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Fiji Bios Editing ( Fury / Fury X / Nano / Radeon Pro Duo ) - Page 84

post #831 of 1774
Quote:
Originally Posted by gupsterg View Post

Fellow members I would like to discuss HBM clocking smile.gif .

So basically when I got my Fiji cards I noted AMD Matt had stated on a few forums that HBM clocks in discreet steps, 500.00/545.45/600.00/666.66MHz. Now bear in mind this guy is involved with AMD and also that he has no reason to share misinformation. I was surprised by this information, as when HBM overclocking became available in MSI AB, the slider would not increment in such steps as AMD Matt had posted about.

Basically HBM overclocking via MSI AB (other OC tools) will not increment in steps as it has no knowledge how HBM increments.

Next let's look at OverDrive page, the slider for HBM clock became available through bios mod, again OverDrive has no knowledge how HBM increments. If you install older Catalyst driver it will increment in 1MHz steps, with Crimison drivers it will increment in 5MHz steps.

Next VRAM_Info, this section sets up the HBM RAM. In that section we can see there are 100MHz, 400MHz, 500MHz and 600MHz straps/timings, this information is not again solid proof how HBM steps.

So basically for months viewing at all of above I was confused what is going with HBM wth.gif . 3DM13 had been the most sensitive benchmark on Hawaii for RAM tweaks, so I used it on Fiji as well. Now as HBM performance scaling was so small, it become difficult to use this bench data to categorically say how HBM clocks.

Then I thought stability testing is the answer, like highlighted in my previous posts I had assessed 1135/535 was stable for:-

i) lengthy f@h runs (12hrs+).
ii) 3DM13/Heaven/Valley each looped for over 1hrs each.
iii) general gaming.

Where as 540MHz or 540MHz was creating issues.

Then one day whilst running f@h my 1135 (+31mV) / 535 (+0mV) was failing in f@h sadsmiley.gif, I lowered HBM to 525MHz, which still did not solve the "bad state" in GPU slot. Finally only using 500MHz HBM clock solved the issue, I tested then ~ 60hrs f@h with 1135 (+31mV) / 500 (+0mV), to me this meant GPU OC was fine and HBM OC is the issue. This also meant my idea to test HBM clocking steps by stability testing was a flop doh.gif .

Due to all the wasted time testing HBM OC and lack of performance gain from it I thought just tweak lowering MVDDC below stock whilst being at 500MHz. This exercise showed that 1.2V @ 500MHz is not stable for all uses I had for GPU, ~1.263V was. This again was confusing and a setback IMO thinking.gif . SK Hynix state 1.2V, AMD state 1.3V, I can only conclude from this testing that HBM 1 due to perhaps production variation requires 1.3V.

So after failing to successfully OC HBM with full stability and under volting at stock clock I was no closer to knowing how the steps of HBM clocking were headscratch.gif. Whilst going over past data I came across an AIDA64 GPGPU benchmark which I had done on Fiji, this to me seemed like the EUREKA moment biggrin.gif.

HBM Clock/stepping testing (Click to show)
AMD Fury X 107 ROM used, only mods were:-

i) HBM clock set to 100MHz in PowerPlay.
ii) OD RAM Limit raised to 600MHz so HBM OC'ing available without using "Extend Official Overclocking Limit" in MSI AB.
iii) MVDDC set to 1.325V for testing upto HBM 600MHz.

Note: Due to my i5 rig running stability testing of Fury X No 2 @ 1135/545 I used my Q6600 rig for testing. I will update data ASAP, excluding Memory Read / Write all other bench data is spot on with i5+Fury X run done in the past.

HBM 100MHz (Click to show)

HBM 400MHz (Click to show)

HBM 500MHz (Click to show)

HBM 520MHz (Click to show)

HBM 535MHz (Click to show)

HBM 545MHz (Click to show)

HBM 565MHz (Click to show)

HBM 575MHz (Click to show)

HBM 600MHz (Click to show)


Basically 100MHz vs 400MHz huge difference, then there is large difference between 400MHz vs 500MHz. 520MHz is clocking at 500MHz. 535MHz is clocking at 545MHz and so did 565MHz. 575MHz is clocking to 600MHz and so did 630MHz (due to time limit ran 1 run, thus no screenie). I increased HBM voltage upto 1.35V to test 666MHz but as soon as bench started I got artifact on screen.

