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[Ars] E-cigs shut down hundreds of immune system genes—regular cigs don’t - Page 9  

post #81 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Locc View Post

No the body was not designed to "tolerate" the pollution and destructive forces that we have created in this world lol. Everyone is living to die, you live and then you die that is reality pure and simple. We are all headed the same place death, its what we do with our lives that is important.

All I am saying is that you cannot have one without the other. Vaping is no worse than High Fructose Corn syrup or MSG or any of the number of other poisons you and I both stick in our bodies every single day. Mankind is self destructive 90% of what we do is bad for us we do it anyway.

If you want to live in a fantasy land that you are living healthy because you do not smoke and the world around you isnt killing you well then be my guess however reality is that is a fantasy.

To be clear I am not justifying smoking and of course taking as few risks as possible is always best. I am just saying if you think the air you breath is not poisoning you with every breath you take well you are sadly mistaking.

Yeah cause eating foods high in High Fructose Corn syrup or MSGs on a frequent basis is good for you either? As it is not, and one of the leading causes of obesity. Which too is like signing a good chunk of your life away. As that is pretty much the equivalent of vaping. One way or another, you are doing your body harm. And not just a little. Being slightly more healthy does not make it much better than puffing the real thing. Vaping if anything is more about cost effectiveness over time. And Don't think for a second the companies that make them don't have an agenda to keep people from using them. wink.gif You can label stuff anything you want, but they are just a modern cigarette.


Personally if people really want to continue lining the pockets of franchise that do nothing more than make a profit by making people less healthy. Go ahead. But I for one would rather push for a better world, than one where people go "sigh, do what you want" As that attitude doesn't help. And the best way to quit, is cold turkey. If serious drug users can do it, so can a smoker.




As for the ADD thing, It is called Adderall. I took it for over a decade, it works. And really the best thing to use if you got it. Pretty much as close to a drug like NZT you can get.


Vaping should only be used as a stop gate, nothing more. And should not be relied upon for usage for years to come. The Idea is to quit smoking, not jump on another corporations bandwagon.
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post #82 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfssFang View Post

Wish I could give you a high five. This is one of the main reason why I vape. For the longest time that I can remember I have always chewed on my fingers. It might be from anxiety or maybe because I always need to keep myself busy doing something. Now instead of chewing/eating myself i just pick up my vape.
this has been known for cinnamon and butter products. Go into any reputable vape shop and I highly doubt they offer any of those flavors. You would be surprised how fast shops react health problems found in flavoring.

You'd be surprised many name brand juices still use flavorings containing small amounts of Diaceytl (however read below)
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFPS View Post

It's a fact. The flavors give you pop corn lung.
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/story?id=3565670

As the post I quote below mentions. You are refering to Diaceytl.

Oddly enough cigarettes also produce Diacytl, and in greater quantity than e-juice
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyber Locc View Post

Please Please dont quote those crazy and very misinformed news articles as fact....

However you are semi right, Some flavors can give you popcorn lung over a long period of time. The flavors that do so contain Diacetyl, which not many flavors do at all. That is waht causes popcorn lung, it is what is used to make the butter flavor in popcorn and also in Ejuice. The only flavors affected are those with butter accents which again there is not many, furthermore it took workers many years of inhaling that stuff daily all day long to develop popcorn lung. So yes if you vape custard as your only vape in 20 years you could develop popcorn lung.


I agree, this was what was funny about the heavy metal article and fox 10 put out. Then 2 days later a scientist came out and said ya yall are dumb. The amount of "heavy metals" they found, are very low in comparison. He showed how much they claimed from a vape hit then showed how much you get for every breath you take in LA and it was about 10 times more just by breathing in Los Angeles.
.

most good cake flavors, custards, creams contain Diaceytl. also many fruit flavors get a dash of cream to mellow out the perfumey flavor that many fruit flavorings use.

But again. you get more from smoking real cigarettes.

I've read E-Juice is 750 timees less, but who knows how true that is.
     
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post #83 of 371
The people putting diacetyl in their products should be rounded up and sent off to a gulag where they can't harm society anymore. After reading this thread I went and looked up info about popcorn lung and diacetyl. Anyone still using diacetyl in their product is obviously a sociopath. ESPECIALLY when that product is going to be inhaled. It's like they're deliberately trying to harm consumers.

