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[SPCR] 4k gaming @ ~23db - Page 3

post #21 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Then you are no 'audiophile'. When I has audiophile-itis (maybe it was addition) the hardest part of building systems was getting all the hiss and buzz out of them .. and we had no fans or flying insects making noises. biggrin.gif

Oh, doyll.....it is well known that audiophiles extol the virtues of things like noisy amplifiers and bad signal to noise because they can simply turn up the volume. As a matter of fact, Nelson Pass and Mark Levison were highly praised for their efforts to try to push background noise to the highest levels possible in their equipment.

"Turn up the volume"......most ridiculous comment I have read on this board in a while, and at OCN, that is really saying something. rolleyes.gif
post #22 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by ciarlatano View Post

Oh, doyll.....it is well known that audiophiles extol the virtues of things like noisy amplifiers and bad signal to noise because they can simply turn up the volume. As a matter of fact, Nelson Pass and Mark Levison were highly praised for their efforts to try to push background noise to the highest levels possible in their equipment.

"Turn up the volume"......most ridiculous comment I have read on this board in a while, and at OCN, that is really saying something. rolleyes.gif
Yeah, the worst hum I ever had took months to find. Ended up being the refrigerator in neighbor's apartment above me.
post #23 of 73
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Is there enough room to stand up or do I have to crawl round on all fours like you cats do? biggrin.gif
I'm a member, post and use data regularly. Much of the work done there is good.
So therefore you are comfortable dismissing it offhand as "political speak and advertising hype?"
Quote:
Sorry, but what I said about the quote you posted still stands. Anyone doing analytical testing needs to do their writing the same way. The minute they start talking up what they did and bragging, credibility starts swirling down the drain.
All this indicates to me is that you didn't read the article...
Quote:
Edit: I'm trying to find out what their fan test system is. Their fan test results look very accurate, and they go into great detail about their test instruments, but are very vague and secretive about the physical test system. Again, not being shown makes me skeptical.
Pics or lies? rolleyes.gif

"Vague and secretive" isn't offering much of an editorial/analysis/warrant to your claim - could you explain? I personally find the pictures of their test system, the explanation of their method, and explanation of differences of various iterations of their bench to be pretty clear...
Quote:
Being involved in designing a case means little or nothing. I work with companies all the time with case airflow designs and cooling concepts. So what? I can rub my belly and scratch my head too. Doesn't mean I run fast or jump high.
Having a testing system at all rather than comparing results from different tests to make general observations has to give them some credibility... wink.gif

Your hubris aside, I personally find it really interesting that SPCR was able to build a system that push can 50fps at 4k and stay reasonably quiet. Like MicroCat, I too think this is not real-world, but it's interesting! I would've expected 2000+ rpm on the GPU to push that many pixels. thumb.gif
Edited by claes - 2/4/16 at 12:05pm
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post #24 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by claes View Post

So therefore you are comfortable dismissing it offhand as "political speak and advertising hype?"
All this indicates to me is that you didn't read the article...
Pics or lies? rolleyes.gif

"Vague and secretive" isn't offering much of an editorial/analysis/warrant to your claim - could you explain? I personally find the pictures of their test system, the explanation of their method, and explanation of differences of various iterations of their bench to be pretty clear...
Having a testing system at all rather than comparing results from different tests to make general observations has to give them some credibility... wink.gif

Your hubris aside, I personally find it really interesting that SPCR was able to build a system that push can 50fps at 4k and stay reasonably quiet. Like MicroCat, I too think this is not real-world, but it's interesting! I would've expected 2000+ rpm on the GPU to push that many pixels. thumb.gif

Believe whatever you want. But if you take are real look between the lines of reviews you can sometimes find the real meat of the story.

I never said there were any lies or deceptions. I only pointed out some things that sometimes end up being the precursors of inaccuracy and sometimes even deception.

They built a nice quiet system and have no problem beating their chests and patting themselves on the back. They take a bunch of samples supplied by their sponsors and build a quiet system with them. Then proceed to expound the virtues of of the components and system. This is the way review sites and reviewers keep their sources of product happy and keep receiving more samples. I have done these thing myself when 'testing' and writing reviews. Using reviews to to evaluate what products are good and which are bad is not easy to do. Reviews rarely say anything bad about the products, but instead simply don't give as much praise. To determine which products are the best is more about reading between the line then what is written. After reading these things for many years it become second nature to question what is not said rather than what is actually written.
Edited by doyll - 2/4/16 at 1:37pm
post #25 of 73
Thread Starter 
That's 'cause there's literally nothing else to say! rolleyes.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

When I see dBA of less 20dBA at 1 meter big red lights flash. Very few people have access to enviroments quieter than 25-30dBA, and it is very hard to monitor noises at or below ambient.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

I'm a member, post and use data regularly. Much of the work done there is good.

...who is unaware of their anechoic chamber, their fairly exhaustive explanations (three) of their fan test-system, and basically every other defining feature of the site...

You should take your advice:
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

'A' typo ??? Way more than a single 'typo'. Looks like whole sentences were typed wrong.

If the tester and reviewer and their proofing staff make that big a mistake in the writing and editing, how many similar mistakes are possible in the actual testing?

Credibility is not easy to achieve .. and even harder to regain when errors are made. wink.gif.
thumb.gif
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post #26 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by ciarlatano View Post

Oh, doyll.....it is well known that audiophiles extol the virtues of things like noisy amplifiers and bad signal to noise because they can simply turn up the volume. As a matter of fact, Nelson Pass and Mark Levison were highly praised for their efforts to try to push background noise to the highest levels possible in their equipment.