So viewing the data above I can see now why 535MHz and 525MHz was failing stability testing recently, I can only conclude why 545MHz and 540MHz artifact quicker in stability testing is due to possibly HBM clock getting close to correct step thus aspects we're unaware of concerning HBM/MC coming into play.

On the i5+Fury X rig I have been testing for just over 61.5hrs continuously using f@h to get 1135/545 stable. Initially I set HBM voltage stock and over a 22.5hr run GPU entered "bad state" twice and did not lose a work unit. So then I upped HBM voltage by +6.25mV, within 12hrs I had 1x bad state. I then increased HBM voltage to +12.5mV, within 5hrs 1x bad state, so then I went +18.75mV so far passed 22hrs f@h and going biggrin.gif . I'm gonna let this card fold until at least another 9hrs wink.gif .

I hope members will share data on AIDA64 GPGPU benchmark for HBM clocks testing.
amazing research.. How do you set the hbm voltage manually?
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post #832 of 1774
Quote:
Originally Posted by gupsterg View Post

+rep for your confirmation wink.gif .

I agree it is weird biggrin.gif .

I did not have time to test between 100MHz & 400MHz, may do when have time, but probably no use wink.gif .

I now think peeps will be grabbing my MVDDC ROMs wink.gif , if they need extra juice biggrin.gif .

I'm hoping now I can finally test 400MHz timings in 500MHz/600MHz strap making 545MHz hopefully perform better smile.gif .

I am also down for share research to help push our cards further lol.

Oh and how do you plan on testing 400Mhz timings with a higher strap, I feel like I am missing something haha. Anyways I will do more when I have more time but this is my results at 600Mhz

post #833 of 1774
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JunkaDK View Post

amazing research.. How do you set the hbm voltage manually?

HBM voltage can only be set via ROM at present, there is a software method (posted demo in this thread before, without the method). Unwinder (author of MSI AB) highlighted the software method I was using was "unsafe". As I was commanding the VRM chip via i2c command through MSI AB. He has highlighted AMD has said due to SMC on Fiji, software should message it for changes. I tried what I thought would be appropriate SMC message via MSI AB to manipulate MVDDC but it did not work.

As you have a Strix which doesn't have dual bios (AFAIK) I have not placed VDDC/MVDDC offset ROM in OP, currently there is only AMD ref PCB Fury / Fury X / Nano ROMs in OP, will be adding Radeon Pro Duo (just been busy redface.gif ).

I'm willing to give a Strix card owner an offset ROM but by PM at present.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowxaero View Post

I am also down for share research to help push our cards further lol.

Oh and how do you plan on testing 400Mhz timings with a higher strap, I feel like I am missing something haha. Anyways I will do more when I have more time but this is my results at 600Mhz
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Thank you for viewing and participating smile.gif .

What I need is some test results at various HBM clocks by other members wink.gif , say 500MHz / 520MHz / 535MHz / 545MHz / 565MHz / 575MHz / 600MHz.

How we can test 400MHz strap timings is by copying them and overwriting them in 500MHz & 600MHz strap wink.gif , this is my preferred method at present, there is another method.

I have tested this mod before, IIRC performance scaling was low, but at the time I wasn't sticking to correct HBM clock step (ie 500/545/600). So may well have been just run to run variance we see in 3DM FS. I had shelved this mod until I had reached conclusion how HBM is clocking plus I needed to know if I can gain a long term stable HBM clock, before throwing tighter timings into testing.

On another note 1135/545 has reached over ~25hrs continuous f@h "bad state" free on CPU / GPU slots biggrin.gif (PPD low as hit low scoring unit rolleyes.gif ) .





fh_log.txt 112k .txt file


PC has not been off for over 65hrs smile.gif , UK weather has been great past few days, seeing temps of 27C daytime and 21C nighttime (~12am) on room temp monitor.
Edited by gupsterg - 6/9/16 at 9:14am
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post #834 of 1774
So now that we have HBM clocking sorted. Now we need to reveal the mystery behind negative scaling.
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post #835 of 1774
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alastair View Post

So now that we have HBM clocking sorted. Now we need to reveal the mystery behind negative scaling.

