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[Ars] France says Facebook must face French law in nudity censorship case - Page 7

post #61 of 86
Can you refuse service without reason? Doesnt that imply your reason is of less worth than a reason you would have told them you were going to refuse them (the user)?
post #62 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by STEvil View Post

Can you refuse service without reason? Doesnt that imply your reason is of less worth than a reason you would have told them you were going to refuse them (the user)?

I think the legal logic is that laws tend to prohibit specific behaviors, not general, so if you don't give a reason, then the complainant has to first prove what the reason for your refusal is, where as if you provide a reason yourself, all they have to do is prove that your reason is prohibited.
post #63 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post

I didn't say that your stance changed, I said that you shifted your focus to argue something else compared to your first post.

Also I made an edit to my previous post to correct you, it's three sources that are less than fives years old, not one.

Also, again, you were the one overinflating things to the surreal point of putting in quotation marks things that I didn't say.

But things are not as rosy as you seem to make them out either. Let's not pretend that companies are saints because they will try to get away with what they can whenever they can.

You'd think that there was a reason and that such laws don't come out of thin air.

In the article above none other than nineteen companies with non-disparagement clauses are listed.

No sir, no shift. I made the case in my first post and expanded on it...It's always been there. Hasn't changed.

Just a note to the grammatically out of tune, which apparently I now have to ELY5 - When someone does "this", grammatically, it can often be used as paraphrasing - Which it very clearly, was. You weren't being quoted, I was paraphrasing your conjecture into the quotations - I was actually objectifying it...Just saying.

The underlined is also a horrible assumption to make considering it's not true - It's your opinion, not a fact.

Wow, 19? Out of how many EULAs? - I'll tell you how many, a pittance.

Also, the CPA exists for a reason and would never allow those companies to charge you, regardless - It's a violation of 5/6 laws within the consumer protection act, itself.

Europe has similar acts.

You act as if the criminal regime is out to screw us all when the reality is, if any of these companies attempted to actually bully the consumer, anywhere a EULA actually mattered, all they need is to call the CPA and the company that wrote the EULA gets boned into oblivion...So yes, the disparity between what you claim and the reality of the situation might as well be as large as the Mariana trench.
post #64 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

I'm still confused as to how FB users are considered consumers in the first place and therefore how "consumer protection laws" apply to them at all? I mean, FB profiles are free and nobody is losing anything they paid for by having their profiles suspended or deleted. How can ANY government force FB to provide a person with a FB account?

It's a free speech lawsuit, it's not about seller/customer relationship.
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post #65 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scars Unseen View Post

I think the legal logic is that laws tend to prohibit specific behaviors, not general, so if you don't give a reason, then the complainant has to first prove what the reason for your refusal is, where as if you provide a reason yourself, all they have to do is prove that your reason is prohibited.

Not giving a reason leaves you more vulnerable than giving one, unless your reason would not hold up. If you don't provide a reason, the reason gets left up to someones imagination and you will end up defending yourself against that accusation. If you weren't honest enough to give your reason up front, it will be hard to prove you are being honest about it after the fact.
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post #66 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjdubb View Post

Not giving a reason leaves you more vulnerable than giving one, unless your reason would not hold up. If you don't provide a reason, the reason gets left up to someones imagination and you will end up defending yourself against that accusation. If you weren't honest enough to give your reason up front, it will be hard to prove you are being honest about it after the fact.

Actually, not true and Postal Twinkie pointed this out earlier.

They don't have to give you a reason. They have the legal "authority" under the EULA just to straight out deny your service. It's on you to appeal.

Giving a reason, actually gave them the fuel to take it this far because the reason, itself was a violation of French law.

Had Facebook just denied the request without a specific reason - They'd be fine and in the clear.

Imagination isn't law. Providing a reason, shifts the onus.
Edited by Masked - 2/16/16 at 7:37am
post #67 of 86
It's a shame businesses always act in the manner with the most financial benefit because I would love to see Facebook deny it's service to all French citizens as a result of this ruling. That would be hilarious.
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post #68 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinaryDemon View Post

It's a shame businesses always act in the manner with the most financial benefit because I would love to see Facebook deny it's service to all French citizens as a result of this ruling. That would be hilarious.

Also in a way rather than penalizing the citizens it would enrich their lives without the need for such a worthless, mostly narcissistic time waste.
post #69 of 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinaryDemon View Post

It's a shame businesses always act in the manner with the most financial benefit because I would love to see Facebook deny it's service to all French citizens as a result of this ruling. That would be hilarious.

That's how you stay in business. It would be a really stupid move to cut out 20 million plus users out of spite. I find it odd that people are siding with facebook on this, over reaching terms of service are a problem we all face. I think people are looking at this as a case of someone getting butthurt about having a facebook account suspended instead of a fight against excessive TOS clauses.
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post #70 of 86
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Originally Posted by bigjdubb View Post

That's how you stay in business. It would be a really stupid move to cut out 20 million plus users out of spite. I find it odd that people are siding with facebook on this, over reaching terms of service are a problem we all face. I think people are looking at this as a case of someone getting butthurt about having a facebook account suspended instead of a fight against excessive TOS clauses.

I don't see this case as a good test of either 1st amendment rights or EULA/TOS agreements. For a moment consider what would happen if I changed my OCN avatar to an artistic drawing or photograph of a vagina. What would happen? I'd get banned for violating the user agreement. Would all of you rally behind my right to free speech? Sorry but some common sense must prevail... Like FB, OCN is not a service I pay for or an entitled right.
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