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Jonsbo / Cooltek Case Gallery and Owners Club - Page 14

post #131 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by BakerMan1971 View Post

Lots of great info Dokter Dibber, it was when the case was launch I think most of the review sites claimed E-ATX capability, probably not with official fittings but modded. Not completely sure. So apologies if my comment was misleading.

That tempered glass upgrade is a must. I must have it thumb.gif

***EDIT*** Glass kit should be out the end of next month for around 30 Euro.

Mot misleading at all. I realise that there is a lot of wrong information out there about the W2. Mainly because it is so compact and will still fit an XL-ATX board. And XL-ATX and E-ATX are often interpreted as the same by many. I used to have an MSI Big Bang board and Iwill DK8N board. XL-ATX and E-ATX.

Quote:
Originally Posted by atomicus View Post

Jonsbo have given you some wrong info there, and what they've said is not entirely accurate... it ENTIRELY depends on what E-ATX motherboard we're talking about. This is because most current E-ATX boards use identical standoff layouts as their ATX counterparts (in fact I can't seem to find one that doesn't). I have checked this on the recent MSI XPower boards, and they are the same. The ONLY difference is the E-ATX board extends out just under an inch. That is it. I am pretty sure the Asus E-ATX boards (Rampage V Edition 10 for example) are also the same, not sure about Gigabyte, Asus or EVGA but a quick visual check on their website would suggest they are.

Problem with talking to these companies is you're often communicating with some low level employee who really doesn't know that much about the product, and likely has never built in it. They will just be reading off official specs. Always pays to do a bit more research. smile.gif

However, the bigger problem with the W2 and UMX4 is that I am pretty sure an E-ATX board would block off the cable passthroughs.

UPDATE: I've just done a comparison in Photoshop with the all latest E-ATX boards and they are all the same... ATX stand-off layouts, nothing different. Maybe they used to be different years ago, but they certainly aren't now. Someone should tell Jonsbo lol!

thumb.gif
You might be right that the rules/standards are broken by board manufacturers (now) when it comes to E-ATX.
I think that MSI did with the X99A XPOWER GAMING TITANIUM (the board that I have on order).
But why should I buy a case of which the manufacturer confirms that it's not supported, lacks 3 stand offs, and will be an extremely tight fit for E-ATX.
The next E-ATX board that I buy might have the 3 extra holes. Usually to prevent flexing because the boards power connectors live in that area.
(BTW, the Iwill DK8N that I owned did have the 3 extra holes.)
It will be cramped, and I risk getting to hear a "told you so" by Jonsbo or the shop.
And the E-ATX standard officially specified (and still does) the extra 3 mounting holes at the board's elongated edge (vertically on the right hand side).
Check it here : http://www.10stripe.com/featured/form/atx.php
You could always contact Jonsbo with your findings about the motherboard manufacturers not implementing the extra 3 holes though.
But I guess that they prefer to build to the standards.
post #132 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dokter Bibber View Post

You might be right that the rules/standards are broken by board manufacturers (now) when it comes to E-ATX.
I think that MSI did with the X99A XPOWER GAMING TITANIUM (the board that I have on order).
But why should I buy a case of which the manufacturer confirms that it's not supported, lacks 3 stand offs, and will be an extremely tight fit for E-ATX.
The next E-ATX board that I buy might have the 3 extra holes. Usually to prevent flexing because the boards power connectors live in that area.
(BTW, the Iwill DK8N that I owned did have the 3 extra holes.)
It will be cramped, and I risk getting to hear a "told you so" by Jonsbo or the shop.
And the E-ATX standard officially specified (and still does) the extra 3 mounting holes at the board's elongated edge (vertically on the right hand side).
Check it here : http://www.10stripe.com/featured/form/atx.php
You could always contact Jonsbo with your findings about the motherboard manufacturers not implementing the extra 3 holes though.
But I guess that they prefer to build to the standards.