That's the one I'm waiting on tongue.gif

My Fury could hit over 1200 core if I can give it enough voltage smile.gif
 
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post #836 of 1774
Quote:
Originally Posted by gupsterg View Post

Thank you for viewing and participating smile.gif .

What I need is some test results at various HBM clocks by other members wink.gif , say 500MHz / 520MHz / 535MHz / 545MHz / 565MHz / 575MHz / 600MHz.

How we can test 400MHz strap timings is by copying them and overwriting them in 500MHz & 600MHz strap wink.gif , this is my preferred method at present, there is another method.

I have tested this mod before, IIRC performance scaling was low, but at the time I wasn't sticking to correct HBM clock step (ie 500/545/600). So may well have been just run to run variance we see in 3DM FS. I had shelved this mod until I had reached conclusion how HBM is clocking plus I needed to know if I can gain a long term stable HBM clock, before throwing tighter timings into testing.

On another note 1135/545 has reached over ~25hrs continuous f@h "bad state" free on CPU / GPU slots biggrin.gif (PPD low as hit low scoring unit rolleyes.gif ) .





fh_log.txt 112k .txt file


PC has not been off for over 65hrs smile.gif , UK weather has been great past few days, seeing temps of 27C daytime and 21C nighttime (~12am) on room temp monitor.

Okay so I have below 500, 520, 535, 545, 565, 570, 575, and 600Mhz. Also the results from 570 look a bit strange to me, but what do you think?





post #837 of 1774
Thread Starter 
@Alastair @sgt bilko

This is tricky redface.gif .
Viewpoint on AIB/AMD regarding OC negative scaling (Click to show)
I know Alastair you posted you've contacted Sapphire / AMD about it. I don't think anything will come of it. As we know OC ability is not guaranteed by anyone. Next AMD have no voltage control as part of OverDrive, so what occurs with added voltage is really not their "thing" IMO. I've never read the disclaimer/terms we accept to enable OverDrive, but it probably does not guarantee OC ability either I would think. MSI AB, Sapphire TriXX, etc even though having AIB branding/support,etc, again does not have any guarantee what it will achieve for an end users card. We can probably all add to this more, but I think this covers it.
Viewpoint from my cards and member shares / misc info (Click to show)
My testing method has been kept a bit limited for comparing between cards 1x Fury Tri-X + 6x Fury X). I have not given more than +50mV to a card, on occasions have gone for higher clocks with that offset for 1150 to 1175. These tests were bench stable and artifact free, I've noted one card may scale with clocks above 1150 and another not, I won't present this data as it's just basically "off the cuff" tests.

The cards which seem to scale above 1150 are ones which I would deem higher ASIC quality. I could not get the rating for few cards as no apps supported it at the time and they got disposed of. How I deemed they were higher ASIC quality was using info The Stilt has posted about Hawaii. ie higher power draw = higher LeakageID = lower DPM 7 VID = higher ASIC quality. One such Fury X had 1.187V DPM 7 VID, within a week it could not sustain the OC that had been tested initially in first few days. Some of these cards don't get powered down when their in my rigs.

Having had all these cards/some data, as soon as ASIC quality rating become available, I noted something on 2 cards which were performing "iffy" on OC'ing, see this post.

Now sample 6 Fiji (Fury X) was basically pulled from the rig within a day, it was showing OK stability holding an OC for 3D loads but couldn't run f@h even at stock IIRC (will check data). I replaced it with sample 7 Fiji (Fury X), this run f@h in same rig for over 24hrs+ at stock. It also managed 1100MHz at stock VID (IIRC) but 1115MHz with upto +18mV was not stable for over 12hrs, will be getting back to testing it further soon.

