XR] XTremeRigs and Performance PCs Introduce "Ultimate Watercooling Kit" - Page 11

post #101 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by DNMock View Post

They are all nickel plated, the different colors are just paint. You can throw any color you want into a vat of paint remover and they will come out nickel plated.

Ah I see, thank you thumb.gif
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post #102 of 113
Hey Guys, we just found this thread so myself and @stren are happy to participate in the discussion.

I'll kick off with an abbreviated overview of why the kit came to be released at all.

The kit is primarily for newcomers to water cooling who don't want to get stuck with parts that they find out later to be of average quality or performance.
However, we're sure that experienced users will benefit by using the kit as a base to build off if they want to go for all new parts in their build.

At no time was there consideration for selecting a part or two from each manufacturer, that's just the way that it seems to have turned out.
Each item was chosen for a specific reasons and for the vast majority, data from our performance tests was the over-riding factor.

CPU Block - best of 11 blocks tested late 2015.
Radiators - Selection of the best performing with various fan assemblies at different rpms and have a proven track record.
Fans - Best performing 120mm fan with proven track record.
Pump - Reliable D5 with USB connection for speed control which is up-gradable to have automatic control via an Aquaero.
Pump Top and Res Combo - ease of installation, good looks and best performance of the currently available D5 tops we have tested.
Fittings - proven quality and reliability.
Tubing - we decided that a new and largely unproven tubing was too risky to include at this stage.

With PPCs sleeving service added, everything will look sensation and have the best performance possible.

The components in the kit are not fixed in stone and will likely evolve with time as better performing products become available and we have been able to verify their performance with our own testing.

Unfortunately we are not allowed by OCN's TOS to link to the specific tests and/or reviews.
However we may be able to post some plots with data to help answer specific questions.

cheers.gif
f_f
post #103 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_fate View Post

Hey Guys, we just found this thread so myself and @stren are happy to participate in the discussion.

I'll kick off with an abbreviated overview of why the kit came to be released at all.

The kit is primarily for newcomers to water cooling who don't want to get stuck with parts that they find out later to be of average quality or performance.
However, we're sure that experienced users will benefit by using the kit as a base to build off if they want to go for all new parts in their build.

At no time was there consideration for selecting a part or two from each manufacturer, that's just the way that it seems to have turned out.
Each item was chosen for a specific reasons and for the vast majority, data from our performance tests was the over-riding factor.

CPU Block - best of 11 blocks tested late 2015.
Radiators - Selection of the best performing with various fan assemblies at different rpms and have a proven track record.
Fans - Best performing 120mm fan with proven track record.
Pump - Reliable D5 with USB connection for speed control which is up-gradable to have automatic control via an Aquaero.
Pump Top and Res Combo - ease of installation, good looks and best performance of the currently available D5 tops we have tested.
Fittings - proven quality and reliability.
Tubing - we decided that a new and largely unproven tubing was too risky to include at this stage.

With PPCs sleeving service added, everything will look sensation and have the best performance possible.

The components in the kit are not fixed in stone and will likely evolve with time as better performing products become available and we have been able to verify their performance with our own testing.

Unfortunately we are not allowed by OCN's TOS to link to the specific tests and/or reviews.
However we may be able to post some plots with data to help answer specific questions.

cheers.gif
f_f

Thx for the infos, but since everything you guys chose is Best performance, why didn't you go with the EK XE360mm Rad ? But instead choosing the slim Radiator? If i remember your review, the EK XE360mm Rad is the best performer in the Round Up 2015.

And if I remembered the XE360 Rad performs the best at Low speed rpm fans and High speed as well.

Is it because of the "thickness" of the XE360 Rad that you guys didn't choose it over a "slim" Rad for a newcomer to watercooling?
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post #104 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by jincuteguy View Post

Thx for the infos, but since everything you guys chose is Best performance, why didn't you go with the EK XE360mm Rad ? But instead choosing the slim Radiator? If i remember your review, the EK XE360mm Rad is the best performer in the Round Up 2015.

And if I remembered the XE360 Rad performs the best at Low speed rpm fans and High speed as well.

Is it because of the "thickness" of the XE360 Rad that you guys didn't choose it over a "slim" Rad for a newcomer to watercooling?

On the PPCs order page there is the option to select alternate thickness radiators from the drop down menu box.
So no, overall thickness of the radiators was not really a factor as you can choose which is best suited for you case wink.gif

You're correct, the XE360 did indeed have better performance, but there was a quality control issue with the first batch.
While the problem has long been rectified, a selection of radiators was chosen that are all brilliant performers and are well constructed from a manufacturer with one of the best reputations in the business.
post #105 of 113
fast_fate, was wondering if you could address my earlier points, both only having 10 feet of tubing (cuts it close in big cases) and this:
Quote:
There need to be more fan, res, TIM, and tubing options, the ones in there are a bit too narrow in choice and weigh too heavily on the "ultimate" implication of the kit's name. I get that compared to other kits out there, it does sort of deserve "ultimate", but it can be pretty easily misconstrued as getting all "ultimate" parts in one shot, when it actually ends up being a bit more subjective than objective part by part. It does generally have the most well-balanced options (assuming you're not going to use an automated cooling controller) but I wouldn't call them "ultimate". Again, though, it's a bit more subjective than objective.
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post #106 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_fate View Post

On the PPCs order page there is the option to select alternate thickness radiators from the drop down menu box.
So no, overall thickness of the radiators was not really a factor as you can choose which is best suited for you case wink.gif

You're correct, the XE360 did indeed have better performance, but there was a quality control issue with the first batch.
While the problem has long been rectified, a selection of radiators was chosen that are all brilliant performers and are well constructed from a manufacturer with one of the best reputations in the business.