I have just bought that same board and have it in my hands now. I've mounted it in case (not the W2 though) and there is no flex on the right hand edge. I can only assume they are making boards stronger these days and simply don't need those extra holes anymore. Actually this board is reinforced, but no new board has these holes, even without reinforcement. It may be 'official' to have three holes, but obviously that's a very loose meaning of the word if they are now being omitted on ALL new boards... which they are as I have checked, not a single E-ATX board for Z170 or X99 has those three holes. They'd need a good reason to start including them again... i.e boards snapping, connectors breaking etc.
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post #133 of 925
For anyone in the UK, the UMX4 Window version is now up for pre-order at Quiet PC priced at £145. smile.gif
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post #134 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by atomicus View Post

I have just bought that same board and have it in my hands now. I've mounted it in case (not the W2 though) and there is no flex on the right hand edge. I can only assume they are making boards stronger these days and simply don't need those extra holes anymore. Actually this board is reinforced, but no new board has these holes, even without reinforcement. It may be 'official' to have three holes, but obviously that's a very loose meaning of the word if they are now being omitted on ALL new boards... which they are as I have checked, not a single E-ATX board for Z170 or X99 has those three holes. They'd need a good reason to start including them again... i.e boards snapping, connectors breaking etc.
Of course there is no flex. Like I wrote :
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dokter Bibber View Post

.......... You might be right that the rules/standards are broken by board manufacturers (now) when it comes to E-ATX.
I think that MSI did with the X99A XPOWER GAMING TITANIUM (the board that I have on order). ..........
I meant that the MSI motherboard is not a full-sized (standard) E-ATX board (although it's marketed as such.). It's only 12" x 10.7". Just 1.1" (28mm) wider than regular ATX. (But still covering the gromet for the 24-pin cable.)
A full-sized (standard) E-ATX motherboard is supposed to be 12" x 13".
So the MSI board is only 1.6" wider, not 3.4". So it doesn't flex. The 3 extra mounting holes would have been just before the 13" edge, so the board is not wide enough to add the 3 extra mounting holes. (And the W2 doesn't have the 3 extra stand offs.)
(For reference, an ATX board is sized at 12" x 9.6").
I'm surprised that you didn't notice the missing 2.3" (58mm) when you had the board in your hands.
Edited by Dokter Bibber - 7/23/16 at 5:49am
post #135 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dokter Bibber View Post

I meant that the MSI motherboard is not a full-sized (standard) E-ATX board (although it's marketed as such.). It's only 12" x 10.7". Just 1.1" (28mm) wider than regular ATX. (But still covering the gromet for the 24-pin cable.)
A full-sized (standard) E-ATX motherboard is supposed to be 12" x 13".
So the MSI board is only 1.6" wider, not 3.4". So it doesn't flex. The 3 extra mounting holes would have been just before the 13" edge, so the board is not wide enough to add the 3 extra mounting holes. (And the W2 doesn't have the 3 extra stand offs.)
(For reference, an ATX board is sized at 12" x 9.6").
I'm surprised that you didn't notice the missing 2.3" (58mm) when you had the board in your hands.

Well in that case it seems there is no standard for E-ATX anymore, or it's now been re-written, because there are approximately ZERO mainstream so-called E-ATX boards that are 13" wide. There is now a new E-ATX format that has been created by EVERY SINGLE mainstream consumer board manufacturer, the old one is defunct... they just don't seem to have told anyone, but it seems the textbooks are about to be updated. It's kind of a moot point to say that the case doesn't support E-ATX if there are no new E-ATX boards that you can buy which actually won't fit it, whereas if you went out and bought a new E-ATX board today from any retailer, it would actually fit in this case. And THIS is important to know because 99.9% of people buying an E-ATX board today will find that it DOES fit in this case, yet Jonsbo are mistakenly telling them it won't. Technically you are right, practically you are not. Only someone with an OLD style E-ATX motherboard would have issues.
Edited by atomicus - 7/23/16 at 6:08am
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post #136 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by atomicus View Post

