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[Ars] E-cigs shut down hundreds of immune system genes—regular cigs don’t - Page 15  

post #141 of 371
What is the difference between vaping and smoking regular cigs?

I'm a non-smoker btw.
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post #142 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by farmdve View Post

What is the difference between vaping and smoking regular cigs?

I'm a non-smoker btw.

One of them is actual cigarettes the other is an electronic device that simulates real cigarettes but is less lethal
post #143 of 371
"Why do I do this?"
~Bill Burr.

15 pages of discussion in two days and only 11 posts mentioning anything relevant...


I'm going to start by saying, I used to chainsmoke cigars (gave myself nicotine poisoning once even! was not a good day, don't ever do it) and now vape for like 2 years. Figured I'd give you a disclaimer.

I recommend people switching to vape for one reason only. Its cheaper by an order of magnitude if you DIY your juice. I think for past two years I spent about 300-400 dollars combined on everything and I gave tons of juice away to friends. So money is the reason to switch. Second reason is, it won't stick to your cloth and stink up your work place so you know co-workers won't hate you for it, or loved once and etc.
So hear are 2 reasons to switch that are independent of everything in articles etc. If you just can't quit or really don't want to let go of a vice (I can understand, I stopped drinking bot not smoking) at least consider the rational.

Second part of the rant here is that articles that try to present tobaco as a better alternative to vape are inherently ridiculous as not only its at this point proven that tar in human lungs = bad times, but it is also proven that less money in human wallets = bad. Its an inherently insane juxtaposition for the two very rational reasons.

Now with all my biases out of the way.

The article published is a summary of few studies done. As some people mentioned I won't stand for pseudoscience so lets discuss shall we?
1st - The gene mod one,
Ok, a pretty ok study. The control groups are there, but no word on diversity and the numbers are very small (3 dozen, split in 3 groups of smoker, non smokers and vapers) Overall 6/10. It can be a lot better but its not useless and can even provide some tips for everyone.
Sleep more and eat on schedule to not nerf your immune system further. Avoid contact with sick people, wash your hands. etc. *oh and clean your drip tip, a great way to avoid recurring infections in general)
I wouldn't call it a great study (sample size is waaay to small) but overall? Not bad. Definitely buyer beware type of scenario. Again if we are to weigh an increase risk of infection vs massive issues that smoking causes, I'd go with the increased risk but to each is own.

2nd and presumably the remaining studies - The submerging of immune cells in eliquid.
Are you guys for real? At no point this amount of juice will make it into anyone's lungs/nasal passages. This is such an edge case that you can't possibly call it admitable. They could have gone with solution or repeated vapor exposure, but no! Dunk them into a metaphorical bucket....
Sigh. They also point out the presence of a known "trouble maker" diacetyl. The chemical responsible for so called popcorn lung. Till this day the case smells funny to me. If exposure to this chemical in factories and from normal smelling of microwave popcorn was causing such rapid onset of a terrible disease, why don't we have tobacco smokers dropping dead within few years of picking up the habit even though tobacco smoke contains orders of magnitude more of the stuff? Take it as you will, but in my eyes something is not right about this case that was so quickly shut. As many will point out that some shops will offer you juice without that stuff.


In conclusion. I agree with few voices of reason that as any community we must not stand for pseudoscience. In this case, I think there is some merit to there studies, at least based on info available. In general, never advocate vaping outside of (its sooo much cheaper and won't make people hate you argument) as any vice is everyone choice.
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post #144 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheReciever View Post


And yet, profits are rising. Saddening a bit.

 

Profits from America or other countries?

post #145 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by HowHardCanItBe View Post

Cleaned and reopened. A reminder to everyone!
Anymore disruptions will mean permanent lockdown of this thread.
Sorry but according to the guidelines, this thread will remain where it is. The article doesn't present in a speculative way and I unfortunately can't move it.

The source material is speculative. By the extension the article is speculative.

Overclock.net, where news is posted as confirmed because we don't understand the source material.
    
