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[Anand] Ashes of the Singularity Revisited: A Beta Look at DirectX 12 & Asynchronous Shading - Page 39

post #381 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klocek001 View Post

totally agreed, but amd's problem isn't being uncompetitive.

who would choose to drop 1100PLN on 380X (giving you polish prices) if you can have 280X for 900 PLN or a used 7970 for 650 PLN.
same goes for 390/390X (1500PLN/1900PLN respectively) , there are 290/290X available for 1200/1350...........

amd's approach is a curse for their sales

Is that not also a problem for Nvidia?

And damn you guys have it good. Where I live, most new 290s cost as much as a 390. The 290X costs as much as a 390X, I can not find a good deal on a 280X tongue.gif

Also... the GTX 780 TI costs almost as much as a 980 TI. More than a 980, Fury X and a 390X...
Such is life in Bulgaria...
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post #382 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahigan View Post

Based on my experiences, and the backlash I've faced eventhough I was right, I would have to disagree with you on this but from a differing perspective.

Individuals are loyal to their bragging rights. If you somehow diminish the halo surrounding a product they've purchased, they see it as an attack on themselves. On their ego.

I'd say that NVIDIA is a halo brand, like Apple, whose users buy their cards (in the majority a side from hardware enthusiasts) because it's NVIDIA and a GeForce. Not because it is empirically superior.

AMD users, though some exhibit this behavior and particularly in the CPU arena, tend to be more bang for your buck consumers.

I disagree with both of you all. I think a very considerable reason why Nvidia has been dominating thus far is because of ignorance and the Gaming Media preying of such. The so-called Gaming media are shills that receiving FREE $1300 monitors from Nvidia and alot of PC Gamers simply don't know any better.

PC Gaming is primarily word-of-mouth advertisement thus you have to go to other people and ask them about what is the best parts/components for their build; hence, forums. Unfortunately, when asking other people for help/advice you expose yourself to propaganda and misinformation.

For example, alot of PC Gamers don't even know that Async Compute is actually old and always been on the consoles especially from a software perspective. Alot of PC gamers don't know what are white papers.

Granted, people are intellectually lazy; however, people do defer to others for help/advice sort of like when you are driving and get lost.

Remember now, alot of gaming publishers spend more money on MARKETING than actual DEVELOPING; hence, these shills are getting paid, indeed.

Then you also got misinformation- people simply don't know what they are talking about. For instance, people saying that Intel's CPU with 4-cores and 8 threads (hyperthreading) is better than AMD's 8-cores CPU especially in regards to CPU-parallelism.

Remember, consoles have been out before the Internet was even created, but PC Gaming is finally starting to make its mark into the Entertainment genre. Alot of PC Gamers don't have a clue what 3dFX and ATI were.
post #383 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charcharo View Post

Is that not also a problem for Nvidia?

And damn you guys have it good. Where I live, most new 290s cost as much as a 390. The 290X costs as much as a 390X, I can not find a good deal on a 280X tongue.gif

Also... the GTX 780 TI costs almost as much as a 980 TI. More than a 980, Fury X and a 390X...
Such is life in Bulgaria...

like I said, bringing price into discussion on ocn is tricky, prices tend to vary.

here new 780Ti's are cheaper than 390X's (only slightly), but used ones are about the same price as new 290X's. The one here (Galaxy 780Ti HoF with a WB) is 1330 PLN, less than a new 970.




I think we have a good ratio between tiers, but the cards are expensive nevertheless. A new 980Ti's cost is twice the minimum monthly salary here. "Enthusiast rigs" in Poland usually have 290/2500K type of specs.
post #384 of 1175
Same here. I live in PC Gaming Land (do we even have console gamers? I know none) where people seem to generally understand gaming to a great deal. At least from personal experience.
Yet my (admittedly not bad) rig is basically one of the highest end ones I know of.

A GTX 980 TI costs twice the average monthly salary (before tax) and 4 times the minimum. So does... a 780 TI.

On the other hand the Fury X is almost as "cheap" as a 980. However the R7 370 costs more than a GTX 950... bonkers tongue.gif !
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post #385 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahigan View Post

Based on my experiences, and the backlash I've faced eventhough I was right, I would have to disagree with you on this but from a differing perspective.

Individuals are loyal to their bragging rights. If you somehow diminish the halo surrounding a product they've purchased, they see it as an attack on themselves. On their ego.

