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[DT] PS4 More Efficient Than PCs At Running Virtual Reality - Page 6

post #51 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by CryphicKing View Post

Some footage of "PS3 level polygon" games from PSVR exclusives

Yet , eye valkyrie, the most "visually intensive experience" on PC VR with at least $1800+ invested in hardware is a multiplat, along with a brunch dated, released games from 2013-2015, except with VR support, I don't think anyone needs to think twice about which one looks like PS3 level polycount

I might end up getting both HTC Hive and PSVR, but if I'm force to bet my money on one device to determinate VR gaming's future, that would be the platform with most convincing games and most supporttive ecosystem, which is to say PSVR.

You posted a bunch of CGI trailers.. While i wouldn't say PS3 level, if you look at actual gameplay of RIGS, it isn't far from it. London Heist looks pretty good visually, but it was barely able to hit 60fps, let alone hold that framerate. I also don't trust big media saying PSVR doesn't make people nauseous, a lot of YouTubers have complained about PSVR's latency. Visuals are irrelevant if the thing makes people sick.

EVE looks pretty great, but all that's been shown is PC footage, we don't yet know what the PS4 version will look like. At the end of the day it's still a PS4 powering it, it struggles to run visually stunning games at 1080p/30, now we are expecting it to run games at higher resolutions at 90fps.. Why? Because it has a little breakout box that does nothing but use re-projection to boost the framerate? All that does is make the image look smoother, it does nothing to help with the latency. Oculus and Vive want a native 90fps for a reason..

How does PSVR have the most convincing games, care to show us them? Oculus is owned by a company with a lot more cash than Sony, I'm willing to bet they are going to have more exclusives than PSVR. It's not like Sony are going to put all their first party studios on VR games.

PC VR is going to be more than competitive with PSVR when it comes to games, it will blow it out the water when it comes to apps/software, and will be running on far, far more powerful hardware.
post #52 of 99
Of course it's more powerful than a PC at running VR... first off it's version of VR doesn't have to deal with pesky things like "operating system" or "separate graphics ram" and the processor itself runs on GDDR5 ram. Its a monster of a laptop!

The downside to their claims is rather simple tho: it's garbage VR compared to what's coming to PC's soon with the Vive and Oculus Retail. A desktop gaming computer will have 10x the graphical performance of the PS4 in about 3 months and will be doing more detail and texture features as well as custom shaders than a PS4 even has code to handle.
post #53 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

You posted a bunch of CGI trailers.. While i wouldn't say PS3 level, if you look at actual gameplay of RIGS, it isn't far from it. London Heist looks pretty good visually, but it was barely able to hit 60fps, let alone hold that framerate. I also don't trust big media saying PSVR doesn't make people nauseous, a lot of YouTubers have complained about PSVR's latency. Visuals are irrelevant if the thing makes people sick.


How does PSVR have the most convincing games, care to show us them? Oculus is owned by a company with a lot more cash than Sony, I'm willing to bet they are going to have more exclusives than PSVR. It's not like Sony are going to put all their first party studios on VR games.
.

You need to rewatch those trailers again or learn the definition of CGI, because none of them are. Elaborated gameplay trailer with fancy camera angle? yes. CGI? these visuals aren't pretty enough to qualify CGI. beside, Londo heist trailer is completely played by a person.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

EVE looks pretty great, but all that's been shown is PC footage, we don't yet know what the PS4 version will look like. At the end of the day it's still a PS4 powering it, it struggles to run visually stunning games at 1080p/30, now we are expecting it to run games at higher resolutions at 90fps.. Why? Because it has a little breakout box that does nothing but use re-projection to boost the framerate? All that does is make the image look smoother, it does nothing to help with the latency. Oculus and Vive want a native 90fps for a reason..

Without pulling a VR discussion to PC vs console performance thread, I recommend start follow up on PC performance benchmark on recent released titles, as a matter of fact, most PC gamers are having problems to run recent released games at 1080P/30fps at equivalent console present.

