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[TweakTown] AMD's next-gen Polaris GPUs to be used in Apple desktops and notebooks - Page 8

post #71 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111 View Post

Apple OS strength and efficiency are what caused better battery life on top of the intel processor. AMD's graphic chip isn't used when running most things, particularly battery tests.

The graphics of the macbook retina was the main criticism against it in reviews. It just was't much of an improvement for gaming. From single digit to 30 percent difference in performance.

If AMD stuck with Nvidia, they could have put a gtx 950m or 960m which would have been 30 or 60% faster respectively.

Add in that it throttles when running windows for gaming and it clear, the better solution would have been Nvidia.


Unfortunately, the MacBook Pro is affected by a very annoying problem when you use Windows, which results in frame rate drops during prolonged gaming sessions: The Radeon GPU cannot maintain its core clock of 800 MHz. The clock often fluctuates between 675 and 725 MHz, but occasionally drops to 400 MHz. The resulting stutters are very annoying, particularly when you play shooting games, and seem to be caused by thermal throttling when the core temperature reaches around 74 °C (~165 °F).


http://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-MacBook-Pro-Retina-15-inch-2015-05.143922.0.html

No one in their right mind would question Nvidia superiority of maxwell vs AMD latest for laptops.
How exactly are you going to cool those in a macbook? Secondly, the macbook is not and has never been a serious gaming device judging by the list of mobile GPUs used in macbooks as far as I can remember. The 2014 macbook had a 750M while the 2012 had a 650M. These chips are very identical in performance and power consumption.
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post #72 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Olivon View Post

Not a problem for nVidia because they don't need Apple money and their low-profit scheme.]

you know i guess nvidia can be pretty happy not having you in their company because you are that kind of type that says "yea no dont need that look what i have"...nobody is standing still everything is changing in 5 years it can be the other way around...rolleyes.gif
post #73 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tobiman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111 View Post

Apple OS strength and efficiency are what caused better battery life on top of the intel processor. AMD's graphic chip isn't used when running most things, particularly battery tests.

The graphics of the macbook retina was the main criticism against it in reviews. It just was't much of an improvement for gaming. From single digit to 30 percent difference in performance.

If AMD stuck with Nvidia, they could have put a gtx 950m or 960m which would have been 30 or 60% faster respectively.

Add in that it throttles when running windows for gaming and it clear, the better solution would have been Nvidia.


Unfortunately, the MacBook Pro is affected by a very annoying problem when you use Windows, which results in frame rate drops during prolonged gaming sessions: The Radeon GPU cannot maintain its core clock of 800 MHz. The clock often fluctuates between 675 and 725 MHz, but occasionally drops to 400 MHz. The resulting stutters are very annoying, particularly when you play shooting games, and seem to be caused by thermal throttling when the core temperature reaches around 74 °C (~165 °F).


http://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-MacBook-Pro-Retina-15-inch-2015-05.143922.0.html

No one in their right mind would question Nvidia superiority of maxwell vs AMD latest for laptops.
How exactly are you going to cool those in a macbook? Secondly, the macbook is not and has never been a serious gaming device judging by the list of mobile GPUs used in macbooks as far as I can remember. The 2014 macbook had a 750M while the 2012 had a 650M. These chips are very identical in performance and power consumption.

I logged in to correct your ignorance.

According to notebookcheck:
The M370X actually manages an advantage of 34% over the GT 750M in 3DMark Fire Strike, which is the best simulation of the demands of current games. A GeForce GTX 950M or GTX 960M, which are in a similar TDP range of 50 up to 60 watts, however, are even 30 or 60% faster, respectively

http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-R9-M370X.142763.0.html
http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-950M.138026.0.html

What would you rather have, 640 GCN or 640 Maxwell cores? 640 Maxwell cores and a i5 4210M let's me play NFS 2015 on medium settings 1080p at 40fps.
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post #74 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLAWNOOB View Post

I logged in to correct your ignorance.

According to notebookcheck:
The M370X actually manages an advantage of 34% over the GT 750M in 3DMark Fire Strike, which is the best simulation of the demands of current games. A GeForce GTX 950M or GTX 960M, which are in a similar TDP range of 50 up to 60 watts, however, are even 30 or 60% faster, respectively

http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-R9-M370X.142763.0.html
http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-950M.138026.0.html

What would you rather have, 640 GCN or 640 Maxwell cores? 640 Maxwell cores and a i5 4210M let's me play NFS 2015 on medium settings 1080p at 40fps.
If the 950M consumes the same power then it is definitely better, hands down for gaming but who buys a macbook pro for gaming?
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post #75 of 117
It's not about gaming, it's about how much power you're getting per dollar.
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post #76 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tobiman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLAWNOOB View Post

I logged in to correct your ignorance.