Yea you're right, EK seems to have al ot of quality control issue, even their new AIO Predator coolers are having a lot of quality issues.

When are you guys going to review the new Alphacool EISBECHER Reservoir + pump top? They have their whole line up. I know that you guys just got the Monsoon MMRS and ready for review.
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post #107 of 113
So to address some of the questions/concerns/thoughts out there:

Why is it so pricey? Is there a discount vs the buying the components individually?

The price is simply the price of the components, that way if you don't like a particular component and want to use something else like the EVO block then you can just buy those individual parts. We tried to pick the stuff that we had either used a ton of times and/or had reviewed thoroughly so that we knew it inside and out. It also meant that we knew there were no long term varaiations in quality control. The price is what it comes out to when you add it all up.

It is a lot more expensive than kits from other manufacturers. This is because most of those manufacturers heavily discount their kits for sales purposes. We aren't of course able to do that as we aren't the manufacturer, nor are we trying to compete with those other kits on price. This was designed to be a different concept and to expand the market rather than compete with what's out there. Some of those kits are very good, some others will leave you wishing you'd spent more. This is one that we hope you won't regret buying.

Why soft tubing?

First off I would love to do a hard tube kit. But it's complicated. Do you add in a bending kit or not. If not, then do you add in fittings to be used for turning corners. If so then how many? I'm not ruling out a hard tube kit, but we thought the primary buyer of the kit will be a first time water cooler, and in my opinion soft tubing is just that bit easier for a new user to understand. The type of new user who can jump straight to hard tubing is also someone who can pick out their own components anyway.

Why aren't there more options?

Well there is a limit to what we can do, we can't offer the entire PPCs store as a configurable kit or it would just end up being the store as it is today. We tried to pick our favorite thing in every category, then add a bit of flexibility where we thought personal taste came in more than performance. We are also limited in our own experience. We haven't tried every TIM, res, pump, tube etc so even if there is an amazing option that we have missed (in your opinion) we can't really approve it until we've seen and played with it ourselves.

"I think XXX component is better than your YYY choice"

Again, while we have played with and reviewed a lot of water cooling products we certainly haven't tried and used everything. We picked stuff that has usually performed at the top while considering factors like quality, ease of use, price and expected lifetime.

The bottom line is, there is a diversity of products on the market because many people like different things. So these may feel like subjective choices, though we have tried to be objective about it. So there will always be someone who disagrees with our choices here, but I don't think they can ever be considered truly bad choices smile.gif

Why aren't there options to add in more rads or gpu block etc etc?

We would love to do that and in general make it more configurable. However we have to start somewhere and a "360 cpu kit" seemed a good place to start because that's where most new people also start.

If the kit sells then I'd like to add more options like those mentioned, but for now we have to wait and see how it goes smile.gif

Why not just buy a CLC/AIO?

That's always an argument for water cooling or not and doesn't really apply specifically matter for this kit. AIO's cool well, water cooling does everything better but takes more work/knowledge/risk/money. This is a kit for someone who has decided to go with water cooling, wants great components, but isn't sure what to buy and doesn't want to spend a month researching things smile.gif If you're already knowledgeable then you know what you should or shouldn't buy anyway smile.gif


Lastly - "Ultimate" - chunky I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. I think you don't like the word for some reason, maybe because it's a kit limited in scope (i.e. 360 cpu only loop)? It's not supposed to deliver all you'd ever need, just a good starting point that you shouldn't need to throw out components from. If things go well we can expand the line up and flexibility within it smile.gif
Edited by stren - 2/4/16 at 12:06am
     
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post #108 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by stren View Post

Lastly - "Ultimate" - chunky I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. I think you don't like the word for some reason, maybe because it's a kit limited in scope (i.e. 360 cpu only loop)? It's not supposed to deliver all you'd ever need, just a good starting point that you shouldn't need to throw out components from. If things go well we can expand the line up and flexibility within it smile.gif
I know, it's nothing against what was picked out for the kit, I suppose what I'm getting at is that leaving "Ultimate" on its own in the name rather than "Ultimate Starter" leaves room for customers to misrepresent the product. Of course, that happens with a lot of other "ultimate" products, but I'm saying for this instance it could be made a bit clearer as to what the kit is and its intended purpose.

That said, a more immediate concern is my point about the one tubing length option, there should probably be a 15/20-foot option for bigger cases/more elaborate setups.
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post #109 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_Chimp View Post

That said, a more immediate concern is my point about the one tubing length option, there should probably be a 15/20-foot option for bigger cases/more elaborate setups.

Did you go buy yourself a TX10???

Anyone else think 10ft is too little? For a 360 cpu only kit I thought it had plenty to spare given that you only need three sections of tube (cpu to rad, rad to pump/res, pump/res to cpu), but yes if you're getting this and adding more rads to it then I can see it might not be enough. Primochill tube is so damn expensive though.
     
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post #110 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by stren View Post

Did you go buy yourself a TX10???
If I did I'd have made it (more) visible from space. tongue.gif I do see your point, though, but like I said before it's always better to have too much tubing than too little.
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