Console games are either 30 or 60fps, depend on visual target, but never struggle. as for why PS4 is VR ready? when there's a problem prevent market interest, hardware engineers will be there to find a solution, that's the whole propose of hardware R&D, no end users will care if the final images on headset is refined by re-projecting or upscaled, as long as their eyes perceive great result, the product is going to sell. You really shouldn't worry too much about "how can PS4 do it like PC" when it already can.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

PC VR is going to be more than competitive with PSVR when it comes to games

PC VR such as occluis rift will have many use beside gaming, the ecosystem is very strong and health from users and investors alike, few of my old colleagues were making apps for SDK2 since 2013 and are about to get rich.

But as competitive as PSVR in gaming? maybe not so much. So far the selection of PC VR " games worries me, the only PC VR's gaming support are from indie studios. To make PC VR successful on PC gaming wise, it will depend on publishers like EA, UBI, SQEX etc. yet none of them willing to pull the trigger before VR proves its worth to them. wait till E3 for update if you wish.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

How does PSVR have the most convincing games, care to show us them?

You already saw them but you refuse to remember what you watched or straight up deny the truth, in that case, let me rephrase,

-so far among all VR products, PSVR have most VR dedicated games from every genre I.E games build from ground up aimed to deliver VR only experience. It had ace exclusve every genre which aren't available to PC VR yet.

-PSVR has strongest first party/thrid party developer support,
-Speaking of gaming, PSVR has most massive VR install base(Every PS4 owner is VR ready)

-So far, PSVR seem to offer the best games from all genre both dedicated VR games and VR supported games.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

Because it has a little breakout box that does nothing but use re-projection to boost the framerate? All that does is make the image look smoother, it does nothing to help with the latency. Oculus and Vive want a native 90fps for a reason..

whao~ I didn't know you know PSVR better than SCEA's chef R&D engineer. FYI this re-projecting concept won't even made into production without approved by end users, and they are, in case you don't know it already, every PSVR game will be 60/120 or 90/90 in frame rate and refresh rate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

Oculus is owned by a company with a lot more cash than Sony, I'm willing to bet they are going to have more exclusives than PSVR. It's not like Sony are going to put all their first party studios on VR games.

Very native argument, it's almost laughable, Microsoft is arguable the richest company on earth in term of net assets and cash flow, and it never able to pop more exclusives on their gaming console than the little SECA, just because a company is multi billion dollar worth, doesn't mean the board of directors will blindly spend resource on one of their division, especially when they are not in the same field.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

PC VR is going to be more than competitive with PSVR when it comes to games, it will blow it out the water when it comes to apps/software, and will be running on far, far more powerful hardware.

This argument has no body and legs, show me how the powers are put into any good use while you clearly failed to provide a single decent looking PC VR game? do you even have slightest knowledge on PC&console's development environment? what substance each VR product provided for gaming?

For example, known games from each genre for PSVR and PC VR.
-FPS PSVR: london hesit, rigs vs PC VR??
-Driving PSVR: DirveClub, GT7 sport and PC VR ??? beside multiplats?
-Honor PSVR: until dawn vs PC VR's ????
-Mech: Rigs, Ace Combat 7 vs PC VR's

Actually, just tell me what's the most visually stunning PC VR game you know or a dedicated PC VR game that isn't a multiplat ?
Edited by CryphicKing - 2/29/16 at 1:35am
    
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post #54 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonarchX View Post

That would be LOL if they specified PC specs below those we consider equal to PS4, like GTX 750 Ti with some i3 CPU, which are the specs that are similar to those of PS4. In this case, its not LOL, because the specs they talked about are way above those of PS4-equivalent specs (GTX 750 Ti + i3) !!! GTX 970 for same performance as PS4? That's some crazy PS4 optimization OR super-crippled PC VR drivers from NVidia...

Then, I wonder if VR is one of the reasons Pascal is going to be that much faster than Maxwell. It will not be a regular jump, but a very steep one. Performance improvements will be insanely huge, especially if you consider DirectX 12!

i3 + 750Ti is VR "Capable" according to SteamVR test tool if I remember correct. The "Capable" is the yellow bar in the middle of the test results between the red (not ready) and green (ready) bars. Which, as far as I understand it means that the hardware can make use of the rift/vive without user starting vomiting after few minutes but is not ideal. AMD equivalent of that hardware would be something on the lines of some 3+ GHz quadcore and 7870. Let me see if I can get the SteamVR test to run on my 7870 (although the cpu I have is atm a lot stronger).