Well in that case it seems there is no standard for E-ATX anymore, or it's now been re-written, because there are approximately ZERO mainstream so-called E-ATX boards that are 13" wide. There is now a new E-ATX format that has been created by EVERY SINGLE mainstream consumer board manufacturer, the old one is defunct... they just don't seem to have told anyone, but it seems the textbooks are about to be updated. It's kind of a moot point to say that the case doesn't support E-ATX if there are no new E-ATX boards that you can buy which actually won't fit it, whereas if you went out and bought a new E-ATX board today from any retailer, it would actually fit in this case. And THIS is important to know because 99.9% of people buying an E-ATX board today will find that it DOES fit in this case, yet Jonsbo are mistakenly telling them it won't. Technically you are right, practically you are not. Only someone with an OLD style E-ATX motherboard would have issues.

Jonsbo is correct. A proper E-ATX motherboard will never fit in the W2.

You're turning it around. It's not the mainstream motherboard manufacturers making the standards. They are breaking the standard ATX format, and wrongly spec it as E-ATX. While it's neither of the two.
They spec the board as E-ATX to cover their behinds. They can't spec it as ATX because there's a risk it won't fit in the many smaller ATX format cases. Whereas it will always fit in proper E-ATX cases built to the E-ATX standard.

Visit not-so-mainstream board makers like Tyan, Supermicro, etc and you'll find that all their dual and quad socket server/workstation boards are 12" x 13" aka E-ATX or SSI-EEB.
Not so defunct after all.

The way XL-ATX (which is not a board standard) came about is because some mainstream motherboard manufacturers were breaking the ATX form factor and naming it so. Don't know who coined the name. The funny bit is that each company has their own sizes of XL-ATX. Sometimes even extending the board length (12" side) by the width of 2 slots. Wicked standard going on there.
These 3 (MSI, EVGA, Gigabyte) just invented extended sizes and named it XL-ATX for their own purposes like they are doing now with faux E-ATX, and then naming it E-ATX.
I don't know of an XL-ATX sized board made by for example Asus or Asrock.

The faux E-ATX form factor boards will still cover the gromet for the 24-pin power cable to the motherboard. If the 24-pin cable is round (not separate wires flat next to each other) your board had better flex. Or you can't screw down the board. But you already said that the board doesn't flex.
Edited by Dokter Bibber - 7/23/16 at 7:13am
post #137 of 925
Yes, you may be right, but the fact remains that the VAST majority of people buying this case (and other cases which say they don't support E-ATX) will not be looking at Tyon or any other "proper" E-ATX motherboard. Most people wouldn't even consider such boards, only a very select group of enthusiasts. They will almost certainly be considering what you call a faux E-ATX board, which would fit. As I originally mentioned though, the cable passthroughs would indeed be blocked, although with the UMX4 it looks like you could still bring them around from underneath the PSU. Not all cases have this problem though. The InWin 303 for example fits "faux E-ATX" perfectly, but there is no way anyone would know this unless they tried (or measured).
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post #138 of 925
Quick headsup, W2 Tempered glass pre-ordered and paid for, looking forward to it arriving, getting it from PC-Cooling
    
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post #139 of 925
Mine arrived from Germany on Tuesday, build is complete, quite happy with results though bottom rad mounting is hard, mine is stuck to fans with velcro...



post #140 of 925
Quote:
Originally Posted by atomicus View Post

Yes, you may be right, but the fact remains that the VAST majority of people buying this case (and other cases which say they don't support E-ATX) will not be looking at Tyon or any other "proper" E-ATX motherboard. Most people wouldn't even consider such boards, only a very select group of enthusiasts. ..........
Maybe that's why the W2 doesn't support proper 12" x 13" E-ATX boards.
I'm going to exit this subject now, because it's only indirectly related to Jonsbo cases. Others are already attempting to keep the thread on-topic with relevant posts.
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