Getting back to higher ASIC quality (where it is not "bad" ASIC IMO), loosely speaking members which are posting data in the several threads I participate seem to have more headroom on voltage application without negative performance scaling. I can not see how we can make say a lower ASIC quality appear as higher ASIC quality as ROM/driver reads a "fused ID" for leakage from ASIC. This "fused ID" can not be circumvented AFAIK. There are also other properties to GPU which I don't understand and don't have full info.

@shadowxaero

Many thanks for your time and share biggrin.gif , +rep thumb.gif .

570MHz would be setting to 545MHz IMO, it's probably just a very good 545MHz run. Rest of your data is matching what I have seen in mine, soon will stop f@h on i5 rig and test on that. I will compile a table from my Q6600 runs / yours / my i5 runs plus if anyone else supplies data wink.gif .
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post #838 of 1774
Quote:
Originally Posted by gupsterg View Post

@Alastair @sgt bilko

This is tricky redface.gif .
Viewpoint on AIB/AMD regarding OC negative scaling (Click to show)
I know Alastair you posted you've contacted Sapphire / AMD about it. I don't think anything will come of it. As we know OC ability is not guaranteed by anyone. Next AMD have no voltage control as part of OverDrive, so what occurs with added voltage is really not their "thing" IMO. MSI AB, Sapphire TriXX, etc even though having AIB branding/support,etc, again does not have any guarantee what it will achieve for an end users card. We can probably all add to this more, but I think this covers it.
Viewpoint from my cards and member shares / misc info (Click to show)
My testing method has been kept a bit limited for comparing between cards 1x Fury Tri-X + 6x Fury X). I have not given more than +50mV to a card, on occasions have gone for higher clocks with that offset for 1150 to 1175. These tests were bench stable and artifact free, I've noted one card may scale with clocks above 1150 and another not, I won't present this data as it's just basically "off the cuff" tests.

The cards which seem to scale above 1150 are ones which I would deem higher ASIC quality. I could not get the rating for few cards as no apps supported it at the time and they got disposed of. How I deemed they were higher ASIC quality was using info The Stilt has posted about Hawaii. ie higher power draw = higher LeakageID = lower DPM 7 VID = higher ASIC quality. One such Fury X had 1.187V DPM 7 VID, within a week it could not sustain the OC that had been tested initially in first few days. Some of these cards don't get powered down when their in my rigs.

Having had all these cards/some data, as soon as ASIC quality rating become available, I noted something on 2 cards which were performing "iffy" on OC'ing, see this post.

Now sample 6 Fiji (Fury X) was basically pulled from the rig within a day, it was showing OK stability holding an OC for 3D loads but couldn't run f@h even at stock IIRC (will check data). I replaced it with sample 7 Fiji (Fury X), this run f@h in same rig for over 24hrs+ at stock. It also managed 1100MHz at stock VID (IIRC) but 1115MHz with upto +18mV was not stable for over 12hrs, will be getting back to testing it further soon.

Getting back to higher ASIC quality (where it is not "bad" ASIC IMO), loosely speaking members which are posting data in the several threads I participate seem to have more headroom on voltage application without negative performance scaling. I can not see how we can make say a lower ASIC quality appear as higher ASIC quality as ROM/driver reads a "fused ID" for leakage from ASIC. This "fused ID" can not be circumvented AFAIK. There are also other properties to GPU which I don't understand and don't have full info.

@shadowxaero

Many thanks for your time and share biggrin.gif , +rep thumb.gif .

570MHz would be setting to 545MHz IMO, it's probably just a very good 545MHz run. Rest of your data is matching what I have seen in mine, soon will stop f@h on i5 rig and test on that. I will compile a table from my Q6600 runs / yours / my i5 runs plus if anyone else supplies data wink.gif .

I'd be curious if anyone with a Fury Strix or Fury Nitro has had negative scaling because that would rule it down to the core alone and nothing to do with the reference PCB smile.gif

From memory when I had the Nitro it didn't exhibit the negative scaling the same way my XFX Fury or the Fury X does.
 
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post #840 of 1774
-whoops wrong thread- sorry.
Edited by Flamingo - 6/10/16 at 5:05am
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