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[Various] GTX 1080 Reviews - Page 559  

post #5581 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by 44TZL View Post

True. Hopefully those 1.3 monitors will show up soon enough. Still Ti users could probably wait it out until the 1080Ti.

For sure. The new monitors will probably come out right about the same time as the Ti/Titan. I could wait for the Titan/Ti but the 1080 prices are already pushing what I am willing to pay for something like a video card.
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue1512 View Post

1080 is impressive but the lack of Async hardware support is a real deal breaker. Buying 1080 at this moment means fueling nVidia in their effort to delay Dx12/Vulkan like what happened with Dx10. It just doesn't feel right.

And in the near future when their Async capable cards come out, all the optimization will be focused on Async and you will find your card in the obsolete section. Paying $600 for that doesn't make any sense.

Not that I am even remotely convinced that async compute is anything anyone should be basing their purchasing decisions on, it won't be pascal. Which means that at best it would be Volta and by that time I would be buying a new card anyways (but hopefully AMD by then).
Edited by bigjdubb - 6/15/16 at 4:09pm
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post #5582 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue1512 View Post

1080 is impressive but the lack of Async hardware support is a real deal breaker. Buying 1080 at this moment means fueling nVidia in their effort to delay Dx12/Vulkan like what happened with Dx10. It just doesn't feel right.

And in the near future when their Async capable cards come out, all the optimization will be focused on Async and you will find your card in the obsolete section. Paying $600 for that doesn't make any sense.

Why is Async some mystical Mojo that everyone is pandering over? It may be a better way for a GPU to perform but it clearly isn't a big enough advantage to matter right now as AMD cards are still struggling (yes struggling) to keep up with Nvidia cards. The only real benefit I see from getting an AMD card is a more long term support system from them. But why would I want to buy a GPU that will eventually overtake the competitors card in 2 years when I'll just upgrade before it happens? I would love to see Vega come out in October just to see this whole Async nonsense blow up in everyones face just for the matter that I'm sick of seeing it used as a point of argument when we haven't even seen it give major performance increases.
post #5583 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brimlock View Post

Why is Async some mystical Mojo that everyone is pandering over? It may be a better way for a GPU to perform but it clearly isn't a big enough advantage to matter right now as AMD cards are still struggling (yes struggling) to keep up with Nvidia cards. The only real benefit I see from getting an AMD card is a more long term support system from them. I would love to see Vega come out in October just to see this whole Async nonsense blow up with everyones face just for the matter that I'm sick of seeing it used as a point of argument when we haven't even seen it give major performance increases.

There is enough talk about Async's advantage, especially in CPU bound games so I won't eleborate it here. BUT...

Do you want the technology to advance or just stay in nVidia's safezone? I prefer the former.
post #5584 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue1512 View Post

There is enough talk about Async's advantage, especially in CPU bound games so I won't eleborate it here. BUT...

Do you want the technology to advance or just stay in nVidia's safezone? I prefer the former.

I doubt Nvidia is putting off Async computing just to stagnate technology. For one that doesn't help them against AMD at all as eventually AMD would easily get a leg up on Nvidia. Also Nvidia might not even adapt Async, its possible they could just adapt something similar fashion to it.

It's not like I'm saying there are no advantages to Async or its a useless technology. But its clearly not that impactful (YET), as it hasn't really helped AMD get any of the market back.

If Nvidia stagnates the market then theres virtually zero reason for anyone to upgrade to w/e stronger card they put out. I don't consider arguments like these for reasons that in a real world scenario it doesn't make sense. What I've seen on these forums is people come up with a lot of "What if" scenarios and then run with it like they just discovered El Dorado or the next signs of the Apocalypse.
Edited by Brimlock - 6/15/16 at 5:22pm
post #5585 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brimlock View Post