Edit: For some reason it seems my configuration is not willing to run the SteamVR test on my auxiliary GFX card (which is 7870) atm. Regardless of which screen is primary it picks the 390X for driving the test. What was surpirisng for me, however, was, that I get almost 2 points more on the test if my primary screen is connected to the auxiliary card than if the primary card is also driving a primary screen.
Edited by Carniflex - 2/29/16 at 2:02am
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post #55 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fickle Pickle View Post

Getting an Oculus and PSVR to have the best of both worlds. I'm not going to miss out on great console exclusives. Too many "master racers" in here getting so angry just because a console can do something well.

 

 

IIRC Sony confirmed that PSVR is going to work on PC as well. I'm not 100% sure if that was true or just a rumour. If it is true, then you don't have to get both and you will save yourself $600.

   
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post #56 of 99
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Originally Posted by CryphicKing View Post

You need to rewatch those trailers again or learn the definition of CGI, because none of them are. Elaborated gameplay trailer with fancy camera angle? yes. CGI? these visuals aren't pretty enough to qualify CGI. beside, Londo heist trailer is completely played by a person.
Without pulling a VR discussion to PC vs console performance thread, I recommend start follow up on PC performance benchmark on recent released titles, as a matter of fact, most PC gamers are having problems to run recent released games at 1080P/30fps at equivalent console present.

Computer Generated Imagery, i thinks it's a perfectly acceptable term for describing some of those, i don't trust anything publishers show until the game comes out.

We aren't talking about potato PC's though are we? rolleyes.gif It doesn't matter if "most" struggle to run games at 1080p/30 on PC(where you pulled those numbers from i have no idea.) You're missing the point.. Rift/Vive require a 970 or above, what's so difficult to understand?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CryphicKing View Post

Console games are either 30 or 60fps, depend on visual target, but never struggle. as for why PS4 is VR ready? when there's a problem prevent market interest, hardware engineers will be there to find a solution, that's the whole propose of hardware R&D, no end users will care if the final images on headset is refined by re-projecting or upscaled, as long as their eyes perceive great result, the product is going to sell. You really shouldn't worry too much about "how can PS4 do it like PC" when it already can.
PC VR such as occluis rift will have many use beside gaming, the ecosystem is very strong and health from users and investors alike, few of my old colleagues were making apps for SDK2 since 2013 and are about to get rich.

Never struggle? lachen.gif I wont even bother with that..

It doesn't matter if re-projection looks smooth, what matters is how it feels, latency is what makes people nauseous, not how smooth it looks..
Quote:
Originally Posted by CryphicKing View Post

But as competitive as PSVR in gaming? maybe not so much. So far the selection of PC VR " games worries me, the only PC VR's gaming support are from indie studios. To make PC VR successful on PC gaming wise, it will depend on publishers like EA, UBI, SQEX etc. yet none of them willing to pull the trigger before VR proves its worth to them. wait till E3 for update if you wish.
You already saw them but you refuse to remember what you watched or straight up deny the truth, in that case, let me rephrase,

-so far among all VR products, PSVR have most VR dedicated games from every genre I.E games build from ground up aimed to deliver VR only experience. It had ace exclusve every genre which aren't available to PC VR yet.

-PSVR has strongest first party/thrid party developer support,
-Speaking of gaming, PSVR has most massive VR install base(Every PS4 owner is VR ready)

Only indie games eh? So Oculus exclusives like Edge of Nowhere, Lucky's Tale, ADRift, and The Climb + others i can't remember off the top of my head are all indies now? rolleyes.gif

No argument from me on the install base size difference, but it's highly debatable how many of those console owners have the disposable income to drop on a probably $500 peripheral.