On topic... I don't think much of any addict, and vape users are no different.
post #84 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfssFang View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by HowHardCanItBe View Post

Science is forever changing, but it's the closest thing to the truth.
How do we know? They dont state what flavor is used nor what method they used to create the flavor. Not to long ago there was a study that said vaping produces the same amount of carcinogens as cigs. However the way they were testing it was in no way anyone would vape. They used a VERY old and outdated atomizer while throwing a ton of volts into it. If you would run the volts they did you would burn the cotton and get a horrible taste.

Anything that you smoke into your lungs can't be good for you, period. There doesn't need a research paper to tell you this. Of course, this is a little safer than traditional smoking is with the crap they put into cigarettes, however, you are still breathing in toxic fumes to get a high. Even the air we breathe right now has small particles of harmful chemicals but in very small concentration.
post #85 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by PappaSmurfsHarem View Post

You'd be surprised many name brand juices still use flavorings containing small amounts of Diaceytl (however read below)
As the post I quote below mentions. You are refering to Diaceytl.

Oddly enough cigarettes also produce Diacytl, and in greater quantity than e-juice
most good cake flavors, custards, creams contain Diaceytl. also many fruit flavors get a dash of cream to mellow out the perfumey flavor that many fruit flavorings use.

But again. you get more from smoking real cigarettes.

I've read E-Juice is 750 timees less, but who knows how true that is.

That assumes that the cream flavoring you use uses diacetyl not all of it does. And ya I am sure other flavors may use Diaceytl and god knows what else and that is why I diy. When you DIY you get more control plus most flavorings (well flavoring companies) do list if they have Diaceytl and other chemicals that are less than ideal for vaping.
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post #86 of 371
A study commissioned by Philip Morris and B.A.T due declining sales lachen.gif

No really you probably shouldn´t inhale anything, however I´m pretty sure you cannot put anything more toxic into your liquids than the cigarettes contain. Especially if you make your own liquids, like I do.
post #87 of 371
Watch the insults please. Just because someone smokes, doesn't mean it gives people the right to pass insults.
post #88 of 371
If the study was government funded, the results would make sense. Overall tobacco tax has been down on average of 12 billion US annual since 2008. I seriously doubt health concerns are their top priority with vaping.
    
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post #89 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

Yeah cause eating foods high in High Fructose Corn syrup or MSGs on a frequent basis is good for you either? As it is not, and one of the leading causes of obesity. Which too is like signing a good chunk of your life away. As that is pretty much the equivalent of vaping. One way or another, you are doing your body harm.

I am confused by this, I stated that HFCS and MSG was bad for you. Your statement seems to imply I do not think it is???
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

Being slightly more healthy does not make it much better than puffing the real thing. Vaping if anything is more about cost effectiveness over time. And Don't think for a second the companies that make them don't have an agenda to keep people from using them. wink.gif You can label stuff anything you want, but they are just a modern cigarette.

Personally if people really want to continue lining the pockets of franchise that do nothing more than make a profit by making people less healthy. Go ahead. But I for one would rather push for a better world, than one where people go "sigh, do what you want" As that attitude doesn't help. And the best way to quit, is cold turkey. If serious drug users can do it, so can a smoker.

It makes it a lot better as some people myself included still like to smoke, that is our prerogative and a healthier way to that is ideal. Vaping is about being safer, not cost effective, vaping is not cost effective lol. Sure it is if you use some Chinese juice and a EGO battery which sucks and will last a week or 2 then break. If you want to get a real vape and vape good juice the price skyrockets. Suicide bunny Ejuice for instance thats 25 dollars for 30mls ya I can vape that in a day lol compared to a pack of cigs at 9 dollars.

Ya but they really are not like a modern cig, As I stated before and maybe you missed it in most juice the main ingredient is Propeylne Glycol, guess what hospitals vaporizer into there air all day every day? Propeylne Glycol as it is a anti Microbial that is non toxic and been proven safe for inhalation, again the flavors are the concern not the Nic, not the PG or VG.

