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post #5851 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

To be fair the only difference between the 8800GTX and 8800Ultra was the clock speeds and price! They both were full chips.

so thats the case what about the X850 XT and PE

Entry-level X800 SE, X800, X800 GT
Mid-range X800 GTO, X800 PRO, X800 XL, X850 PRO
High-end X800 XT, X850 XT
Enthusiast X800 XT PE, X850 XT PE


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon_X800_Series

even the 9xxx series

Entry-level 9550
Mid-range 9500, 9600
High-end 9700
Enthusiast 9800

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon_9000_Series
post #5852 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by zealord View Post

funny thing is the first Titan (1000$ 2013) wasn't even the full chip applaud.gif

Very true. I have to give Nvidia a hand because they know how to tier and market their cards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zGunBLADEz View Post

so thats the case what about the X850 XT and PE

Entry-level X800 SE, X800, X800 GT
Mid-range X800 GTO, X800 PRO, X800 XL, X850 PRO
High-end X800 XT, X850 XT
Enthusiast X800 XT PE, X850 XT PE


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon_X800_Series

even the 9xxx series

Entry-level 9550
Mid-range 9500, 9600
High-end 9700
Enthusiast 9800

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radeon_9000_Series

Wait, looking now not sure I understand why you linked AMD cards when were talking about Nvidia cards?
Edited by criminal - 6/21/16 at 1:23pm
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post #5853 of 6175
As far as I'm concerned it's like this in my mind for any given architecture in the GTX family, or at least used to be:

  • Gx100/110 - High end.
  • Gx100/110 cut down - Mid-range.
  • Gx104 - Low end.



Obviously prices of processes and R&D change, etcetera... but that's how i think about it.

To me what Nvidia did was pretty simple, they made an extra tier of chip starting from the bottom up. With the 500 series they made GF116-400 in the 550TI. The 600 series didn't even have a full chip, they used GK104 cut down to different degrees from the 680 all the way down to the 660.. This is when AMD really dropped the ball.

So from the 600 series forward, Nvidia (having a much stronger brand compared to their competition, and being able to deploy low-end chips to compete with AMD's high-end ones) were able to do the smart thing, which is make as much money as possible.

Cue the enthusiast segment, based on the chips that used to be sold in the high-end segment..

So from the 700 series to present we now have:

  • Gx100/200/110 - Enthusiast. $$
  • Gx104/204 - High-end. The 780 was the exception here.
  • Gx104/204 cut - Mid-range.
  • Gx106/107/206 - Low-end.

The 106/107/206 are complete garbage, and imo do not belong in the GTX family of products (They should be the in the GT family). They are the reason why mainstream consumers have had such poor products to choose from, and also why very few ever recommend them. It's best to save up more and get what these days are called "Mid-range".. All Nvidia did was put a class of chips that do not belong in the GTX family, and added the enthusiast segment in order to make the "low-end" - "High-end" segments far more lucrative. "It's just good business" redface.gif

I guess what I'm saying is damn the 600 series... and their stupid "Boost".. tongue.gif
Edited by GorillaSceptre - 6/21/16 at 1:22pm
post #5854 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by moustang View Post

They haven't released a 1080 ti or a 1080 based Titan have they?

And if you're going to add cards that are 9+ months away from release to your list why did you exclude all of the ones that are currently on the market right now?

1. Titan
2. x80ti
3. x80
4. Titan Z
5. x70
6. 980t1
7. x60
8. 980
9. 970
10. x50
11. 960
12. 950

Where does it fall into that list?

Look, the ONLY way you can make this a "midrange" card is by both comparing it to cards that don't exist and ignoring cards that do exist, right? In otherwords, you have to be REALLY selective and do a lot of twisting facts around to make your argument work. You can't look at all of the products on the shelves and say it's midrange because it's not. You have to pick and choose what you do and don't want to include, and you play this pick and choose game because you can't admit you're wrong.

*sigh*
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnek View Post

True but 1180 Titan and 1080 Titan would belong to different product stacks.

How about let's just go with where the SKU ends up being within the pertinent product stack so it avoids all these issues.