Before saying things like "PSVR has the most developer support", why don't you post some facts to back that up?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CryphicKing View Post

-So far, PSVR seem to offer the best games from all genre both dedicated VR games and VR supported games.
whao~ I didn't know you know PSVR better than SCEA's chef R&D engineer. FYI this re-projecting concept won't even made into production without approved by end users, and they are, in case you don't know it already, every PSVR game will be 60/120 or 90/90 in frame rate and refresh rate.
Very native argument, it's almost laughable, Microsoft is arguable the richest company on earth in term of net assets and cash flow, and it never able to pop more exclusives on their gaming console than the little SECA, just because a company is multi billion dollar worth, doesn't mean the board of directors will blindly spend resource on one of their division, especially when they are not in the same field.
This argument has no body and legs, show me how the powers are put into any good use while you clearly failed to provide a single decent looking PC VR game? do you even have slightest knowledge on PC&console's development environment? what substance each VR product provided for gaming?

I'm not talking hypothetical's here.. This is what i mean by Facebook investing; http://www.pcgamesn.com/oculus-vr-is-funding-around-two-dozen-games-exclusive-to-the-oculus-rift How many exclusives are anounced for PSVR currently? That article is also from the middle of 2015, they probably have far more by now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CryphicKing View Post

For example, known games from each genre for PSVR and PC VR.
-FPS PSVR: london hesit, rigs vs PC VR??
-Driving PSVR: DirveClub, GT7 sport and PC VR ??? beside multiplats?
-Honor PSVR: until dawn vs PC VR's ????
-Mech: Rigs, Ace Combat 7 vs PC VR's

Actually, just tell me what's the most visually stunning PC VR game you know or a dedicated PC VR game that isn't a multiplat ?

Again.. Until we actually see real games on the market ,i will hold judgment on the "most stunning". It's only logical to think PC VR titles will look far better.. Look at the power difference of a 970 and a PS4.. Why are you even trying to argue this, lol.

Until we get confirmation of titles and when they are coming out, what's the point of going "this vs that"?
post #57 of 99
This line of corporate speak will work though - on the uneducated masses.
 
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post #58 of 99
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Originally Posted by Gunderman456 View Post

This line of corporate speak will work though - on the uneducated masses.

Do you really think that the masses are paying attention to the "VR/AR Summit" where this was stated in a presentation? I don't, but regardless, I see an embarrassing amount of uneducated posts in this thread...
post #59 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by infranoia View Post

"Same-spec PC" is the loophole there. What is that, an i3 with a Cape Verde GPU?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldozer72 View Post

Yes.

60%....

Using Sony CEO math.rolleyes.gif

Sony didn't make the claims, Developers working on both systems said it (more than one team too).
Quote:
Originally Posted by L36 View Post

I really doubt that since there is no proper way for us to test this claim. They can say 100% for all we know and we would have to take their word for it.

The Epic team moved their game from a i5 /970 rig to the PS4 and it lost 30fps (from 90fps on the PC to 60fps on the PS4).


PSVR has 25% reduction in resolution compared to the other kits, that is something to consider.
 
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Project OP
(13 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD Ryzen R7 1700x Asus x370 crosshair VI Hero ASUS ROG STRIX GeForce GTX 1080 TI G.SKILL TridentZ 16GB  
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Samsung 950 m.2 256GB  Crucial MX300 1TB SATA 2.5 HP DVD1070 Corsair H115i 
CoolingCoolingOSPower
Corsair ML140 Pro White (x7) Gnome Tech 560W/mk SSD Heatsink Windows 10 Home EVGA SuperNOVA 750 G2 80+ GOLD 
CaseOther
Be Quiet! Dark Base Pro 900  CableMod PSU Cabling 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5-4690k  MSI Z97S SLI Krait Edition  Sapphire Nitro+ RX 570 Kingston HyperX 8GB(2x4) Black 
RAMHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Kingston HyperX 8GB(2x4) White Samsung 950 Pro m.2 Lightscribe 24x DVDrw Corsair H100i v2 
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post #60 of 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmgjet View Post

So from that I can take it the extra processing box is doing 60% of the work (up scaling and frame rate converting)

no, it undoes the VR warp made by the PS4 so it can display a normal looking picture to the TV. It also does the 3D audio processing.
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