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post #146 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiNet View Post

I honestly want to congratulate you!
I'm a heavy vaper frown.gif Much heavier than I was smoking imo. It's hard to compare vs smoking, but that's the feeling I get sometimes simply because I don't need to go out... all day in front of pc... with a mod in hand... you see where this is going smile.gif
There's no disgust feeling like when you're chain smoking. I don't get "fed up" with it and can vape non-stop. Plus some liquids are so damn tasty... so that's my current issue that I plan to overcome. And it became real issue on par with smoking.

I think those who are "Big cloud" guys are ruining it for everyone. Those that do that in public. I guess it stuck in my head that it's only means to stop smoking and they are thinking something else.

Thanks but not really. lol I was a pack a day smoker for 33 years, now I'm paying for it with all sorts of mysterious medical issues I don't know that I'll survive from. I've tried quitting numerous times, this time it might be too late, but time will tell.

I don't really know any vape people, I've seen a few around and the heavy vape guys don't seem any healthier than regular smokers, IMO. You can see the addiction, the insanely huge hits and their bloodshot eyes and the effects wash over their faces. I'm not saying everyone is like that, but I always see someone like that at the larger shops where they sell vape equipment.

I'm not at all sure, but I'm fairly confident the sugar content and extra chemicals in flavored juice would probably be detrimental to my health... I'm recovering from a few things and getting worse with others, doctors are baffled and yeah... well, not everything can be easily diagnosed or treated... the human physiology is still a good bit of mystery. There are many complex chemical interactions that we're not fully aware of and vaping could be a contributing factor for many things we do not fully understand yet.

An addiction is an addiction, people who want to squabble over which is healthier... yeah, it's just kind of silly. Anyway, hope you get over yours. I was starting to enjoy a sub-ohm heavy hit when I realized what I was about to get myself into.
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post #147 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by farmdve View Post

What is the difference between vaping and smoking regular cigs?

I'm a non-smoker btw.
Smoking involves lighting heavily additive laden tobacco on fire and inhaling the fumes.

Vaping vaporizes liquid nicotine and usually diacetyl laden flavor as well as PG into a fine mist, which is then inhaled.

The reason smoking is considered by many to be more dangerous is due to tar from the smoke and the assorted additives. The problem there is that smoking results in huge tar molecules that the body has some method of ridding itself of (insufficient, as lung cancer studies show. But existent.). Vaping results in much smaller molecules, ones the body can't really purge. So more chemicals penetrate the alveolar wall and enter the body.

Vaping with diacetyl, acetyl propionol, and acetoin free flavors, either with no PG or kept to a voltage of ~4.8 volts or less with PG, is very safe. It is also very rare.
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post #148 of 371
Well, from reading this I order my ol'lady and I each a Kanger EVOD Starter Kit. Can't wait to test it out. Should be here before Friday. If I like it I'll also look into making my own juice.
     
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post #149 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7akata View Post

Wasn't there an article a while ago about vape containing some absurd amount of more tar or nicotine (Sorry not a smoker don't know the correct terms lol) than a cigarette, or was that a fallacy. While I'm glad I see a lot less people smoking now then when I did growing up, it's ultimatley your decision. You can do whatever you want, just don't blow it on me biggrin.gif
it was about carcinogens and it was quickly debunked based on how they did the test.
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post #150 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mhill2029 View Post

Wondered how long it would be before they found something regarding E-Cigs. Although what does puzzle me is those people that have never smoked in their lives and use E-Cigs because it's a trendy. Morons...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chakravant View Post

Smoking involves lighting heavily additive laden tobacco on fire and inhaling the fumes.

Vaping vaporizes liquid nicotine and usually diacetyl laden flavor as well as PG into a fine mist, which is then inhaled.

The reason smoking is considered by many to be more dangerous is due to tar from the smoke and the assorted additives. The problem there is that smoking results in huge tar molecules that the body has some method of ridding itself of (insufficient, as lung cancer studies show. But existent.). Vaping results in much smaller molecules, ones the body can't really purge. So more chemicals penetrate the alveolar wall and enter the body.

Vaping with diacetyl, acetyl propionol, and acetoin free flavors, either with no PG or kept to a voltage of ~4.8 volts or less with PG, is very safe. It is also very rare.

Most flavor aren't DIACETYL laden

Voltage is irrelevant. Power to wick saturation is relevant.
     
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