I doubt Nvidia is putting off Async computing just to stagnate technology. For one that doesn't help them against AMD at all as eventually AMD would easily get a leg up on Nvidia. Also Nvidia might not even adapt Async, its possible they could just adapt something similar fashion to it. It's not like I'm saying there are no advantages to Async or its a useless technology. But its clearly not that impactful (YET), as it hasn't really helped AMD get any of the market back. If Nvidia stagnates the market then theres virtually zero reason for anyone to upgrade to w/e stronger card they put out. I don't consider arguments like these for reasons that in a real world scenario it doesn't make sense. What I've seen on these forums is people come up with a lot of "What if" scenarios and then run with it like they just discovered El Dorado or the next signs of the Apocalypse.

nVidia did do their dirty work to delay Dx10 until they figured out their countermeasure as Dx11 tessellation and ambient occlusion. History is repeating itself. They has been trying to do the same thing to Dx12 with their Gameworks strategy. And the release of Pascal with no hardware Async is a further confirmation.
post #5586 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue1512 View Post

nVidia did do their dirty work to delay Dx10 until they figured out their countermeasure as Dx11 tessellation and ambient occlusion. History is repeating itself. They has been trying to do the same thing to Dx12 with their Gameworks strategy. And the release of Pascal with no hardware Async is a further confirmation.

Again Nvidia can't control the market if AMD could better utilize things. You can call Nvidia the bad guy all you want but if there really were better solutions then why hasn't the Lord and Savior AMD come to fix the problem that people keep crying about? If Async was going to be so much better, then why is AMD focusing on releasing weaker cards as opposed to trumping Nvidia with a stronger card running on Async? This would be the perfect opportunity for them to do just that. They could always bring in cut down cards for cheaper prices to try and bring in more people into higher end PC gaming at a later time.

Even when Vega comes around and puts down current Nvidia cards we still have big pascal coming along at some point and I'm willing to bet it still won't have Async implemented. I'll also bet you that it will stand toe to toe with Vega and we won't see who the winner is until it happens. The more likely case at this time is that Async could potentially hurt the performance of Nvidia cards. No one knows why its not on the cards yet or at all. All you have is speculation and doubt against the company and choose what you think is the most likely scenario which is that Nvidia is holding everything back. But I don't see any signs of that being true or false. Nvidia isn't holding AMDs hands behind their back. NVidia is doing better because they're good at what they do, even if you hate them.

Also the only people who would hurt from such accusations if they were true would be Nvidia customers. No one else would be effected because both companies support DX12 and doesn't stop any Dev team from providing the proper support to either company. AMD would clearly have the advantage over Nvidia every time for having Async. It would be a massacre as you wouldn't be able to hide the facts. The internet spreads information like wild fire and as soon as things get into the hands of the people Nvidia can't stop anything. Their reputation would be burned.

I'm going to reiterate. If AMD could do better they would. But they can't right now which is why they are trying to get market back by putting out cheaper cards at already existing performance. Those cards are only good to upgrade to if you have a weaker card and or are wanting to have a better experience in VR. Everyone else might as well skip Polaris.
Edited by Brimlock - 6/15/16 at 4:48pm
post #5587 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by jprovido View Post



and I thought I was the only one going for the looks. almost all the 1080's don't fit my system. that's why I ended up with the evga ftw I like how simple it looks. I really hope I can turn off the led's on the card itself. I hate leds/unneccessary lights

I wouldn't really say I'm going for looks. Truth be told I can't even see my PC when I'm sitting at my desk, and have to get down on my knees in a corner to see inside the small window on my case.



LED lights are useless at best and a distraction at worst since I normally play at night with the lights off. It's just lights that I really don't need.


Really the appearance shouldn't matter to me at all since I'll almost never see the card, but for some strange reason I'm still considering spending the extra money for the Gaming X just to match the rest of the system.
post #5588 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brimlock View Post

Again Nvidia can't control the market if AMD could better utilize things. You can call Nvidia the bad guy all you want but if there really were better solutions then why hasn't the Lord and Savior AMD come to fix the problem that people keep crying about? If Async was going to be so much better, then why is AMD focusing on releasing weaker cards as opposed to trumping Nvidia with a stronger card running on Async? This would be the perfect opportunity for them to do just that. They could always bring in cut down cards for cheaper prices to try and bring in more people into higher end PC gaming at a later time.