Its not a matter of not being able to quit its that for me I do not want to, It helps me and I like it enough said. As far as the cold turkey thing youa re right I am one of those people. I was a hard drug addict for a lot of my adolescents, I quit cold turkey when I decided enough was enough haven't even thought about it sense.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

As for the ADD thing, It is called Adderall. I took it for over a decade, it works. And really the best thing to use if you got it. Pretty much as close to a drug like NZT you can get.
Okay so now its not okay for me to poison myself with Nicotine but it is okay for a doctor to poisons me with Adderall which is legal speed? Fun Fact Adderall can be used to make the hard drug I was once addicted to, it can be the main ingredient in that famous street drug. So okay lets not vape lets take legal speed instead great advice I will pass thanks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

Kinda sad people are trying to justify smoking vaps. If you do, continue to do so. We don't need to hear about it, but in no way shape or form should it be a "Its OK to do" type of statement. As really these are the things we should be teaching young kids to avoid. As getting locked into a nasty and immature habit is nothing but a joke.
There is a reason why Bars, Hotels, Restaurants, pretty much every public places has banned cigarettes. They smell like crap, and the smoke is not enjoyable to be around. Which is why smokers have to be so far from pubic entry ways as well, when they are outside. I find the smell horrible myself. Honestly how would you like to walk around smelling like cat piss? Even if you did not smell it yourself? While others so. Trust me, the smell of smoke is not far off. It's not the 50s anymore, smoking is on the way out. For good reasons. And as someone that has a parent that smokes, he gets harassed by the entire family about it constantly. Can't smoke in the house, and is being forced to try and quit. Probably not a good thing if everyone in your life agrees that it is not.

Honestly people who smoke in their house have the nastiest smelling homes. Same with their car. I almost would prefer the smell of cat piss. tongue.gif

Umm you put yourself in a position to here about it, its pretty clear what the thread is about and yet you came here anyway subjecting yourself to hearing about it. No one is saying its okay to do either, however it is healthier than actual cigs and a whole lot better than the alcohol that everyone in our society seems to accept as "Okay" or the Caffeine, Sugar, HFCS, Pharmaceutical drugs alot of which are the exact same as drugs that are illegal, but your doc gave it to you so its okay, Do I really need to go on because I can for days.

the "War on Vapes" is pretty absurd there is plenty of other things opn the market that are way worse for you that people deem okay. Lets go by 2 huge ones right here, Percocet is a legal version of a popular street drug and both of which destroy lives. Adderall is also a legal version of a street drug that claims many lives, but hey the doc gives it to you so its okay, well no it really isn't...............
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlantida View Post

If the study was government funded, the results would make sense. Overall tobacco tax has been down on average of 12 billion US annual since 2008. I seriously doubt health concerns are their top priority with vaping.

Of there is a lot more people than that, that stand to lose a whole lot of money due to big tobacco fails. The Goverment with taxes of course, Law firms for cases of theres, Big Pharma for "curing" and "treating" as well as anti smoking pacthes, gum, pills ect. Even the ones that claim to hate smoking like the American Lung Cancer Association, not profit or not that is still a multi million dollar organization that stands to lose everything with big Tobacco closing shop.

The war on vaping has nothing to due with vaping being bad, and everything to do with it stands to tear down one of the biggest most powerful groups of corporations in the world. The president of the US doesn't even have close the power of Phillip Morris CEO lol.

Anyway its been fun guys but this thread is not going to be productive that much is clear, and this really isn't what I come to OCN for. So have a great day guys and see you around smile.gif.
Edited by Cyber Locc - 2/13/16 at 11:15pm
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post #90 of 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by cookieboyeli View Post

Vaping "vapor" is even less annoying, in fact it barely has a lingering odor at all. That's because it's vaporizing the particles instead of spreading them around, particles are what you smell.

Particles are also much more harmful for your lungs, so IMO if you're not going to try to quit or pretend you like it or something, get an e-cigarette instead. Your immune system will have less to deal with because your lungs won't be damaged, that right there may make up for the extra genes that are depressed either entirely or partially. It's a big difference though.

Now you're just making up stories... Vaporizing produces as much or more particles than smoking. The particle detector on my HEPA filter tells me so by jumping to full power almost instantly when it detects vapor... with tobacco smoke, it goes to medium then high after a minute or so. Vaping causes it to trigger instantly. Tobacco smoke produces tar that sticks to everything, vaping doesn't have that.

So yeah, I believe that vaping is less directly harmful to your lungs than cigarettes due to not coating your villi with tar, so you'll likely breathe better, not cough up as much junk, but it's still possible that vaping is just as dangerous in other ways.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, as the saying goes. It needs to be further researched, IMO.
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