"Turn up the volume"......most ridiculous comment I have read on this board in a while, and at OCN, that is really saying something. rolleyes.gif

I can see how that can be a problem living in a $500 apartment with roommates.
    
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post #27 of 73
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Can you show me one picture of their airflow system that shows the whole thing from air flowing it to air flowing out? I have looked them read all the info there I could find. But maybe you can give information I couldn't find.
Nope, but you wouldn't have posted this baited/trolling question if you did not know already! thumb.gif

This is why I asked for clarification earlier on what you meant redface.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by claes View Post

So therefore you are comfortable dismissing it offhand as "political speak and advertising hype?"
...
Pics or lies? rolleyes.gif

"Vague and secretive" isn't offering much of an editorial/analysis/warrant to your claim - could you explain?

Don't get me wrong - I agree, they should offer a full picture of their setup, but your gross mischaracterization is indicative of a lack in the very same editorial credibility you demand of others.

For example, reading the article you will find that it is more than the summary at the end that I offered (couldn't very comfortably quote six pages), and does offer some "analysis" in to how they achieved their results (certainly worth being critical of).
You'd also notice that they are unhappy with their results, and critical of some of the components (contrary to your "pat on the back/beating chest" characterization).
As a regular reader and forum member, you might also be aware of Mike's difficulty in getting samples from folks like AMD and CM, in his opinion due to his critical reviews of their products, or how SPCR has been disappointed in the results of some of their own "Silent PC Build Guides" (that is to say that they weren't silent enough for them).
Just some food for thought.
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post #28 of 73
Single GPU system in 2016? Loudest part usually is the coil whine imo.
post #29 of 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by claes View Post

Nope, but you wouldn't have posted this baited/trolling question if you did not know already! thumb.gif

This is why I asked for clarification earlier on what you meant redface.gif
Don't get me wrong - I agree, they should offer a full picture of their setup, but your gross mischaracterization is indicative of a lack in the very same editorial credibility you demand of others.

For example, reading the article you will find that it is more than the summary at the end that I offered (couldn't very comfortably quote six pages), and does offer some "analysis" in to how they achieved their results (certainly worth being critical of).
You'd also notice that they are unhappy with their results, and critical of some of the components (contrary to your "pat on the back/beating chest" characterization).
As a regular reader and forum member, you might also be aware of Mike's difficulty in getting samples from folks like AMD and CM, in his opinion due to his critical reviews of their products, or how SPCR has been disappointed in the results of some of their own "Silent PC Build Guides" (that is to say that they weren't silent enough for them).

Just some food for thought.
Baiting maybe, but not trolling at all. When they won't show us the whole test system but expound in detail about the test instruments doesn't that ring little warning bells in your ears? biggrin.gif
The colored section above shows you get my point! thumb.gif
There are many interpretations to be sorted. Way to many. A good review is one that sticks to only the facts and analyzes them them accurately without bias. Very few do that.

So Mike and staff are now maybe a little careful about what they say? Maybe, maybe not. but this all backs up what I've been saying.

Maybe I misinterpreted what you were doing when you started this thread. The spcr article is not a bad builders log. But it also has lots of praise about things for the purpose of 'kissing the hands that feed them'. Their suppliers of samples.
Edited by doyll - 2/4/16 at 4:04pm
post #30 of 73
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by claes View Post

Nope, but you wouldn't have posted this baited/trolling question if you did not know already! thumb.gif

This is why I asked for clarification earlier on what you meant redface.gif
Sometimes I make statements in good faith, mostly because I'm lazy, but it turns out I was wrong about this.

Assuming you are talking about their CFM measurements and similar, you can see the device they used in 2006 here:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article687-page2.html

In 2007 they found that this wasn't accurate, and played around with several other systems, also pictured here:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article734-page1.html

Then, in 2010, they decided that trying to measure CFM was too difficult, but there's still a picture of their anemometer and their fan test setup:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1040-page3.html

While I had reviewed these articles before posting earlier (I haven't read them in years), I had assumed (in good faith) that these pictures weren't good enough (because you felt so). Now, having skimmed more thoroughly, I am curious what you feel is missing?

I do not ask this as a baiting/trolling question - I'm serious! SPCR, despite many problems (they don't measure intake temp, anechoic chambers aren't real world, they don't bother to OC and are okay with running their GPUs in the 80s, etc), has been my go to source for best method. What do you feel is lacking? Maybe you were referring to a different measurement's method lacking?

Edit/Pst: The colored section below shows you do not understand my point:redface.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Baiting maybe, but not trolling at all. When they won't show us the whole test system but expound in detail about the test instruments doesn't that ring little warning bells in your ears? biggrin.gif
The colored section above shows you get my point! thumb.gif
There are many interpretations to be sorted. Way to many. A good review is one that sticks to only the facts and analyzes them them accurately without bias. Very few do that.

So Mike and staff are now maybe a little careful about what they say? Maybe, maybe not. but this all backs up what I've been saying.

Maybe I misinterpreted what you were doing when you started this thread. The spcr article is not a bad builders log. But it also has lots of praise about things for the purpose of 'kissing the hands that feed them'. Their suppliers of samples.

Edited by claes - 2/4/16 at 4:15pm
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