Even when Vega comes around and puts down current Nvidia cards we still have big pascal coming along at some point and I'm willing to bet it still won't have Async implemented. I'll also bet you that it will stand toe to toe with Vega and we won't see who the winner is until it happens. The more likely case at this time is that Async could potentially hurt the performance of Nvidia cards. No one knows why its not on the cards yet or at all. All you have is speculation and doubt against the company and choose what you think is the most likely scenario which is that Nvidia is holding everything back. But I don't see any signs of that being true or false. Nvidia isn't holding AMDs hands behind their back. NVidia is doing better because they're good at what they do, even if you hate them.

Friendly note that I have been only talking about nVidia, why you keep bringing other name in your argument?

As I said 1080 is impressive, and the lack of Async support is covered by brute force. But, why not embrace the new technology for performance? 1080 brought nothing new instead of the higher clock expected from the new node. Its performance crown only prolongs nVidia's safezone in Dx11 and makes Dx12 as trivial as possible.

And in another scenario if Dx12/Vulkan success despite of nVidia's effort, with their resource they will quickly answer with a Async capable card and optimize the hell out of it. The obsolete 1080 at that time will become a poor legacy.

That's why 1080 without Async doesn't make sense.
Edited by blue1512 - 6/15/16 at 5:01pm
post #5589 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by blue1512 View Post

Friendly note that I have been only talking about nVidia, why you keep bringing other name in your argument?

As I said 1080 is impressive, and the lack of Async support is covered by brute force. But, why not embrace the new technology for performance? 1080 brought nothing new instead of the higher clock expected from the new node. Its performance crown only prolongs nVidia's safezone in Dx11 and makes Dx12 as trivial as possible.

And in another scenario if Dx12/Vulkan success despite of nVidia's effort, with their resource they will quickly answer with a Async capable card and optimize the hell out of it. The obsolete 1080 at that time will become a poor legacy.

That's why 1080 without Async doesn't make sense.

What evidence do you have that Nvidia is stagnating anything? You don't have evidence as to whether or not Async would improve performance on Nvidia cards. Also how am I supposed to argue Async without mentioning AMD? The only people utilizing Async. To say that Nvidia is trying to hold back Vulkan/DX12 without any evidence is purely a tinfoil hat conspiracy. AMD has Async, AMD supports Vulkan and DX12, we have games that can be run on different API's. There is nothing stopping DX12/Vulkan from pushing forward aside from the support from devs.

Both API's are brand new, we haven't had enough time with them for you to decide that they are being held back. But from my point of view we are getting a plethora of games utilizing DX12.

There are already a small handful of games out right now and clearly more to come soon enough. Mind you that directx 12 isn't even a year old and its being used in games already. That doesn't sound like stagnation or holding back, and Nvidia cards will support DX12 as far back as Fermi architecture which goes back as far as the 400 series cards.
Edited by Brimlock - 6/15/16 at 5:22pm
post #5590 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brimlock View Post

What evidence do you have that Nvidia is stagnating anything? You don't have evidence as to whether or not Async would improve performance on Nvidia cards. Also how am I supposed to argue Async without mentioning AMD? The only people utilizing Async. To say that Nvidia is trying to hold back Vulkan/DX12 without any evidence is purely a tinfoil hat conspiracy. AMD has Async, AMD supports Vulkan and DX12, we have games that can be run on different API's. There is nothing stopping DX12/Vulkan from pushing forward aside from the support from devs

I agree with your point about the devs. However it was already addressed my point about the Gameworks.

nVidia's effort on Dx11 includes the Gameworks strategy and a brute force flagship that make the Async capable card look pale in comparison. They are late to the game with Async so they defended their thrones by prolongs Dx11, that's how they stagnates the technology. Which evidence you want though, when it's clear that nVidia has not released anything related to Vulkan/Dx12.
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