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[PCPer] PC Gaming Shakeup: Ashes of the Singularity, DX12 and the Microsoft Store - Page 15

post #141 of 362
Quote:
Originally Posted by CataclysmZA View Post

Something tells me that you have no clue what's going on here.

You are quite right, I am quite confused about this faux uproar, when both GPu companies have had plenty of time and heads up on what was coming.. It’s not as if MS plopped this on them out of the blue… choosing to educate their respective customers on it NOW, appears to be defecting blame for their own inaction to come up with a strategy to defend their competitive advantage in this niche…. unless the strategy was for the pc gamers to carry the water for them uphill....
Edited by provost - 3/2/16 at 4:35am
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post #142 of 362
...but wait and see!!! DX 12 we will be gaming like Batman! No more driver overheads, long live FPS....60 FPS that is if you can max it out biggrin.gif. When will you people learn?? Anything pushed by AMD turns out completely different than what people expect biggrin.gif.
 
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post #143 of 362
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by provost View Post

You are quite right, I am quite confused about this faux uproar, when both GPu companies has had plenty of time and heads up on what was coming.. It’s not as if MS plopped this on them out of the blue… choosing to educate their respective customers on it NOW, appears to be defecting blame for their own inaction to come up with a strategy to defend their competitive advantage in this niche….

 

It's possible that Microsoft didn't tell them everything either. This is the same company that used to never share information and ideas between departments that were working on the same project in different sections of the Redmond campus.

 

Looking at the graphs for PCPer's results, it's clear that NVIDIA knew enough to make sure that FlipEx worked in their drivers, and AMD has stated that they're working on getting their implementation working as well. GPUs from both sides are also having problems in Gears of War: UE, and G-Sync doesn't work at all in two shipping DirectX 12 games. It's not possible that NVIDIA just sat on the sidelines waiting for consumers to say something because they've poured lots of money into preparing for DirectX 12. 

 

We'll know a lot more about this on 6 March 2016 when Tom Person and Dan Baker appear on the PCPer 12-hour livestream.

post #144 of 362
I don't believe PC gaming is going anywhere, we'll be ok. If the worst case scenario's in this thread became reality then DX12 would die and Vulkan would come to the fore. DX12 would be an existential threat to the consumer GPU markets for Nv and AMD because who needs to buy a new GPU every year when the games are locked to conslole performance and features for the whole generation. Nv + AMD would have to put resource into making Vulkan more easily usable for game devs, ala Gameworks-type programs. DX12 games would go the same way as GFWL games - unsold.

If MS really did go all out to spoil PC gaming I'd be buying a Sony Playstation anyway.
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post #145 of 362
There's people all over forums blaming Nvidia for this, then there's others blaming AMD and acting like this situation is now a "win" after the whole Async debacle.. Seriously? There's only one entity to blame, and that's MS..

Why does no one want to be named? It's not like developers haven't publicly called out MS before.. Micro reps have also stated that unlocked framerate is possible if the games support it, I'm not sure if they've mentioned overlays, modding etc., in non-Windows Store games. They should hurry up and clarify whatever is going on though, it's spreading like wild fire.

I just don't get why nobody/developers haven't mentioned this could be a thing until now.. mad.gif Unless this was a last minute thing? I doubt Nvidia would of gone along with it if it meant killing GE and G-sync..
Edited by GorillaSceptre - 3/2/16 at 4:52am
post #146 of 362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaker View Post

...but wait and see!!! DX 12 we will be gaming like Batman! No more driver overheads, long live FPS....60 FPS that is if you can max it out biggrin.gif. When will you people learn?? Anything pushed by AMD turns out completely different than what people expect biggrin.gif.


that's not really fair to say if big daddy ms says jump you jump
amd is in no position to do otherwise for that matter maybe nv can kick and scream for a bit but they will conform.

we will never know the real deal on anything but really when could you ever trust ms?
post #147 of 362
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post


I just don't get why nobody/developers haven't mentioned this could be a thing until now.. mad.gif

Perhaps they have signed some kind of aggressive NDA? I have no clue TBH but I have also hard time believing devs were actually not aware of this and it took a third party benchmarker using a very specific tool to drag this "feature" into the daylight screaming and kicking. Or dunno really .. surely someone has looked at the frame timings in his/her engine when implementing DX12 support and figured out why is it acting like this?.
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post #148 of 362
I was pretty excited for DX12 because of things like multi-GPU split-frame rendering and shared VRAM but this kinda stuff is a deal breaker. I'm holding out hope that the entire PC gaming industry will revolt enough to force Windows to change these things but they've shown they truly don't care what people want or don't want, forcing their agenda on everyone and hoping it sticks eventually. Sad to see the path that MS has decided to go down
post #149 of 362
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniflex View Post

Perhaps they have signed some kind of aggressive NDA? I have no clue TBH but I have also hard time believing devs were actually not aware of this and it took a third party benchmarker using a very specific tool to drag this "feature" into the daylight screaming and kicking. Or dunno really .. surely someone has looked at the frame timings in his/her engine when implementing DX12 support and figured out why is it acting like this?.

 

Oxide did this exactly, but their implementation of the FCAT overlay wasn't working properly, something that Ryan at PCPer was helping them fix, and without that neither party would have gotten conclusive data that shows where the problems lie. That's how he found out about these issues in the first place, since other sites were seeing odd results that didn't match up to what they were seeing on the display. I expect that no-one wants to say anything concrete yet because they don't know enough about the why's and the how's of this decision by Microsoft, and it's possible that finding workarounds for these issues will either take time, or never, ever happen. 

 

And at the same time, Microsoft is careful to not draw parallels with Games for Windows Live at this time, so they're probably also working on the PR-safe reply on this issue. We might see something about it direct from the company in about a week's time.

post #150 of 362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carniflex View Post

Perhaps they have signed some kind of aggressive NDA? I have no clue TBH but I have also hard time believing devs were actually not aware of this and it took a third party benchmarker using a very specific tool to drag this "feature" into the daylight screaming and kicking. Or dunno really .. surely someone has looked at the frame timings in his/her engine when implementing DX12 support and figured out why is it acting like this?.

Yeah, either the "insiders" are wrong, some update has broken something/this stuff is a recent development, or everybody just kept their mouths shut.. Developers want this type of system though.. So i wouldn't be surprised if it's the last option. mad.gif

If it was an NDA then why would NV go along with it(or AMD for that matter)? It renders GE useless and makes G-sync monitors pointless..
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