Why are you mixing and mashing Kepler with Maxwell? When we (or at least I) say something is mid-range, I mean within its own family.

Although yes you're right, we're indeed making the assumption that 1080 Ti and 1080 Titan will be a thing - but why shouldn't we? Since Fermi and without fail, nVidia has pursued this big-medium-small die strategy. There's always the big daddy chip (xx0), the medium chip (xx4), and the small chip (xx6) along with a bunch of other even smaller entry level chips.

So, hopefully this will make it crystal clear: within the Pascal family, GP104 will inevitably end up being the medium die, hence "mid-range chip".
post #5855 of 6175
post #5856 of 6175
enthusiast = only if i hit the lottery

high end = a month of beans and rice

mid range = a paycheck

low end = after paying bills
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post #5857 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

Very true. I have to give Nvidia a hand because they know how to tier and market their cards.
Wait, looking now not sure I understand why you linked AMD cards when were talking about Nvidia cards?

Comparison purposes XD
post #5858 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

Very true. I have to give Nvidia a hand because they know how to tier and market their cards.

Nvidias is absolutely brilliant. What Nvidia does good :

- giving people the absolute minimum they need. GTX 680 with 2GB VRAM was barely enough so people needed to upgrade 1 year later. 384 bit bus is barely enough for high end cards. The GTX 1080 even sells well with 256 bit bus GDDR5X. Geforce GPUS do suck at DX12? No problem there are not many DX12 games around. Let your customers upgrade more often.
- figuring out pricesily what GPU they have to release when to make people buy it. Better than your last gen high end cards, but not too much. 20-30% is the perfect amount to make the loyal fanbase think about going for a GTX 1080 even from a 980 Ti or 980.
- not letting bad PR hurt you. Nvidia never apologized for 3.5GB fiasko or gameworks or gimping intetionally. They just keep silent because they know people forget.
- marketing. making big claims. pleasing the high end GPU gamer crowd, but also the blind razer fanboy who likes green LEDS.


I know my post sounds like hating on Nvidia, but in reality it is praising. Nvidia does release "good" GPUs and they are ahead of the competition, but their true strength is fooling the customers. It is as brilliant as Beats by Dr. Dre or even Apple.

If both AMD and Nvidia released basically the same GPU. Same price, Same specs, same driver, same power usage, absolutely same feature set ... etc. etc. everything the same Nvidia would still sell atleast three times as many GPUs as AMD does.
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post #5859 of 6175
Quote:
Originally Posted by zealord View Post

Nvidias is absolutely brilliant. What Nvidia does good :

- giving people the absolute minimum they need. GTX 680 with 2GB VRAM was barely enough so people needed to upgrade 1 year later. 384 bit bus is barely enough for high end cards. The GTX 1080 even sells well with 256 bit bus GDDR5X. Geforce GPUS do suck at DX12? No problem there are not many DX12 games around. Let your customers upgrade more often.
- figuring out pricesily what GPU they have to release when to make people buy it. Better than your last gen high end cards, but not too much. 20-30% is the perfect amount to make the loyal fanbase think about going for a GTX 1080 even from a 980 Ti or 980.
- not letting bad PR hurt you. Nvidia never apologized for 3.5GB fiasko or gameworks or gimping intetionally. They just keep silent because they know people forget.
- marketing. making big claims. pleasing the high end GPU gamer crowd, but also the blind razer fanboy who likes green LEDS.


I know my post sounds like hating on Nvidia, but in reality it is praising. Nvidia does release "good" GPUs and they are ahead of the competition, but their true strength is fooling the customers. It is as brilliant as Beats by Dr. Dre or even Apple.

If both AMD and Nvidia released basically the same GPU. Same price, Same specs, same driver, same power usage, absolutely same feature set ... etc. etc. everything the same Nvidia would still sell atleast three times as many GPUs as AMD does.

Personally, I read your list as praise. Sounds like a good marketing strategy to me. Afterall, they are a business and not a public service.
post #5860 of 6175
4 pages of arguing over low-end/midrange/high-end.... kookoo.gif

This thread is insane.
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