I'd say that NVIDIA is a halo brand, like Apple, whose users buy their cards (in the majority a side from hardware enthusiasts) because it's NVIDIA and a GeForce. Not because it is empirically superior.

AMD users, though some exhibit this behavior and particularly in the CPU arena, tend to be more bang for your buck consumers.
The public want to buy a product that works at the time they buy it. Nvidia notice this and capitalize it.

it is only AMD recent driver revision, async compute & DX12 that able to bring up AMD performance. Nobody talk about these benefit 1-2yrs ago.

Beside if u throw in power consumption into the mix, thats already giving negative value to AMD, which the public will weighted value against AMD too. (not that I care about the power consumption, but many might). Besides if u have 2 similar products, the one that consume more power is going to worth lesser.

So dont just go assume that the majority are soo stupid enough to believe just a "halo" marketing the Nvidia create. It is obviously AMD didnt do enough on their product to match up Nvidia complete package.
Edited by Clocknut - 2/28/16 at 2:20am
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post #386 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clocknut View Post

The public want to buy a product that works at the time they buy it. Nvidia notice this and capitalize it.

it is only AMD recent driver revision, async compute & DX12 that able to bring up AMD performance. Nobody talk about these benefit 1-2yrs ago.

Beside if u throw in power consumption into the mix, thats already giving negative value to AMD, which the public will weighted value against AMD too. (not that I care about the power consumption, but many might). Besides if u have 2 similar products, the one that consume more power is going to worth lesser.

So dont just go assume that the majority are soo stupid enough to believe just a "halo" marketing the Nvidia create. It is obviously AMD didnt do enough on their product to match up Nvidia complete package.

AMD cards works better, meet people when a new game is out and the 970 owners just complains about it.
Grim Dawn in this case.

Mahigan is right.
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post #387 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charcharo View Post

Same here. I live in PC Gaming Land (do we even have console gamers? I know none) where people seem to generally understand gaming to a great deal. At least from personal experience.
Yet my (admittedly not bad) rig is basically one of the highest end ones I know of.

A GTX 980 TI costs twice the average monthly salary (before tax) and 4 times the minimum. So does... a 780 TI.

On the other hand the Fury X is almost as "cheap" as a 980. However the R7 370 costs more than a GTX 950... bonkers tongue.gif !
here 980Ti Hybrid = Fury X, 980=390X price wise. But make no mistake, this is doesn't man nvidia is cheap here.
something happened to amd's prices after r9 3xx "refresh" thumbsdownsmileyanim.gif
290 was 1250 pln, 290x was 1500-1600 for 4GB and 1800 for 8GB
now 390 is 1500pln and 390x is 1900pln.
fury (air cooled) launched for as much as reference 980Ti's, (2700-2800 pln) making it a lot more expensive than 980.
Edited by Klocek001 - 2/28/16 at 2:58am
post #388 of 1175
I just go with gut feeling when making a purchase, but then again I don't upgrade every generation. The best "feeling" in this hobby for me is buying the big-fat die of an architecture. 580 and Titan X are such dies, between Fury X and 980Ti I'd buy the Fury X simply because it's a full chip and the TX costs twice. Everyone has their reasoning.
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post #389 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clocknut View Post

Beside if u throw in power consumption into the mix, thats already giving negative value to AMD, which the public will weighted value against AMD too. (not that I care about the power consumption, but many might). Besides if u have 2 similar products, the one that consume more power is going to worth lesser.[/B]

This myth that nVidia cards are always more efficient than AMD cards needs to die.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-radeon-r9-fury-x,4196-7.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti,4164-7.html

It's only under maximum load that nVidia cards are superior and even the most hardcore gamer won't achieve that a majority of the time. Now I don't care about power consumption because here in America energy in plentiful and cheap, but that's not the case everywhere and if that's going to be a selling point then let's put the true facts out there.
post #390 of 1175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fyrwulf View Post

This myth that nVidia cards are always more efficient than AMD cards needs to die.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-radeon-r9-fury-x,4196-7.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980-ti,4164-7.html

It's only under maximum load that nVidia cards are superior and even the most hardcore gamer won't achieve that a majority of the time. Now I don't care about power consumption because here in America energy in plentiful and cheap, but that's not the case everywhere and if that's going to be a selling point then let's put the true facts out there.

Well you look at a Nano and suddenly the whole concept of efficient changes face.
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