According to notebookcheck:
The M370X actually manages an advantage of 34% over the GT 750M in 3DMark Fire Strike, which is the best simulation of the demands of current games. A GeForce GTX 950M or GTX 960M, which are in a similar TDP range of 50 up to 60 watts, however, are even 30 or 60% faster, respectively

http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-R9-M370X.142763.0.html
http://www.notebookcheck.net/NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-950M.138026.0.html

What would you rather have, 640 GCN or 640 Maxwell cores? 640 Maxwell cores and a i5 4210M let's me play NFS 2015 on medium settings 1080p at 40fps.
If the 950M consumes the same power then it is definitely better, hands down for gaming but who buys a macbook pro for gaming?

You can use it for facebook all I care. You could also put a 8600M GT in there, cause who needs performance anyways?
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post #77 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtcn77 View Post

Really? I don't think 950M substantially elevates the options table any higher.950M, M370X.
If power consumption is similar then it makes sense to go with the 950M.
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post #78 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by PlugSeven View Post

Isn't the Metal API designed around GCN, so going Polaris is/was the logical route for Apple?

It doesn't seem that way. Metal was introduced on Rogue, and also works on GCN and Kepler (edit: and Ivy Bridge and better) since 10.11, so it seems to be pretty arch-agnostic (I think it only requires roughly GLES3/GL4 or DX11 and OpenCL 1.2, looking at the specs of the supported GPUs). It could be a better match in some less obvious way, eg. Polaris' memory sharing fits Metal's representation of shared memory better or Apple likes GCN's compute capabilities more or something, but it doesn't seem that basic support is much of a concern either way.

I think it's more likely that Apple and AMD already have pretty good relations; pretty much all dGPUs in Macs for several years have been AMD, other than a couple generations of iMac, so Apple may have just decided to keep up that relationship. And who knows, maybe Polaris will actually turn out to be more efficient than Pascal wink.gif
Edited by Gungnir - 4/21/16 at 8:34pm
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post #79 of 117
Anyone posting that Apple's decision to use polaris is driven solely by price is deluded.

1. AMD and Apple are partners in multiple different software and hardware open standards. Nvidia uses closed standards, and Apple is never willing to get out of the driver seat, they are all about control over their own platform. Nvidia has, in the past, curbed that control. Apple does not liked to messed with, so it makes sense that they would pick AMD over Nvidia

2. Apple almost always picks the more efficient option of GPUs, the only exception being the 290m on the desktop

3. Apple prefers to have products that are stable, and are more focused on user experience rather than numbers alone.

So really, we can't speculate on polaris performance, we can only speculate how power efficient polaris will be. From what we know, it will be very, very power efficient
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post #80 of 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buris View Post

Anyone posting that Apple's decision to use polaris is driven solely by price is deluded.

1. AMD and Apple are partners in multiple different software and hardware open standards. Nvidia uses closed standards, and Apple is never willing to get out of the driver seat, they are all about control over their own platform. Nvidia has, in the past, curbed that control. Apple does not liked to messed with, so it makes sense that they would pick AMD over Nvidia

2. Apple almost always picks the more efficient option of GPUs, the only exception being the 290m on the desktop

3. Apple prefers to have products that are stable, and are more focused on user experience rather than numbers alone.

So really, we can't speculate on polaris performance, we can only speculate how power efficient polaris will be. From what we know, it will be very, very power efficient

 

To be quite honest, your post is quite deluded.

 

  1. You might not believe this, but all three of those companies you mentioned use open standards and designs, particularly when it comes to GPUs and graphics drivers. Not to mention that when it comes to Apple devices, they do modification to graphics drivers in the end. It has utterly nothing to do with fully open source vs fully closed source. In fact, the largest single reason is this: Mark Papermaster is the CTO of AMD, and he used to be the SVP of Apple's Devices Hardware Engineering team (quite a high up position). So Apple and AMD have a very good working relationship with each other.
  2. If they picked the more efficient option of GPUs, they would have gone with Kepler/Maxwell, instead of Pitcairn/Tahiti/Fiji. I'm just saying this as a matter of fact.
  3. If they preferred products that are more stable, you have to be truly deluded. Neither vendor is stable. If you think AMD has products that are stable, you are deluded. Just like those that think Nvidia has products that are truly stable. Although if you bothered actually getting on Apple forums instead of here on OCN, you would've seen the multitude of users complaining about the instability of AMD's cards in Apple's recent products (and no, I'm not actually joking).
  4. And I had to comment on your AMD focused on user experience. I'm not sure what world your comment is in, but that has been the least focus of their company until, very, very, very recently.

 

I don't doubt Polaris will be efficient. And the next time I upgrade, I'll do the exact same thing I normally do, which is try both the AMD and Nvidia equivalent GPUs, and pick which one provided the better experience for my rig. Lately for me, that has been Nvidia from both an objective and subjective opinion. Who knows if the next gen will be different. I'm not beholden to one manufacturer over the other (unlike 99% of the people here on OCN). However, I really hate posts like yours which are almost 100% bull.

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