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[TT] AMD's new Zeppelin CPU spotted, features 32 CPU cores - Page 3

post #21 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by IvantheDugtrio View Post

AMD said they would use socket AM4 for everything in the future though it might just be on the consumer side. I would expect a G34 successor.

Well it sure would be nice if at last AMD would have a consumer desktop socket with quad channel RAM. Although considering they plan to use the same socket also for their low end stuff (for example, the stuff currently on AM1 platform) I am not holding my breath over that possibility. Unless AM4 is going to be some kind of really really unusual somehow modular socket (i.e., a "small" variant of the socket with only half or quarter of the pins and size with the "small" APU's capable of functioning also on the large socket in the, say, upper right quadrant of it).

Far more likely scenario is ofc keeping the desktop and server sockets separate as they are currently.

While very unlikely I could see them pulling off the one socket for everything in theory. If one is already putting pins in the socket then few hundred extra pins overhead cost is relatively minor. I mean if talking about, say, ~2000 pin socket vs ~2200 pin socket. Or they might not need that many with most of the stuff already in the SoC, just the buses going to RAM, IO and PCIe slots and power delivery as well ofc. So the server chips would be differentiated predominantly by having a "server" south/northbridge in the SoC while consumer versions would have the "consumer" version with some cut capabilities like not supporting registered and ECC memory, no SAS, etc. Only problem might be the ITX boards if they have a new socket similar in the size to Intels LGA2011 or their own G34 (LGA1944). But their APU's might benefit greatly from having quad channel DDR4 RAM as higher end ones seem to be quite memory bandwidth starved in their APU's.
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post #22 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tivan View Post

Cores. They don't really do the module thing anymore with zen. Also AMD always called cores, cores. Modules is just a term to refer to configurations, generally.

They called integer units cores which is not a full core in my book. Mainly because I care a lot more about floating point performance for my specific usage pattern than I do for integer performance.
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post #23 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniflex View Post

They called integer units cores which is not a full core in my book. Mainly because I care a lot more about floating point performance for my specific usage pattern than I do for integer performance.

That's the point. No one has exactly defined a core so technically they were not wrong.
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post #24 of 111
If Zen will run 32 threads at once I don't think we will care how many cores it actually has biggrin.gif
post #25 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniflex View Post

They called integer units cores which is not a full core in my book. Mainly because I care a lot more about floating point performance for my specific usage pattern than I do for integer performance.

What's an integer unit? I only know of integer cores, the thing people have been using for decades to refer to cores.

Feel free to explain to me how it differs from an integer core, I'm very curious about your view on the terms.
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post #26 of 111
This is the thing I like about AMD, they always try new tehnologies to move the industry forward even if they don't work at least they are doing something.
post #27 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Omega X View Post

AMD is going all out for Zen. They must be confident about its performance.

When you're gonna hit the wall no matter what you do, you might as well aim straight and hit it hard...

I think Zen will do fine, with intel getting bored with desktop stuff I think Zen will do well.

Considering a Zen with Greenland in it is gonna be like having a 380X in the cpu... woof.
post #28 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tivan View Post

What's an integer unit? I only know of integer cores, the thing people have been using for decades to refer to cores.

Feel free to explain to me how it differs from an integer core, I'm very curious about your view on the terms.

Basically instead of running with a core that has two daughter math sub-cores they're now running with more cores and each one has a specific math sub-core to it that can do the math while the core gets on with core stuff. The whole Poledancer core pattern of this last generation (quite literally the nightmare of the post Phenom][ world) was claimed to be just as capable as intel's hyperthread but simply can't get work to the second daughter without interrupting the main task. Kinda like trying to deliver pizza AND drive Uber at the same time. So now on zen they're going to treat each core like an independent processor in a cluster and see if that works better. Basically they've added a math co-processor and other additional components to each core instead of making part of the intrinsic core have two heads.
post #29 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by prjindigo View Post

Basically instead of running with a core that has two daughter math sub-cores they're now running with more cores and each one has a specific math sub-core to it that can do the math while the core gets on with core stuff. The whole Poledancer core pattern of this last generation (quite literally the nightmare of the post Phenom][ world) was claimed to be just as capable as intel's hyperthread but simply can't get work to the second daughter without interrupting the main task. Kinda like trying to deliver pizza AND drive Uber at the same time. So now on zen they're going to treat each core like an independent processor in a cluster and see if that works better. Basically they've added a math co-processor and other additional components to each core instead of making part of the intrinsic core have two heads.

I know that! I was asking how this makes the integer cores into 'integer units', that aren't cores.

Intel also have the floating point units, by the way. (which don't really seem like cores, because they cannot run the PC standalone. But any integer core can function as the computational heart of a computer.)

And Zen has hyper threading as well, they will have 2 threads per core.

Just curious how putting 2 integer core into a module that share non-essential resources for functioning as sole computational unit of a PC, makes em 'units' not cores. They're also units, of cores. Sure. 2 core units per module. Kinda like Intel has 4 core units per quad core. Fun fact, intel quad cores also share some resources between cores. Are they not quadcores but single cores? Or zero core, 4 units?

They sure are, depending on how you want to define em. That's where I'm curious how the guy I asked would define these terms. I just want to gain an insight into a new classification methodology like that, that I'm not too familiar with.
Edited by Tivan - 2/3/16 at 2:28am
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post #30 of 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tivan View Post

I know that! I was asking how this makes the integer cores into 'integer units', that aren't cores.

Intel also have the floating point units, by the way. (which don't really seem like cores, because they cannot run the PC standalone. But any integer core can function as the computational heart of a computer.)

And Zen has hyper threading as well, they will have 2 threads per core.

Just curious how putting 2 integer core into a module that share non-essential resources for functioning as sole computational unit of a PC, makes em 'units' not cores. They're also units, of cores. Sure. 2 core units per module. Kinda like Intel has 4 core units per quad core. Fun fact, intel quad cores also share some resources between cores. Are they not quadcores but single cores? Or zero core, 4 units?

They sure are, depending on how you want to define em. That's where I'm curious how the guy I asked would define these terms. I just want to gain an insight into a new classification methodology like that, that I'm not too familiar with.

For me integer "unit" is the same as integer "core", however, for me a full core is integer (logic) part plus the floating point part. Because with my specific load the new AMD CPU's with supposedly "8 cores" after Phenom II performed like a 4 core chips. Meaning that 6 core Phenom II was outperforming the new supposedly "8 core" chips at similar clock rates. I'll add that Intel's hyper-threading is not really beneficial for my loads either. Intel's i7's perform for my load about the same with our without hyper-threading. That specific load being solving a large systems of nonlinear differential equations numerically with a Python script for data manipulation wrapped around Fortran numerical core doing the numerical crunching. Good chunk of it is based on Fourier Transform (which would run awesome on GFX cards in theory, but going that way is whole load of additional time to spend on reworking the code and time I'm chronically short of).
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Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [TT] AMD's new Zeppelin CPU spotted, features 32 CPU cores